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Bilers for Obama--Important notice!!

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i'll i can hope for is that bush in his last minutes of office erases clintons last minute fricken wilderness crap!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

now that would be a real nice present to us westerners imo!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
You forgot to put IMO on that!

Just kidding around. I think someone said it best for us all to vote dem or rep and be done with it. Let the snow fly.

And in the mean time, I 'm going to do some research on these riding areas closing down and re-join the Blue Ribbon Coalition and other groups that lobby for keeping riding areas open. If anyone has any suggestions or links, that'd be greatly appreciated.

http://www.sharetrails.org/

Kudo's to you for joining in on the fight for our lands.
 
My comments in blue.

One thing you are missing, is oil is priced on the dollar. Now the rest of the world is tanking and our dollar is going back up, making the cost of oil to us go down. Just all part of the puzzle.

Drilling offshore will not fix the problem. Why not start production on hydrogen vehicles? Clinton says they are too expensive and wants electric. But electric charges by gas or by the house (which is mostly coal electricity).

You have to hold all discussions from some fixed point of reference. The US dollar didn't raise, the Euro fell. Goes back to reduced worldwide usage, and world economics. But, change in currency value is always with us.

No, if you do not continuously develop your resources, your resources won't be there in the future. It takes 10 years to develop a drilling site, at sea. And, if you show up late, your screwed. We need to develop drilling, so that the futures market won't see a hole in our future. It really does help keep gas prices down today.

I've written (near) papers on "The Hydrogen Economy". Unless some of the new technologies such as high efficiency electrolysis catalysts, or new catalyst in the steam reforming method, or direct solar to hydrogen work out, it holds a lot less promise than "The Battery Economy". The simple way to look at it, hydrogen is a energy storage mechanism, nothing else. Today, almost all hydrogen comes from natural gas, CH4. Want to know where all that C goes too?

snowest thread hydrogen
snowest thread 2
 
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You have to hold all discussions from some fixed point of reference. The US dollar didn't raise, the Euro fell. Goes back to reduced worldwide usage, and world economics. But, change in currency value is always with us.

No, if you do not continuously develop your resources, your resources won't be there in the future. It takes 10 years to develop a drilling site, at sea. And, if you show up late, your screwed. We need to develop drilling, so that the futures market won't see a hole in our future. It really does help keep gas prices down today.

I've written (near) papers on "The Hydrogen Economy". Unless some of the new technologies such as high efficiency electrolysis catalysts, or new catalyst in the steam reforming method, or direct solar to hydrogen work out, it holds a lot less promise than "The Battery Economy". The simple way to look at it, hydrogen is a energy storage mechanism, nothing else. Today, almost all hydrogen comes from natural gas, CH4. Want to know where all that C goes too?

snowest thread hydrogen
snowest thread 2

I see you backed off the supply-side comment, must have found an old macro econ book?

What about the 68 million lease acres we are not currently drilling on? And for those of you who want to know, Reagan signed the first offshore drilling ban and Bush I signed the second. It never was brought by the Republican Congress to Clinton, and until this year, the Republicans never decided to undo the ban. But it is the Democrats in Congress, they are the reason we aren't drilling!

Nice.
 
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I see you backed off the supply-side comment, must have found an old macro econ book?

What about the 68 million lease acres we are not currently drilling on? And for those of you who want to know, Reagan signed the first offshore drilling ban and Bush I signed the second. It never was brought by the Republican Congress to Clinton, and until this year, the Republicans never decided to undo the ban. But it is the Democrats in Congress, they are the reason we aren't drilling!

Nice.
They've been blocking it for the last two years while republicans have been calling for it, so as of now yes they are.

There needs to be oil on those 68 million acres and reasonable terms to extract it before drilling can occur.
 
I see you backed off the supply-side comment, must have found an old macro econ book?

What about the 68 million lease acres we are not currently drilling on
? And for those of you who want to know, Reagan signed the first offshore drilling ban and Bush I signed the second. It never was brought by the Republican Congress to Clinton, and until this year, the Republicans never decided to undo the ban. But it is the Democrats in Congress, they are the reason we aren't drilling!

Nice.

the enviro-nazis(your buddies) wont allow drilling on those said acres.:rolleyes:

mr clinton extended the moratorium on drilling.:rolleyes:

NEXT!
 
I see you backed off the supply-side comment, must have found an old macro econ book?

What about the 68 million lease acres we are not currently drilling on? And for those of you who want to know, Reagan signed the first offshore drilling ban and Bush I signed the second. It never was brought by the Republican Congress to Clinton, and until this year, the Republicans never decided to undo the ban. But it is the Democrats in Congress, they are the reason we aren't drilling!

Nice.

No officier, I clearly signaled a topic discussion lane change.

I switched to talking about the futures market. It's driven by expected shortages, whether it be drilling, transportation, refining, or usage. Maybe my definition of supply side is vague. Supply availability sets price, usage just effects supply.

I think the other version of history, is that Congress, which was Democrat controlled, forbid the Interior Department to spend appropriations on offshore drilling. It was part of the government budget package, that Reagan signed. You wanted him to not sign the government budget over that. Gas was cheap by that time. Remember when it feel back down to $1 a gallon, we were all jumping in our cars and going cruising for the first time in six years.

Yha, daddy Bush, Clinton, and even baby Bush signed the offshore ban. We need change, and Bush is giving it to us. Even the Dems got the message, loud and clear.

Why are those 68 million acres so special? Maybe because they don't have much oil. Any leases that aren't currently kept, take them away, and issue new ones where the oil companies want. Why is this so hard. 68 million here, or over there, it really makes no difference. At least the states can choice now.
 
the enviro-nazis(your buddies) wont allow drilling on those said acres.:rolleyes:

mr clinton extended the moratorium on drilling.:rolleyes:

NEXT!

If there is no oil there or the greenies won't let them drill there, why are the companies paying millions in leases? Nice try.

Show me where Clinton extended the moratorium on drilling. The last time it was extended was Bush I. The Republicans brought it up verbally, but never brought a bill to him. Look up your "facts"
 
If there is no oil there or the greenies won't let them drill there, why are the companies paying millions in leases? Nice try.
Show me where Clinton extended the moratorium on drilling. The last time it was extended was Bush I. The Republicans brought it up verbally, but never brought a bill to him. Look up your "facts"

gibberish???... that means what in terms of what i said. the nazis have the upper hand.

here you go... he he he!

This land is oil land

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Guess who's got some of the largest oil deposits in the world?

Date published: 6/19/2008

COULD IT BE that the solution to America's high gas prices lies right within our own borders? GOP presidential candidate John McCain thinks so, as do others raising their voices as pump prices soar.

In a series of speeches on the energy crisis, Mr. McCain is calling for an end to the offshore-drilling ban, which Congress established in 1981, when oil tapped out at $38 a barrel. Every president since then has renewed the restriction, but now, with oil kissing $140 a barrel, many experts believe it's time to take a second look.

Environmentalists, of course, bristle at the suggestion. But here's the reality: A minute fraction of the oil pollution in the ocean comes from offshore drilling--perhaps as little as 3 percent, states the National Academy of Sciences. Only about 12 percent comes from tanker spills. Most comes from natural seeps and dumping from land-based industries.

Experts at the Department of Interior estimate there are as many as 85.9 billion gallons in "undiscovered technically recoverable oil" on the Outer Continental Shelf. That's more than all the oil in Venezuela.

Nor is that all the potential fuel in America. The Bureau of Land Management estimates there are 31 billion barrels of oil untapped in onshore locations. Some of this is in America's national parks, but at least 2 billion barrels could be accessed under current leases. The Arctic National Wildlife Re***e holds about 7.7 billion barrels-- although Mr. McCain opposes drilling there.

Finally, there is shale oil production. Jonathon Moseley, executive director of the U.S. Seaports Commission, estimates there are 1 trillion to 2 trillion barrels of oil trapped in shale rock in the United States. The technology to retrieve it is available: Fully 76 percent of Estonia's energy comes from shale oil.

Critics of oil exploration claim we can't "drill our way" out of this crisis. They point to global warming and the greenhouse gases caused by fossil fuels. Certainly alternative energy sources need to be encouraged and America's dependence on and consumption of oil lessened.

But while oil is not the solution, it should be part of the buffet. Congress is at loggerheads on the issue: Democrats are resisting more drilling, and Republicans are trying to derail oil-company windfall profits taxes. For decades, the two parties have failed to develop a comprehensive energy strategy.

Mr. McCain is suggesting lifting federal restraints on offshore drilling and incentives for the development of clean and efficient nuclear power. He says states should be able to decide whether or not to drill off their own shores, and has sharp words for oil price speculators who've played a major role in pump price escalations.

With at least half of all Americans finding gas prices a major financial burden, it's time for common-sense solutions. Mr. McCain's call for lifting the federal ban on drilling is one of those.



some more... he he he big facts man!
Each year since then Congress has renewed the moratorium. In 1990, the first President Bush authored an additional level of protection deferring new leasing until 2002, which President Clinton extended to 2012. But these protections are now in danger of being weakened or overturned by the current Bush administration and its allies in Congress.
 
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No officier, I clearly signaled a topic discussion lane change.

I switched to talking about the futures market. It's driven by expected shortages, whether it be drilling, transportation, refining, or usage. Maybe my definition of supply side is vague. Supply availability sets price, usage just effects supply.

I think the other version of history, is that Congress, which was Democrat controlled, forbid the Interior Department to spend appropriations on offshore drilling. It was part of the government budget package, that Reagan signed. You wanted him to not sign the government budget over that. Gas was cheap by that time. Remember when it feel back down to $1 a gallon, we were all jumping in our cars and going cruising for the first time in six years.

Yha, daddy Bush, Clinton, and even baby Bush signed the offshore ban. We need change, and Bush is giving it to us. Even the Dems got the message, loud and clear.

Why are those 68 million acres so special? Maybe because they don't have much oil. Any leases that aren't currently kept, take them away, and issue new ones where the oil companies want. Why is this so hard. 68 million here, or over there, it really makes no difference. At least the states can choice now.


man wade you cleaned his clock on that.... FANTASTIC POST! i love those FACTS! though that word in liberal circles seems to be rather fluid.:rolleyes:
 
No officier, I clearly signaled a topic discussion lane change.

I switched to talking about the futures market. It's driven by expected shortages, whether it be drilling, transportation, refining, or usage. Maybe my definition of supply side is vague. Supply availability sets price, usage just effects supply.

I think the other version of history, is that Congress, which was Democrat controlled, forbid the Interior Department to spend appropriations on offshore drilling. It was part of the government budget package, that Reagan signed. You wanted him to not sign the government budget over that. Gas was cheap by that time. Remember when it feel back down to $1 a gallon, we were all jumping in our cars and going cruising for the first time in six years.

Yha, daddy Bush, Clinton, and even baby Bush signed the offshore ban. We need change, and Bush is giving it to us. Even the Dems got the message, loud and clear.

Why are those 68 million acres so special? Maybe because they don't have much oil. Any leases that aren't currently kept, take them away, and issue new ones where the oil companies want. Why is this so hard. 68 million here, or over there, it really makes no difference. At least the states can choice now.

Here is the deal, I misspoke on Clinton not extending the ban on offshore drilling. What I read earlier is Bush I was through 2002, which is TRUE. So I did not read further, assuming (we all know what that means :beer;) Bush II did the next extension (so yes I was wrong on that). I had also read Congress in 1998 was trying to put together a package to get rid of it, but they never sent that to Clinton. So on that part of it I was right.

Uh, you switched because you were wrong about the Reagan tag line and will not admit it.

And that is the thing, there are already these leases. If there is no oil, then why are the companies still paying and renewing the leases? No answer to that because they are lazy and want MORE area open and will do what they can.

Just wait, I paid $2.19 on Tuesday, saw $2.12 today (though not in MT). It will get down to $1.50 easily by the end of the year.
 
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a little qoute from history

Adolf Hitler:

We are socialists, we are enemies of today's capitalistic economic system for the exploitation of the economically weak, with its unfair salaries, with its unseemly evaluation of a human being according to wealth and property instead of responsibility and performance, and we are all determined to destroy this system under all conditions.

hmmm... ive heard these same sentiments before..... who is it that sounds remarkably similiar????
 
Here is the deal, I misspoke on Clinton not extending the ban on offshore drilling. What I read earlier is Bush I was through 2002, which is TRUE. So I did not read further, assuming (we all know what that means :beer;) Bush II did the next extension (so yes I was wrong on that). I had also read Congress in 1998 was trying to put together a package to get rid of it, but they never sent that to Clinton. So on that part of it I was right.

Uh, you switched because you were wrong about the Reagan tag line and will not admit it.

And that is the thing, there are already these leases. If there is no oil, then why are the companies still paying and renewing the leases? No answer to that because they are lazy and want MORE area open and will do what they can.

Just wait, I paid $2.19 on Tuesday, saw $2.12 today (though not in MT). It will get down to $1.50 easily by the end of the year.

It won't go that low, someone will raise gas taxes first. And OPEC will strangle supply. And, I'm sure were ready for refinery problems again. You did understand I said "It also might have something to do with supply side economics." I'm not stupid enough to believe any one thing triggers response. I'm quite the believer in Caos theory, with a larger dampening effect from greed.

I also, didn't say there's no oil there. I said there's not much, probably should have said there's not as much. It was a comparative statement. Obviously, someone at the oil companies think they know were the big oil is. If not, then it's a giant deflection to pull attention away from their profits, and our problems. But, something tells me, they think they know were oil is, and would like to look there. Exploration is investment in the future. Let them have it all, they'll just pay for more leases, and our energy future will be more secure. Personally, I'd rather see oil wells off Mission Beach, than give another dollar to our enemies.
 
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Adolf Hitler:

We are socialists, we are enemies of today's capitalistic economic system for the exploitation of the economically weak, with its unfair salaries, with its unseemly evaluation of a human being according to wealth and property instead of responsibility and performance, and we are all determined to destroy this system under all conditions.

hmmm... ive heard these same sentiments before..... who is it that sounds remarkably similiar????

I feel sorry for you if you honestly think Obama has the power to overturn 200 years of history and turn our form of government into a ruthless dictatorship.
 
were you always picked last at recess? Were you teased alot in elementary school? I thought so. Dr. Phil would like to talk to you.

Nope, thanks for asking though. See, when ya'll are backed into a corner, you change the subject, start dogging on people's youth, you know, whatever diversionary tactic you can. Just like McCain with Khalidi, Ayers, etc.

And I honestly saw $1.99 gas this morning. No joking or lying. Was driving to catch airplane so I did not stop for pic. But I was shocked.
 
Nope, thanks for asking though. See, when ya'll are backed into a corner, you change the subject, start dogging on people's youth, you know, whatever diversionary tactic you can. Just like McCain with Khalidi, Ayers, etc.

And I honestly saw $1.99 gas this morning. No joking or lying. Was driving to catch airplane so I did not stop for pic. But I was shocked.

Are you saying that you are young and immature. If this is the case, How can you discuss politics? Oh, I know School district 2 has brain washed you.
 
Are you saying that you are young and immature. If this is the case, How can you discuss politics? Oh, I know School district 2 has brain washed you.

Nope, I am a long ways from high school, or college for that matter. And I did not go through SD 2. I was referring to him trying to say what I was like in elementary school.

If you read through the threads, you should know me by now.
 
Nope, I am a long ways from high school, or college for that matter. And I did not go through SD 2. I was referring to him trying to say what I was like in elementary school.

If you read through the threads, you should know me by now.

Mixed up, Blender boy, All mixed up. I can spend my time better by cleaning the cat box or taking out the garbage. Good by.
 
Mixed up, Blender boy, All mixed up. I can spend my time better by cleaning the cat box or taking out the garbage. Good by.

I am sorry I got you all flustered. LOL

Here, Obama is a terrorist, and going to convert us into a communist dictatoriship on the lines of USSR. Oh, and he will kill Jews like Hitler.

There is everything back to normal in your world?
 
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