Steamboat rollover

[Himark]

Once again if anyone has an issue with laws, the associated fines, etc... Take it up with your elected official City/county/state they are your elected representatives that truly "work for you" they are your elected official that every law and associated fine has to be approved by.

See this is where I have an issue. There ARE laws that are NOT right and police have at there discretion when to enforce and when not to. It seems the good guys know this but there is a rampid training of the new generation of police there is NO gray. Just black and white. If you are stopped there MUST be something they can ticket you for. That is wrong.

I recently fought a speeding ticket and went to trial on it. The Uniform traffic law book is a National "guideline" is all according to the judge. Even the judge said........."I do not agree with the county on this type of enforcement but if you want it changed go to your county and get the law changed but for now you still get this ticket" SO, tell me when do I have time to do this and still keep a paying job?

I have a good friend that is a fellow deputy to this fellow that cited me this speeding ticket. This particular person is referred to by his OWN colleagues as "Barny Fife" He has been reprimanded before for being ticket happy...he once even had to personally retract citations he wrote over a two day span when there was a change in the speed zones. He sat there picking up drivers that had not noticed the new signs with anxiety.

So I agree not all enforcement is bad but like others say it is the image that is being projected. If you want to change peoples opinions start changing this image.

 

[CO Powder]

See this is where I have an issue. There ARE laws that are NOT right and police have at there discretion when to enforce and when not to. It seems the good guys know this but there is a rapid training of the new generation of police there is NO gray. Just black and white. If you are stopped there MUST be something they can ticket you for. That is wrong.

So I agree not all enforcement is bad but like others say it is the image that is being projected. If you want to change peoples opinions start changing this image.

Five O is buying into the black and white. I wonder what it will be like when the public takes the opportunity to judge him as harshly as they have been judged? I said it before but it bears repeating, Self righteousness, while supporting morally or ethically wrong policies, is no protection. Of course, nothing like that would ever happen here.... Just everywhere else in the world throughout the course of history. It is going to suck ending up on the wrong side of this, thinking big brother was your protection.

 

[coyoteman]

There are officers who seem very ticket happy, usually new young ones joining the force. I have many officers I know personally, from troopers to deputy sheriffs, most of them have been on the force for a long time. We have talked about some very ticket happy coworkers and the "good" guys know some have a problem. I can honestly say I have been helped out more by our law enforcement than I ever have been "picked" on by them. Every ticket I have received I did deserve, and one was failure to maintain control. I think everyone should try their job to witness what they have to deal with from day to day and maybe some would change their views.

I am not trying to justify the need to give this driver a ticket, I was not a witness to the accident, and it does suck to get kicked while your down.

The one thing that does pi$$ me off is officers that think they have the "right" to speed anytime they want because they are special. Case in point this weekend as we were driving across Nebraska, we got passed on I-80 by a sheriff car with 4 officers in it like we were standing still. I know how fast I was running and it was too fast. It was over 100 miles until we even got to the county they were from but it did speed up our trip for a ways.

 

[eyefish123]

A lawyer told me this, "Cops are not your freinds"

Tar

And lawyers are? WOW!!!!

 

[Mafesto]

And lawyers are? WOW!!!!

You damned right they are!
I have a couple in my contacts & if I ever need an opinion I wouldn't hesitate to call either one of them.

 

[Mafesto]

You are a public servant. You are paid by the non governmental, working public, via taxes. You appear to have no respect for that fact nor the people that provide your employment. You want to hide behind the municipality that signs your checks? Ummm, those people are all on the public dole as well. That makes you part of the problem. If you were better educated, you would be able to see this without my having to use so much sarcasm. I just thought it might be part of our language you might understand better...

I didn't want to disappoint you, so there are some additional insults

CO, I agree with on a great deal of what you are saying.
However you think that just because someone's wage is paid by you taxes, if you say "jump", they should say "yes sir & how high?"
Do you expect that from your own employees? I don't think so.
That is an unreasonable expectation.

 

[skidoorulz]

I do not care who you are fond of, and I do not see where cops have ever tried to earn my respect. So is it the chicken or the egg?

I would LOVE to hear your thoughts on my disdain for law enforcement. Since I have never been arrested and haven't had a traffic ticket in over ten years I suspect your theory on me just changed...

I find most cops to be bullies, completely disrespectful of the citizens rights. I think it is the cops attitude that causes their job to be what it is. If you find it to be a challenging job, it is probably because you make it such.

It is NOT a two way street, not even close. Can I stop you for driving poorly and issue a ticket? Um NO! I see it all the time but we both know it is pointless for me to complain.

Just like a good cop is taught to assume.... You tell me that you don't know anything about me yet now you assume I do not DO anything but complain on my keyboard. As a regular figure at city council meetings for the last decade or so, it appears you made yet another false assumption.

Now I understand that your 3-6 months of training made you a racecar driver, a marksman, a lawyer, a doctor, a psychologist among many other skills. The funny thing is, each of those individually typically require years of training, more than 99% of cops ever receive. Yet as a society we like to perpetuate the myth that cops actually are the good guys but the truth is a bit different. Self serving egomaniacs probably describes most of your department.

Explain to me why I should respect you? We both know that speed is rarely the cause of accidents, we know that wearing your seatbelt can be as dangerous as not wearing it depending on the crash. I think you and your ilk promote this false notion that anything in life is safe and that you have the power to MAKE it safe. As far as I am concerned most of your job is based on a false premise and takes advantage of peoples unfounded fears.

I still get a kick out of this notion that cops do not benefit from the revenues they collect. The more tickets you write, the more money in the coffers, the better salary, benefits and equipment the government entity can provide correct? You REALLY don't see the correlation or, you really do not want to see it?

...and a meteor could fall from the sky killing the worlds population tomorrow. We better start writing tickets to God then for endangering our lives because, of course, that will teach him a lesson.

Once you accept that you are a person, just like the rest of us, doing a job, rather than tripping on the power given you, maybe we could develop some mutual respect. It sure looks to me like the cops love putting the beat down on the citizenry. Your profession has completely lost sight of what protect and serve is supposed to look like.

One question CO. You related to the Brown's? For someone who has had little to no dealing with a group of people you sure seem to have a huge disdain for someone you've not dealt with. How can that be? I create all my impressions of people or groups of people after I have dealt with them many times.

 

[The Fourth Wolf]

I had a similar accident back in December.
I was southbound doing about 55 on a two-lane state highway after dark and lost control as I started up a shallow incline. Ended up doing a slow 180, sliding sideways off my side of the road and down the embankment. Came to rest facing north. The speed limit in that stretch is 65 and I had actually slowed down a few miles earlier because the road had gone from dry pavement to intermittent icy patches.

I was lucky on several counts:
1) Nobody in the oncoming lane
2) No roll-over and only minor damage to truck & trailer
3) Trailer was empty (I had just delivered two brand-new sleds to a friend who lives in the boonies)
4) I was literally in the middle of nowhere and the only available state trooper (no county cops in AK) for a hundred miles was busy.

A couple of passersby who also happened to be sledders helped me out. One of them was a pilot-car driver for a trucking company on his way home from a job. He had 200 ft of tie-down chain and between the two they got me back on the road.

As to cops and discretion? Most cops are jaded from spending 90% of their time dealing with sh*tbags, so don't expect sympathy when they show up. Also, understand that most highway patrol/state troopers are under instructions to "when in doubt, write the ticket and let the court settle the matter". The frustration for drivers is slowing down and making what you believe to be prudent concessions to the conditions, getting in an accident anyway and then being cited for carelessness. The driver wasn't being careless, he made an inadequate adjustment.

My all-season tires were ok but I bought a set of studded winter compound tires the next day.

 

[BeeMan800]

There are officers who seem very ticket happy, usually new young ones joining the force. I have many officers I know personally, from troopers to deputy sheriffs, most of them have been on the force for a long time. We have talked about some very ticket happy coworkers and the "good" guys know some have a problem. I can honestly say I have been helped out more by our law enforcement than I ever have been "picked" on by them. Every ticket I have received I did deserve, and one was failure to maintain control. I think everyone should try their job to witness what they have to deal with from day to day and maybe some would change their views.

I am not trying to justify the need to give this driver a ticket, I was not a witness to the accident, and it does suck to get kicked while your down.

The one thing that does pi$$ me off is officers that think they have the "right" to speed anytime they want because they are special. Case in point this weekend as we were driving across Nebraska, we got passed on I-80 by a sheriff car with 4 officers in it like we were standing still. I know how fast I was running and it was too fast. It was over 100 miles until we even got to the county they were from but it did speed up our trip for a ways.[/QUOTE

Did you atleast tip your beer as they flew by you??

 

[CO Powder]

CO, I agree with on a great deal of what you are saying.
However you think that just because someone's wage is paid by you taxes, if you say "jump", they should say "yes sir & how high?"
Do you expect that from your own employees? I don't think so.
That is an unreasonable expectation.

Where did I claim such a thing? I do expect respect from paid employees, don't you? I don't expect anything I wouldn't do myself. I think the key here is treating people as you would like to be treated. The prevalence of stupid laws and misguided directives seems to be removing the cops discretion. At that point, if they are just robots like Five O, everything strictly by the book, what do we need them for at all?

What I would EXPECT is for the cop to show up on that scene with the intent of being helpful courteous and sympathetic to the victims plight. Writing a ticket just doesn't fly with me. If that is what the job has become, we have problems.... Oh wait, we do.

 

[CO Powder]

One question CO. You related to the Brown's? For someone who has had little to no dealing with a group of people you sure seem to have a huge disdain for someone you've not dealt with. How can that be? I create all my impressions of people or groups of people after I have dealt with them many times.

You are making a false assumption. Just because I have not been arrested or fined (lately) doesn't mean I haven't had significant dealings with them throughout my years.

 

[CO Powder]

As to cops and discretion? Most cops are jaded from spending 90% of their time dealing with sh*tbags, so don't expect sympathy when they show up. Also, understand that most highway patrol/state troopers are under instructions to "when in doubt, write the ticket and let the court settle the matter". The frustration for drivers is slowing down and making what you believe to be prudent concessions to the conditions, getting in an accident anyway and then being cited for carelessness. The driver wasn't being careless, he made an inadequate adjustment.

Why do we try to make this excuse for cops? We ALL have bad days. 99,9% of us are required to keep that "bad day" under our hats while at work, right? These guys actively chose this as a "profession" (used quite loosely) so they knew right away they would have to deal with undesirable situations regularly.

My latest bonehead cop story is from some neighbors of mine. The woman is pregnant, her water breaks. The hospital is 25 miles away so off they go. They are stopped on the way by a trooper and he writes a $170+ speeding ticket to the man rushing his wife to the hospital, dry roads broad daylight. I can not believe ANYBODY has tolerance for that kind of idiotic behavior.

If you want to foster your current crappy reputation, it seems like you cops know exactly how to do it.

 

[RPS957]

My latest bonehead cop story is from some neighbors of mine. The woman is pregnant, her water breaks. The hospital is 25 miles away so off they go. They are stopped on the way by a trooper and he writes a $170+ speeding ticket to the man rushing his wife to the hospital, dry roads broad daylight. I can not believe ANYBODY has tolerance for that kind of idiotic behavior.
.

I have to say I'm on your side with most of this discussion, many cops have a lot to desire when it comes to how they handle things, but do you think what this couple did was the best decision? Plain and simple, they should not have been speeding. Is that what your thoughts are now, that everyone can just do what they feel is right for their specific circumstance? If there was no ambulance around, they knew that before getting pregnant. They knew the risks involved if something like this happened. It doesn't give them the right to possibly endanger others, much less their own unborn child, with their speeding.

 

[tswan]

Here is what I have learned from reading this post.

Don't drive fast on icy roads.
Pay attention when driving around a corner.
CO Powder hates cops.
If you don't like CO Powders opinion, he probably hates you.
Don't speed when going to the hospital with your pregnant wife,
I wish I had the last five minutes of my life back.
Thank god I get to go riding a couple times this week.

 

[RPS957]

Here is what I have learned from reading this post.

Don't drive fast on icy roads.
Pay attention when driving around a corner.
CO Powder hates cops.
If you don't like CO Powders opinion, he probably hates you.
Don't speed when going to the hospital with your pregnant wife,
I wish I had the last five minutes of my life back.
Thank god I get to go riding a couple times this week.

Yeah. That about sums it up.

 

[prostockviper]

Cops are all about showing you who's boss. My brother is a Detroit cop he sees the worst of it and he can't stand most cops because of the very attitude I just talked about.

We were riding snowmobiles in northern michigan last year fife Lake Michigan to be exact. We stopped to meet fsmily for dinner in town. We got there first so I was waiting by the door so I could walk them to our table. While I was waiting a Michigan state police officer comes I and pulls a guy having dinner with his family outside. He accuses the guy of hitting a parked car. The guy says he did no such thing and the cop starts ruffing the guy up and accusing him of resisting . I go to intervien and he says he'll arrest me. I go inside and grab my brother and he pulls his badge and asks the state cop what's going on. After a lengthy heated argument the state cop investigates the car that was supposedly hit and it turns out it wasn't hit at all.

Some lady had called the police and accused the guy of driving drunk and hitting this parked car. So the cop never witnessed this it was just some lady's report. I'm convinced if my brother and I wouldn't have jumped in the guy would have been arrested for resisting arrest. He ended up Letting him go after he ruined this guys night scaring his wife and kids.

 

[CO Powder]

I have to say I'm on your side with most of this discussion, many cops have a lot to desire when it comes to how they handle things, but do you think what this couple did was the best decision? Plain and simple, they should not have been speeding. Is that what your thoughts are now, that everyone can just do what they feel is right for their specific circumstance? If there was no ambulance around, they knew that before getting pregnant. They knew the risks involved if something like this happened. It doesn't give them the right to possibly endanger others, much less their own unborn child, with their speeding.

More acceptance of the lie... Speeding isn't nearly as dangerous as they would have you believe. I will take fast over drunk or on the phone any day of the week.

 

[RPS957]

More acceptance of the lie... Speeding isn't nearly as dangerous as they would have you believe. I will take fast over drunk or on the phone any day of the week.

So basically, if everyone doesn't agree completely with what "you" say or believe, it's in the wrong. You keep commenting here and it's so transparent about what kind of person you are. I'd probably just let it go if I were you, but, unfortunately, you'll keep talking, because that's what you do.

 

[skidoorulz]

So basically, if everyone doesn't agree completely with what "you" say or believe, it's in the wrong. You keep commenting here and it's so transparent about what kind of person you are. I'd probably just let it go if I were you, but, unfortunately, you'll keep talking, because that's what you do.

You are so right.

 

[CO Powder]

So basically, if everyone doesn't agree completely with what "you" say or believe, it's in the wrong. You keep commenting here and it's so transparent about what kind of person you are. I'd probably just let it go if I were you, but, unfortunately, you'll keep talking, because that's what you do.

So many sheep, so little time...