Turbo 1200 Dyno run

[dynotechjim]

I've looked over the Full Power 4tech turbo system closely while Justin was dyno testing here (twice). I think for BJ 4-5 hours installation time is very doable (after the first install on his own sled is under his belt). We used to install turbo kits on Harleys in 4 hours (we did lots of installs at shows right in our trailer while the bike owner watched), and they required header replacement and some modifying of the front cylinder. But the average Harley owner who got a kit in a box needed 6-8 hours. Justin's 4tech kit uses the stock header (looks like it was designed for turbo), and the turbo is self supporting so it looks like no undue strain on stock SS header. Also no mods to chassis necessary. Way easier to install than any of the Yamaha kits I've looked at here.

 

[HANDSOME]

I've looked over the Full Power 4tech turbo system closely while Justin was dyno testing here (twice). I think for BJ 4-5 hours installation time is very doable (after the first install on his own sled is under his belt). We used to install turbo kits on Harleys in 4 hours (we did lots of installs at shows right in our trailer while the bike owner watched), and they required header replacement and some modifying of the front cylinder. But the average Harley owner who got a kit in a box needed 6-8 hours. Justin's 4tech kit uses the stock header (looks like it was designed for turbo), and the turbo is self supporting so it looks like no undue strain on stock SS header. Also no mods to chassis necessary. Way easier to install than any of the Yamaha kits I've looked at here.

I was wondering why they were so cheap. I like the turbo being supported as well, but that cant be with an Aerocharger is it ?

 

[BIG JOHN]

dynotechjim;695868]I've looked over the Full Power 4tech turbo syste closely while Justin was dyno testing here (twice). I think for BJ 4-5 hours installation time is very doable (after the first install on his own sled is under his belt).[/B]m We used to install turbo kits on Harleys in 4 hours (we did lots of installs at shows right in our trailer while the bike owner watched), and they required header replacement and some modifying of the front cylinder. But the average Harley owner who got a kit in a box needed 6-8 hours. Justin's 4tech kit uses the stock header (looks like it was designed for turbo), and the turbo is self supporting so it looks like no undue strain on stock SS header. Also no mods to chassis necessary. Way easier to install than any of the Yamaha kits I've looked at here.[/QUOTE]

OT- The difference between you and me (besides looks-LOL) is I am a MECHANIC...not the guy who looks over the shoulder of one...

I also dont give a rats ars how long it takes to boost a Yamaha....is this the boosted Yamaha section??? NO...

I talked to Justin (Full Power) at length about his kit...the Stage 1 package, 87 octane pump gas 205 hp, cunsumer friendly, ease of intall..is the package I am refering to...

I believe the MCX kit looks like alot more work (new intake,head shim,exhaust header,extra injectors etc..) but I'm talking about Full Powers...

So you honestly think that Ski-Doo should have the exact same failure rate as Yamaha, even though theres 5 times as many sleds on the snow???

FYI- My "track swap records" are as follows...121" REV is 23 minutes....151" REV 24 minutes...121" ZX chassis is 31 minutes...A real mechanic can BEAT wty flat rate times....the Ski-Doo wty flat rate time for a track 1.1 hours...-BJ

 

[Original Tetonice]

dynotechjim;695868]I've looked over the Full Power 4tech turbo syste closely while Justin was dyno testing here (twice). I think for BJ 4-5 hours installation time is very doable (after the first install on his own sled is under his belt).[/B]m We used to install turbo kits on Harleys in 4 hours (we did lots of installs at shows right in our trailer while the bike owner watched), and they required header replacement and some modifying of the front cylinder. But the average Harley owner who got a kit in a box needed 6-8 hours. Justin's 4tech kit uses the stock header (looks like it was designed for turbo), and the turbo is self supporting so it looks like no undue strain on stock SS header. Also no mods to chassis necessary. Way easier to install than any of the Yamaha kits I've looked at here.[/QUOTE]

OT- The difference between you and me (besides looks-LOL) is I am a MECHANIC...not the guy who looks over the shoulder of one...

I also dont give a rats ars how long it takes to boost a Yamaha....is this the boosted Yamaha section??? NO...

I talked to Justin (Full Power) at length about his kit...the Stage 1 package, 87 octane pump gas 205 hp, cunsumer friendly, ease of intall..is the package I am refering to...

I believe the MCX kit looks like alot more work (new intake,head shim,exhaust header,extra injectors etc..) but I'm talking about Full Powers...

So you honestly think that Ski-Doo should have the exact same failure rate as Yamaha, even though theres 5 times as many sleds on the snow???

FYI- My "track swap records" are as follows...121" REV is 23 minutes....151" REV 24 minutes...121" ZX chassis is 31 minutes...A real mechanic can BEAT wty flat rate times....the Ski-Doo wty flat rate time for a track 1.1 hours...-BJ

MECHANIC ..........BJ mechanics are like carpenters there on every street corner all promising better, cheaper and faster. service A carpenter can only nail X amount of nails in a day.... And a mechanic can only turn a wrench so fast. And your correct in my line of work i look over the shoulders of carpenters & sub contractors all day to make sure the job is done correct and at or above standards. Hey BJ- you know what "M" in mechanic stands for ? Melon as in Melonhead not a bad look for you Do you know what the "E" in mechanic stands for ? EGO.........In life many of us regardless of what trade your in run into folks all the time that are melonheads with ego's. BJ, do you know what the "C" in mechanic stands for ? Never Mind, Never Mind.....Hey did i tell the Pantyhose Airplane Joke ? It's a heck of alot better than the Cummins & Dodge Joke LOL.

FOLKS, BJ and i have been having fun like this for years, so don't get offended and if you doo theres a million others place that are a lot less fun.


Back to the topic....... BJ, the resaon MCX looks like more work that because thats what it going to take to get the 4tech to purr like a kitten. MCX, Boondocker, PowderLite & Packard kits when they become available will also be the same amount of work. Therer's a reson for it BJ. Those mentioned company's above have done 1000's of snowmobile turbo kits for ALL 2 and 4 stroke sled. so they know what it takes to get the install time, correct parts and setup just right for there customers and mechanics. BJ, How many turbo sled installs and setup have you done 2 stroke or 4 stroke last year or the year before ?....I recommend if your thinking about doing turbo's that you provide your customer with the finest turbo kit and complete hardware package and support possible. WHY? because your customers are giving you there 12K brand new sled and there expectations are always going to be much higher than yours. So your better off getting it right or your phone will be ring off the hook. Plus there BRP warranty is history so it's very important to get it right and not skimmp or be lead to believe you can get done for cheap. IT ISNT GOING TO HAPPEN.

What are you affraid of Yammies BJ ??, heck all you read about is the 4 tech going, going, going,going,going to doo,doo,doo,doo,doo,doo something to yammies KING of the boost. Maybe in 5 years if BRP is lucky. From the minor look of things you can't help but notice the double over head cam in the 4 tech the same double over cam thats been in yammies for years, the brake reduction thats been in yammie for years, even BRP's 3 cylinder 130 hp 4 tech looks to be of the same or of a similar base as yammies 3 cylinder Nytro
with it's 130 HP genesis 4 stroke. Haaaaaaa who woulda thunk something like that could happen

BJ, honestly Doo's biggest consumer complaint (mountain sleds) for years is belts and clutching. Combinded Yammie, Polaris & Cat's total volumn sales and they don't have the belt/clutch issues that Doo suffers from years. Bottom line BJ poor design will get you into trouble and failing to fix something so simple as belts and clutching is down right ignorance on BRP's part. It's design BJ not the jobber BRP hires. Maybe BRP need more "over the shoulder" guy's in there quality control department.


FYI BJ, who give a F*CK about you track swap record....Let me see here mechanic, 2 track tension screws on the rear boogies, 2 bolts holding the rear suspension to the tunnel and 2 bolts holding the front of the rear suspension to the tunnel. My 5th grad math counts 6 total bolts 4 of witch your useing air . WOW BJ im so impressed with your title 6 phugging bolt and a rubber track. LOL. Next time your looking to inflate your melonhead ego let me know your ETA on swapping out old driver for new driver LOL. That type of work is more inline with installing a turbo kit

What do i know,

OT

 

[dennon]

bwahahahaha, what a <edited> you are BJ!!lmfao. you crying cuz OT says something in your little doo section, but you post your useless opinions in the yammi section. <edited> don't know why anybody would want to have you work on there sled. Wait, you can swap a track out in 21 minutes, I take that back. You can work on my sled anytime. lmao

 

[winter brew]

You forgot the silencer, chaincase, gears, driveshaft etc....

I have to be honest, I have yet to even see or touch a Doo 4 stroke, so I will refrain from giving my "percieved opinion" as it would be purely talking out of my ars at this point, unlike OT and BJ who have had the chance to go over this machine, view the settups, witness them on the dyno and form an educated opinion.
I did own an Apex and if the Doo is anything like that, but with over 100 lbs less weight, it will be tough to beat....even without a turbo.

 

[maluchm]

complete quote deleted because I didn't feel like picking and choosing -- Darrin

How does your 120 run?

 

[BIG JOHN]

MECHANIC ..........BJ mechanics are like carpenters there on every street corner all promising better, cheaper and faster. service A carpenter can only nail X amount of nails in a day.... And a mechanic can only turn a wrench so fast. And your correct in my line of work i look over the shoulders of carpenters & sub contractors all day to make sure the job is done correct and at or above standards. Hey BJ- you know what "M" in mechanic stands for ? Melon as in Melonhead not a bad look for you Do you know what the "E" in mechanic stands for ? EGO.........In life many of us regardless of what trade your in run into folks all the time that are melonheads with ego's. BJ, do you know what the "C" in mechanic stands for ? Never Mind, Never Mind.....Hey did i tell the Pantyhose Airplane Joke ? It's a heck of alot better than the Cummins & Dodge Joke LOL.

FOLKS, BJ and i have been having fun like this for years, so don't get offended and if you doo theres a million others place that are a lot less fun.


Back to the topic....... BJ, the resaon MCX looks like more work that because thats what it going to take to get the 4tech to purr like a kitten. MCX, Boondocker, PowderLite & Packard kits when they become available will also be the same amount of work. Therer's a reson for it BJ. Those mentioned company's above have done 1000's of snowmobile turbo kits for ALL 2 and 4 stroke sled. so they know what it takes to get the install time, correct parts and setup just right for there customers and mechanics. BJ, How many turbo sled installs and setup have you done 2 stroke or 4 stroke last year or the year before ?....I recommend if your thinking about doing turbo's that you provide your customer with the finest turbo kit and complete hardware package and support possible. WHY? because your customers are giving you there 12K brand new sled and there expectations are always going to be much higher than yours. So your better off getting it right or your phone will be ring off the hook. Plus there BRP warranty is history so it's very important to get it right and not skimmp or be lead to believe you can get done for cheap. IT ISNT GOING TO HAPPEN.

What are you affraid of Yammies BJ ??, heck all you read about is the 4 tech going, going, going,going,going to doo,doo,doo,doo,doo,doo something to yammies KING of the boost. Maybe in 5 years if BRP is lucky. From the minor look of things you can't help but notice the double over head cam in the 4 tech the same double over cam thats been in yammies for years, the brake reduction thats been in yammie for years, even BRP's 3 cylinder 130 hp 4 tech looks to be of the same or of a similar base as yammies 3 cylinder Nytro
with it's 130 HP genesis 4 stroke. Haaaaaaa who woulda thunk something like that could happen

BJ, honestly Doo's biggest consumer complaint (mountain sleds) for years is belts and clutching. Combinded Yammie, Polaris & Cat's total volumn sales and they don't have the belt/clutch issues that Doo suffers from years. Bottom line BJ poor design will get you into trouble and failing to fix something so simple as belts and clutching is down right ignorance on BRP's part. It's design BJ not the jobber BRP hires. Maybe BRP need more "over the shoulder" guy's in there quality control department.


FYI BJ, who give a F*CK about you track swap record....Let me see here mechanic, 2 track tension screws on the rear boogies, 2 bolts holding the rear suspension to the tunnel and 2 bolts holding the front of the rear suspension to the tunnel. My 5th grad math counts 6 total bolts 4 of witch your useing air . WOW BJ im so impressed with your title 6 phugging bolt and a rubber track. LOL. Next time your looking to inflate your melonhead ego let me know your ETA on swapping out old driver for new driver LOL. That type of work is more inline with installing a turbo kit

What do i know,

OT

Just the above paragraph PROVES how much you DONT know about sleds...


OT- I took the 6 phugging bolts out...and HMMM my track is STILL in my sled...and the new one is still in the box....cant figure out why??? LOL

As for the turbo kit I refer to its designed by Justin Fuller...the guy who did ALL of Benders Turbos (and bought the whole turbo line from bender when he left)...including one of the FIRST RX-1 kits...his knowledge about turbos surpasses many...not worried 1 bit about quality

If the 135 hp 4tec motor is the same as the nytro (which its no were close)..how come "on boost" it makes more power with less boost?? even the mighty Apex needs 14 psi to make 260-270 hp....the 4 tec made 325+ with the same...hmmmm same motor...NOT

Nice acrynym for mechanic...

Since you pound nails....I'm sure I could learn a thing or two from you...-BJ

 

[BIG JOHN]

bwahahahaha, what a <edited> you are BJ!!lmfao. you crying cuz OT says something in your little doo section, but you post your useless opinions in the yammi section. <edited> don't know why anybody would want to have you work on there sled. Wait, you can swap a track out in 21 minutes, I take that back. You can work on my sled anytime. lmao

dennon- not sure who you think YOU are...but deleting your USELESS name calling post would have saved me from WASTING 30 seconds of my life...

You obviously dont know anything..I'm a purfessional JELLO nailer...(since you dont get it..its an OT joke)

My opinions?? just stating current facts about a new motor..sorry it got your Yamaha panties in a bunch...-BJ

 

[BIG JOHN]

[QUOTE=winter brew;698143]You forgot the silencer, chaincase, gears, driveshaft etc....

I have to be honest, I have yet to even see or touch a Doo 4 stroke, so I will refrain from giving my "percieved opinion" as it would be purely talking out of my ars at this point, unlike OT and BJ who have had the chance to go over this machine, view the settups, witness them on the dyno and form an educated opinion.
I did own an Apex and if the Doo is anything like that, but with over 100 lbs less weight, it will be tough to beat....even without a turbo.[/QUOTE]

This falls into the catagory of garage/week end warrior tech VS a guy who does it for a living....my personal sled had 3 tracks..each one for different conditions...24 minutes and a 151 REV is driving out the door with a new shoe...granted I didnt stop for anything and went 100% just to beat the clock but it can be done....-BJ

 

[cacsrx1]

Little tip for you BJ. Let your product do the talking, ranting about this and that, how fast you can change a track...blah blah blah. I for one dont ride a Doo, I have been a member of Dootalk for 5 years or better and HAD alot of respect for you, right now you sound like the last guy I would buy anything from.

 

[gus bohne]

Did you use a bored stock cylinder for your srx 780 ?
I had 3 back then ,all were bored 700cylinders. Had great results on all three..

Put 3-4000 miles a year on the HEAVY later release wisecos without issue.
Only saw a few that were being run too hot ( water temp wise ) that constantly collapsed the pto piston..
My absolute favorite trail rocket of all time 1998 780 srx..!!!

Don't beat BJ up just yet..
Looked over our prototype xr and have to agree,, Its a 3-4 hour install if you are a good mechanic. If you are (inclined) it will take you 7-8 hours.

cpi rev turbo kits eat up a full day in my shop but that includes all clutching, gearing, gauges and testing in feild.. thats 9 am and done at 4 pm.

Gus

Mc express will have a good useable system but they are NOT GOD nor are they even remotely close too it...BRP did have a hand in the bennet project as stated by GREGG on amsnow , he actually thanked BRP..LOL

How bout Saubers...

 

[Original Tetonice]

Gus CPI came to mind when i saw MCX is using a mistsubishi, which CPI has used for as long as i can remmeber in the 2 stroke. I know cost and avaiblitiy is a big part of it.

BJ i knew you wouldn't understand and of coarse i expected you to bite.......What draining 2.6oz's of oil, and 6 more screws, than removing the chain tensioner, and the clip and bolt take ??? Lets me see here i have to doo daa math. Hmmmmmmm 7 minutes and 22 seconds

Careful of the rubber seal.

OT

 

[DaveB]

There's always room for Jello! Good entertainment, clowns.

 

[Original Tetonice]

Just the above paragraph PROVES how much you DONT know about sleds...


OT- I took the 6 phugging bolts out...and HMMM my track is STILL in my sled...and the new one is still in the box....cant figure out why??? LOL

As for the turbo kit I refer to its designed by Justin Fuller...the guy who did ALL of Benders Turbos (and bought the whole turbo line from bender when he left)...including one of the FIRST RX-1 kits...his knowledge about turbos surpasses many...not worried 1 bit about quality

If the 135 hp 4tec motor is the same as the nytro (which its no were close)..how come "on boost" it makes more power with less boost?? even the mighty Apex needs 14 psi to make 260-270 hp....the 4 tec made 325+ with the same...hmmmm same motor...NOT
Nice acrynym for mechanic...

Since you pound nails....I'm sure I could learn a thing or two from you...-BJ

BJ, The Apex at 260 to 270 HP is only running a smaller garrett GT 25 which at 14# will peak at approx 270ish HP . If im correct the bennett kit used an Aero66 which id a big phuggin unit. If you add a 28R turbo you will be pushing up to 400 + HP.

14# of boost isn't always the same as it relates to HP. Example. A larger 28R or Aero66 at 14# moves a larger volumn of air than the smaller GT25 running the same 14#. That is why the larger turbo developes more HP a 14#.

I suggest if the wallet is big enough to alway purchase the largest turbo possible. Not for the sake of the HP only, but rather a larger turbo doesn't work near as hard as the smaller turbo's has to thus the larger turbo does not create near the heat as a smaller unit will.

BJ i never said the nytro and 4 tec motor are the same.

OT

 

[BIG JOHN]

What are you affraid of Yammies BJ ??, heck all you read about is the 4 tech going, going, going,going,going to doo,doo,doo,doo,doo,doo something to yammies KING of the boost. Maybe in 5 years if BRP is lucky. From the minor look of things you can't help but notice the double over head cam in the 4 tech the same double over cam thats been in yammies for years, the brake reduction thats been in yammie for years, even BRP's 3 cylinder 130 hp 4 tech looks to be of the same or of a similar base as yammies 3 cylinder Nytro
with it's 130 HP genesis 4 stroke. Haaaaaaa who woulda thunk something like that could happen

What do i know,[/B]

OT

OR you did say it??

OK- you got me on the hairdryer size...yes an Aero 66 will make more than a GT25....

BUT...the Full Power kit uses a GT25.....and it makes 235hp/155tq at 7.5 psi on 92-93 pump....bump it to say an even 10 psi... Its safe to say it would bump the power to a solid 260+hp/175+tq...apples/apples = more more power on less boost...

In 5 MONTHS there will be plenty boosted 4tecs...the 427/275 guy is coming back with a bigger turbo, ported head and new cams...500+ hp on day 2 for him will be possible...BJ

FYI- just admit it...you have never done a track on a REV...you would be impressed at 24 minutes...NOW for the Apex...thats a different story, a couple hours even for a melonhead...LOL

 

[BIG JOHN]

Little tip for you BJ. Let your product do the talking, ranting about this and that, how fast you can change a track...blah blah blah. I for one dont ride a Doo, I have been a member of Dootalk for 5 years or better and HAD alot of respect for you, right now you sound like the last guy I would buy anything from.

I am letting the product talk...the 4tec is a gem on boost...I'm not making anything up...427/275 on 120 race gas and 205/135 on 87 pump...I cant wait to put it on the snow...I didnt make ONE claim about what will happen on the snow...just the power of this new motor...thats a fact...

As for track swaps...I am just dogg'n ICE...but its true...the REV is the EASIEST sled to doo a couple things on..

What have I done to deter any respect??... its summer...theres a new toy to play with...it makes BIG power...thats all I have said...a guy cant have a little fun along the way???-BJ

 

[dynotechjim]

I was just reviewing this discussion about time to install the FP turbo system and I can offer this--during the most recent dyno session, Justin had several iterations of lighter, hopefully higher flowing mufflers to test with the base turbo system. After determining which design had lowest sound dB/ best airflow CFM/ and best hp/ per psi boost Justin wanted to see how the same muffler impacted airflow and HP normally aspirated. I watched him remove the complete turbo system and have the sled back to stock NA in less than an hour. I was bummed because I get paid by the hour whether the dyno is spinning or wrenches are being turned.

When Justin returns this coming Monday to test headers/ stage 2 kit w/ larger turbo etc I think he'll be removing or installing the turbo system to compare his header design on stock NA engine output. He's been dyno testing with dynocams off, and Monday I'll try to talk him into leaving dynocams on so you can hear the sound of the turbo system running on boost, and maybe see the installation/ or removal process.

 

[TurboJamie]

Little tip for you BJ. Let your product do the talking, ranting about this and that, how fast you can change a track...blah blah blah. I for one dont ride a Doo, I have been a member of Dootalk for 5 years or better and HAD alot of respect for you, right now you sound like the last guy I would buy anything from.

x2

I have to agree BJ, and I did purchase an Xp brace from you which looks like a decent product. I don't think your helping Justin any in ranting at all these guys.

 

[dynotechjim]

Just switched schedule- Justin Full Power is coming tomorrow Sat AM, not Monday. I think dynocams will be on.