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jerrydecoy
Well-known member
For the right programs with no fat attached??? Yes!
Another Shooting & the Politics of it
- Thread starter Jean-Luc Picard
- Start date
For the right programs with no fat attached??? Yes!
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jerrydecoy
Well-known member
Interesting read! I think this needs to happen in all schools!
https://www.kxly.com/news/national-...up-for-free-concealed-weapons-class/704793662
https://www.kxly.com/news/national-...up-for-free-concealed-weapons-class/704793662
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Jaynelson
Well-known member
Then here’s what you do...
Tax the hell out of guns - making them much more expensive. Cuts out a lot of buyers and generates a bunch of new tax revenue. Funnel that money and a bunch more in to publicly funded mental health programs and institutions for at risk youth. Jam as many weird *** kids through the programs as possible.
Between less guns (organically), and the mental health programs (which would both help people, and identify people who have high chances of violence, etc) - you have at least attempted to address the 2 major issues that have the highest likelihood of improving this issue. Both “sides” also get a pretty even and decent compromise. No new regs specifically needed, 2nd amendment untouched for anyone who cares.
Mic drop. Next
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jerrydecoy
Well-known member
Where’s that “bunch more” money coming from? Should law abiding gun owners eat the brunt of it... And why? It’s not a sin tax!!! As a citizen I don’t mind sharing the burden but as a gun owner I don’t think I should be made responsible! Aren’t you essentially suggesting more gun control? Maybe every American can share the burden?
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Jaynelson
Well-known member
Jack taxes on guns way up....generate money....use money to help attempt to curb violence and keep gun control off the table. If you want it bad enough you’ll pay, and if you dont, you won’t. Just like any taxes or insurances....the good guys pay most of the bill. I’ve never had a car accident, but my car insurance costs what it does because of all the people who have.
Schools became gun free zones in the early 1990s. Since then school shootings seem to have become more frequent. These murderers are cowards so gun free zones (schools, malls, movie theaters) are attractive to them. Not to many mass shootings happening at the police stations or NRA offices. We need to protect our children the same way we protect literally everything else of value in this country. Obviously I’m not advocating children having guns but some plain clothed armed cops cruising the halls and interacting with the kids doesn’t seem like the worst idea to me.
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jerrydecoy
Well-known member
Taxing the chit out of guns is gun control. You said it yourself... “fewer buyers”. You are simplifying the situation!!! How bout we tax the chit outta all the Alberta beef I see getting hauled down here in Idaho?
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Jaynelson
Well-known member
Call it whatever you want....that’s a pretty legit idea. Everyone would pay, new gun taxes would just help and also give something to the “left” who ideally want MUCH more gun control than that. Probably the best compromise I’ve heard yet if I do say so myself. You’re welcome America
Sorry Jaynels son, that's a sin tax.
Exercising our 2nd ammendment rights should not EVER be treated as a sin.
If we as a country benefit from a specific program or practice, we can ALL share in the cost.
Your troubleshooting method is sound, and our lawmakers should be practicing the same processes, but your idea is too flawed to consider.
Exercising our 2nd ammendment rights should not EVER be treated as a sin.
If we as a country benefit from a specific program or practice, we can ALL share in the cost.
Your troubleshooting method is sound, and our lawmakers should be practicing the same processes, but your idea is too flawed to consider.
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Jaynelson
Well-known member
You can excersize all day long....just gotta pay to help offset the additional risk that comes along with every new gun introduced in to the food chain. Just like additional taxes on tobacco go toward offsetting the additional health care costs of tobacco use up here. Both sides give up exactly what they want, in order to have actual progress. Money would come from general tax revenue as well, of course.
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jerrydecoy
Well-known member
I sure appreciate the attempt to solve the problem in a few posts on a snowmobile forum....This won’t fly!! Can we also tax all the effed up parents out there who raise these little monsters ? Theyre more of the risk then my guns! Why is it so hard for people to understand that the gun itself is not the risk! It’s the people! I’ll say it again... you will never drop the brunt of this tax on law-abiding gun owners! Everybody can share the burden equally and even then... good luck! To try and make a correlation between tobacco and owning guns is absurd!!!
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Jaynelson
Well-known member
Every time school shootings happen you hear a lot of “I don’t know the solution but we sure need to do something about it.” That’s a totally incorrect statement. If you eliminated all guns today, you would eliminate school shootings and the vast majority of deaths in school from violent acts. Not all, but most. Guns are the best, easiest and most convenient tool for the job. Just as if you eliminated all cars and trucks tomorrow, you would eliminate all car crashes. You wouldn’t eliminate all transportation related deaths...but you would sure as hell get rid of the vast majority.
Given neither of those scenarios are realistic....you need solutions with compromise and that attack the issues from multiple angles. That is...if you’re genuinely looking for a solution. If not...might as well carry on as is.
Given neither of those scenarios are realistic....you need solutions with compromise and that attack the issues from multiple angles. That is...if you’re genuinely looking for a solution. If not...might as well carry on as is.
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jerrydecoy
Well-known member
Your solution is not a viable solution! If your theory of taxing works then why is it that you have more tobacco related deaths in Canada then in the USA? Why is your DUI fatality rate so high? You guys have taxed the chit out of alcohol!!!
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Jaynelson
Well-known member
The tobacco taxation helps offset the health care costs tobacco users cause the public. Tobacco isn’t the problem...it’s an inanimate object, people and their usage habits are. Sounds familiar. It’s an addictive substance tho, so that is a variable not present in the gun situation. Do they use the tax revenue to try and curb tobacco use? Not much that I’ve seen. That goes back to your point of any gov program needing to be focused and well run....not sure I’d look to Canada for those things, unfortunate.
Gun control & health care.
I'm for the most part against gun control, and wierdly enough, for a single payer healthcare system. In order for health care to be fair & decent, either the government needs to completely get out of it (not going to happen) or the government needs to absorb it. I don't necessarily think its the best solution, but I lived in Canada for a couple of years & it was nice to just be able to go to the doctor if I needed to without having to worry about insurance garbage. As it is, in the states, even with insurance, I don't go to the doctor unless I absolutely have to. When I have a $30 copay to see the doctor to get a prescription for the same thing I've been on for 10 years every year, its a waste of my money & his time. To say nothing about the absurdly high cost of health care in general.
I'm for the most part against gun control, and wierdly enough, for a single payer healthcare system. In order for health care to be fair & decent, either the government needs to completely get out of it (not going to happen) or the government needs to absorb it. I don't necessarily think its the best solution, but I lived in Canada for a couple of years & it was nice to just be able to go to the doctor if I needed to without having to worry about insurance garbage. As it is, in the states, even with insurance, I don't go to the doctor unless I absolutely have to. When I have a $30 copay to see the doctor to get a prescription for the same thing I've been on for 10 years every year, its a waste of my money & his time. To say nothing about the absurdly high cost of health care in general.
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Gun tax?
Personally, I think your idea has merit. A gun is not a "necessity." It may be a right, but so is the right to drink alcohol if you are over 21 in the states.
The whole "sin-tax" argument is a moot point. It's something some people buy a lot of & others don't. You aren't issued a gun at birth, or when you turn 12 or 21.
It's expensive & time consuming to get a CDL. Why shouldn't it be expensive & time consuming to qualify to own & use a gun? They both can be potentially deadly.
Yes, it is a tool for self defense & yes, I think it should be accessible to the common citizenry, all the way up to AR-15s. But its a tool that for the most part is used recreationally. And most people who can afford guns & ammo, could afford to pay a little more for their guns & ammo. I'm never going to be one who would be paying through the nose on this because I'm never going to own more than a couple of guns.
I do my part by donating blood every 2 months. I get warm fuzzies. And cookies. I have an appointment this Friday in fact.
Personally, I think your idea has merit. A gun is not a "necessity." It may be a right, but so is the right to drink alcohol if you are over 21 in the states.
The whole "sin-tax" argument is a moot point. It's something some people buy a lot of & others don't. You aren't issued a gun at birth, or when you turn 12 or 21.
It's expensive & time consuming to get a CDL. Why shouldn't it be expensive & time consuming to qualify to own & use a gun? They both can be potentially deadly.
Yes, it is a tool for self defense & yes, I think it should be accessible to the common citizenry, all the way up to AR-15s. But its a tool that for the most part is used recreationally. And most people who can afford guns & ammo, could afford to pay a little more for their guns & ammo. I'm never going to be one who would be paying through the nose on this because I'm never going to own more than a couple of guns.
I do my part by donating blood every 2 months. I get warm fuzzies. And cookies. I have an appointment this Friday in fact.
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jerrydecoy
Well-known member
How bout we say screw the looney tunes and give every teacher/administrator a glock, concealed carry permit and the training to use it and let these fruit cakes know that the next one to walk into a school is gettin' their head turned into a canoe!!! I bet the school shootings all but stop after the first few get killed before they can harm anyone. Sign me up to help pay for that chit!!! I'll bet a fun coupon(20$ bill) that you're not a gun owner and that you may think differently if you were. If you are please p.m. Me your mailing address and it'll be on its way!
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jerrydecoy
Well-known member
What's the big worry with the AR. There's no selector switch. It's not a assault weapon. It shoots a 223. Way more powerful weapons on the market!
Can we please get past this thought process? Its irrational and far from a reasonable solution on so many levels.
I have a pretty solid spread of friends who are teachers (some new, some older, male/female, preschool to higher education ) and I can assure you, they did not go through their educational path to become a teacher AND a gunfighter. They want to help the community by helping the youth of our nation becoming well educated members of society. I'm having a hard time coming up with a good example of why its a bad idea. But its so irrational that I would seem fairly self explanatory. The level of stress/responsibility being carried by our nations teachers is insane and is the reason a large number of my friends have shifted career paths. Im sure adding the stress of feeling personally liable for the life/death of all your students would sure help this....
From a budget standpoint, go ask a teacher if he/she can just wrangle up another 1k+ out of the budget for the year... They will laugh you back to the rock your living under with this idea. Our public education system is so poorly funded its insane. All the teachers I know end up spending a decent chunk of their already measly salary on school supplies to help creating a reasonable level of quality in their learning environment. The thought you are suddenly going to come up with another grand
This logical falacy needs to stop, it is not productive and meaningful solution.
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Honestly, Whatever the military & the police use, the common citizenry should be able to access too. I don't know that everyone needs access to a tank, but If you can afford it & use it properly, What's it going to hurt? (ok, maybe the tank is taking it a little too far - Build your own Nuclear warhead kit? - who knows?)
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