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Wrecked Sled - Needs to be recovered...
- Thread starter Tahoeguy
- Start date
I can hear the insurance company now. You were riding in government owned wilderness area where motorized vehicles are prohibited and you want us to cover the claim. I think we can cut you a check next week Do we make it out to you or the government? NOT!. <O
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Cant just ride it out with a broken header and it sounds like the motor mounts may be bent or broken. After all the area is patrolled by the forest service that are hungry to write fines because the state of CA. is broke like most states these days.<O</O
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Looks like the only option is to hike in take off as many parts as you can to lighten it up and carry the rest out to the wilderness area boundary and drag it the rest of the way with either a horse or atv/side x side. It’s going to be a chore no matter how you look at it. Get a map and plan out the quickest and easiest route out of the wilerness area and just go in and get it. depedning on which side of the hill its on i would might be welling to go for a hike. You never know when you will find yourself in a similar situation and need some help from other people. <O</O
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I would not wait till next year. We could have a banner year next year and it could get buried under 20'-0 of snow.
Dont take this the worng way but does anyone else see the irony in this whole situation. Lets see riding where you are not suppose to and you getting hurt in the process. Karma can be a real bitch sometimes
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</OCant just ride it out with a broken header and it sounds like the motor mounts may be bent or broken. After all the area is patrolled by the forest service that are hungry to write fines because the state of CA. is broke like most states these days.<O
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</OLooks like the only option is to hike in take off as many parts as you can to lighten it up and carry the rest out to the wilderness area boundary and drag it the rest of the way with either a horse or atv/side x side. It’s going to be a chore no matter how you look at it. Get a map and plan out the quickest and easiest route out of the wilerness area and just go in and get it. depedning on which side of the hill its on i would might be welling to go for a hike. You never know when you will find yourself in a similar situation and need some help from other people. <O
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</OI would not wait till next year. We could have a banner year next year and it could get buried under 20'-0 of snow.
Dont take this the worng way but does anyone else see the irony in this whole situation. Lets see riding where you are not suppose to and you getting hurt in the process. Karma can be a real bitch sometimes
Come on...Really?
The only responsible thing to do is to call the authorities, give them the location of the sled and then buy it back at their auction.
The only responsible thing to do is to call the authorities, give them the location of the sled and then buy it back at their auction.
As responsible sledders we all hope that this was just an accidental oversight on the riders part and he wasn't purposely riding in wilderness. It would seem that the poster is aware of his actions being in the wrong and that even though our govt feels like the only way to teach us a lesson is to teach us with fines, I hope that he has learned a valuable lesson. So now the responsible thing for the environment and himself is to retrieve the sled. Whether he gets caught at this point or not is really just semantics. Best of luck to you.
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Please be aware that there is essentially a simultaneous forum on this topic at west coast sledders. In the interest of time, I am essentially copying and pasting my responses here and there.
I would like to thank all of you guys for all of the insight and for offering your time, effort, and equipment! The response from the community is awesome and quite overwhelming. There certainly are a lot of options to consider. Some initial thoughts are that any kind of summer recovery, other than piece by piece or by helicopter, would do too much damage to the sled and the environment. I am looking into the helicopter option. With that being said, people already know where the sled is and someone out there has already removed parts and may continue to do so. It follows that removing as much as possible seems pertinent before someone else does. In the process, winter recovery preparation could occur, like backing the sled off the tree. Then, in winter, a crew of us could go grab it with the quickness. For a number of reasons, I simply cannot divulge any more information about the sleds location. Unfortunately, due to my schedule, I have been unable to address many of the ideas posted. My lack of response does not reflect how appreciative I am of everyone's help. I intend to post a thorough response to many of the ideas presented. With that being said, I still have numerous questions. Of course, any additional information you guys may be willing to provide is greatly appreciated. Please be aware that there is essentially a simultaneous forum on this topic at snowest. In the interest of time, I am essentially copying and pasting my responses here and there.
1) What is considered the best way to get a disabled sled up a steep, long slope? There are numerous obstacles like trees, boulders, etc.
2) What is considered the best way to get a disabled sled down a steep slope? Due to the sled's location, letting it ghost ride is not an option.
3) What is the ideal way to tow a disabled sled? I have a snobunje tow kit which reportedly does not let the sled being towed over-take the tow sled. I've been told that a tow buddy and snobunje tow kit are the way to go but I would like to consider more ideas.
4) To recover the sled, it will need to be towed across numerous off camber areas. I'm having difficulty visualizing towing the disabled sled across some of the more serious side-hills. I can imagine the sled being towed dragging the tow sled down the side-hill into ravines, etc. Anyone ever tow a sled across some side-hill areas? How is it done properly?
5) Since the sled is still there, is it safe to assume the FS doesn't know about it? If they did know it was there, I assume they would recover it themselves and then try to locate the owner. Does that seem accurate?
6) If someone were to report the location of the sled, what is the typical FS response? I cannot imagine that they would let the sled just rot away out there...
I will be sure to try to respond and participate as much as my schedule allows. Thanks again to everyone for all of the help!
I would like to thank all of you guys for all of the insight and for offering your time, effort, and equipment! The response from the community is awesome and quite overwhelming. There certainly are a lot of options to consider. Some initial thoughts are that any kind of summer recovery, other than piece by piece or by helicopter, would do too much damage to the sled and the environment. I am looking into the helicopter option. With that being said, people already know where the sled is and someone out there has already removed parts and may continue to do so. It follows that removing as much as possible seems pertinent before someone else does. In the process, winter recovery preparation could occur, like backing the sled off the tree. Then, in winter, a crew of us could go grab it with the quickness. For a number of reasons, I simply cannot divulge any more information about the sleds location. Unfortunately, due to my schedule, I have been unable to address many of the ideas posted. My lack of response does not reflect how appreciative I am of everyone's help. I intend to post a thorough response to many of the ideas presented. With that being said, I still have numerous questions. Of course, any additional information you guys may be willing to provide is greatly appreciated. Please be aware that there is essentially a simultaneous forum on this topic at snowest. In the interest of time, I am essentially copying and pasting my responses here and there.
1) What is considered the best way to get a disabled sled up a steep, long slope? There are numerous obstacles like trees, boulders, etc.
2) What is considered the best way to get a disabled sled down a steep slope? Due to the sled's location, letting it ghost ride is not an option.
3) What is the ideal way to tow a disabled sled? I have a snobunje tow kit which reportedly does not let the sled being towed over-take the tow sled. I've been told that a tow buddy and snobunje tow kit are the way to go but I would like to consider more ideas.
4) To recover the sled, it will need to be towed across numerous off camber areas. I'm having difficulty visualizing towing the disabled sled across some of the more serious side-hills. I can imagine the sled being towed dragging the tow sled down the side-hill into ravines, etc. Anyone ever tow a sled across some side-hill areas? How is it done properly?
5) Since the sled is still there, is it safe to assume the FS doesn't know about it? If they did know it was there, I assume they would recover it themselves and then try to locate the owner. Does that seem accurate?
6) If someone were to report the location of the sled, what is the typical FS response? I cannot imagine that they would let the sled just rot away out there...
I will be sure to try to respond and participate as much as my schedule allows. Thanks again to everyone for all of the help!
As I said, use of a helicopter ain't going to happen unless the pilot wants to lose his ticket and the helo owner wants to lose his ship.
Pilots are requested to maintain a minimum altitude of 2,000 feet above the surface of the following: National Parks, Monuments, Seashores, Lakeshores, Recreation Areas and Scenic Riverways administered by the National Park Service, National Wildlife Refuges, Big Game Refuges, Game Ranges and Wildlife Ranges administered by the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service, and Wilderness and Primitive areas administered by the U.S. Forest Service.
NOTE- FAA Advisory Circular AC 91-36, Visual Flight Rules (VFR) Flight Near Noise-Sensitive Areas, defines the surface of a national park area (including parks, forests, primitive areas, wilderness areas, recreational areas, national seashores, national monuments, national lakeshores, and national wildlife refuge and range areas) as: the highest terrain within 2,000 feet laterally of the route of flight, or the upper-most rim of a canyon or valley.
c. Federal statutes prohibit certain types of flight activity and/or provide altitude restrictions over designated U.S. Wildlife Refuges, Parks, and Forest Service Areas. These designated areas, for example: Boundary Waters Canoe Wilderness Areas, Minnesota; Haleakala National Park, Hawaii; Yosemite National Park, California; and Grand Canyon National Park, Arizona, are charted on Sectional Charts.
Pilots are requested to maintain a minimum altitude of 2,000 feet above the surface of the following: National Parks, Monuments, Seashores, Lakeshores, Recreation Areas and Scenic Riverways administered by the National Park Service, National Wildlife Refuges, Big Game Refuges, Game Ranges and Wildlife Ranges administered by the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service, and Wilderness and Primitive areas administered by the U.S. Forest Service.
NOTE- FAA Advisory Circular AC 91-36, Visual Flight Rules (VFR) Flight Near Noise-Sensitive Areas, defines the surface of a national park area (including parks, forests, primitive areas, wilderness areas, recreational areas, national seashores, national monuments, national lakeshores, and national wildlife refuge and range areas) as: the highest terrain within 2,000 feet laterally of the route of flight, or the upper-most rim of a canyon or valley.
c. Federal statutes prohibit certain types of flight activity and/or provide altitude restrictions over designated U.S. Wildlife Refuges, Parks, and Forest Service Areas. These designated areas, for example: Boundary Waters Canoe Wilderness Areas, Minnesota; Haleakala National Park, Hawaii; Yosemite National Park, California; and Grand Canyon National Park, Arizona, are charted on Sectional Charts.
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I wouldn't worry about the FS stealing the sled away from you as they would have the same not-so easy situation of removal as you do.
Maybe you get luck/not so lucky and a wildfire comes thru this summer...
I wouldn't worry about the FS stealing the sled away from you as they would have the same not-so easy situation of removal as you do.
Maybe you get luck/not so lucky and a wildfire comes thru this summer...
Suggestion, Go and take it apart and let those of us who have offered help, go help. Its going to need to be carried out.... Seriously get it sooner then later
Went over to the other site and it sounds like there is parts missing already. Will post a link.
http://forums.westcoastsledders.com/index.php?showtopic=4092&st=0&p=36638&fromsearch=1&
http://forums.westcoastsledders.com/index.php?showtopic=4092&st=0&p=36638&fromsearch=1&
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Back packing the sled out seems to be the most logical and responsible option. With a good backpack frame a person can carry up to 100lbs depending on the distance and terrain. I have often packed 100lbs of cut up deer 2 miles out and I am not a large person (5'7" 160lbs). Once the tunnel and bulkhead is stripped get yourself a deer carrier with bicycle wheels, mount it underneath and drag it out by hand (you will need help dragging over the deadfall). If you get caught at least you are trying to remove the sled the most reponsible way possible within the wilderness area and maybe the officer will take it into cosideration and go easier on you. It is possible to obtain owner information from the engine number. It takes some additional effort but I have done it before. On a stolen sled I investigated the motor number was used on all sleds using that motor built that particular day. I was able to obtain a list of 15 sleds that had the same motor number and was able to narrow an owner from that list. This was 10 years ago and I do not know if it still works that way. Good luck.
There was a post that said that he was 10 miles from a trail... IDK if that means that is the closest spot that can be reached legally by ATV but that is a trek. I hiked 7 miles with bare essentials(pack with water, first aid, snacks etc) in Hawaii at reasonably low altitude and was pretty beat after that. It will not be easy packing out a whole sled in this situation. That said, if I lived closer I would be all in on this just for the experience.
Heck man sea level is a breeze!!! Elevation on this issue is probably 10k pushing 11k if his area is close to where I think it is. Probably a 2-4k elevation gain from the nearest road. Would be a cardio special thats for sure, but heck I could take a week off of mountain biking, so I am in.
if the ski's are straight you can put the two sleds back to back, lift the dissabled sled on the back of the tow sled and you can ride it out, the off camber stuff may not be easy though.
ive only had to do this with sleds that have lost a drive bearing and the track wont spin mostly on flat trail stuff. Its quick and easy though as one person can get two sleds out with no more than just a ratchet strap.
also used those hard plastic pickup bedliners to get sleds out in pieces when they are wrecked beyond towing them out on the snow. Most of those bed liner places have em and will give em away! they tow good in setup snow!!
I dont think it will work for this recovery until you get it out on somewhat level ground.
How far is it down the hill to where you can get on a ridge or a road?
how many hills do you have to go up or down to hit a road or some flats?
ive only had to do this with sleds that have lost a drive bearing and the track wont spin mostly on flat trail stuff. Its quick and easy though as one person can get two sleds out with no more than just a ratchet strap.
also used those hard plastic pickup bedliners to get sleds out in pieces when they are wrecked beyond towing them out on the snow. Most of those bed liner places have em and will give em away! they tow good in setup snow!!
I dont think it will work for this recovery until you get it out on somewhat level ground.
How far is it down the hill to where you can get on a ridge or a road?
how many hills do you have to go up or down to hit a road or some flats?
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Helo's are STILL an option... regardless of this literature.
Just because thats how the government wants it, doesnt mean everyone abides by it. I know personally...You may want to look into California law before removing the VIN. In SD it is a felony to possess a vehicle with an altered VIN.
Helo's are STILL an option... regardless of this literature.
I also know personally that flying a helo even near a Wilderness Area can get your LZ visited by two black Surburbans and a white P/U full of armed fed's....?!?!?!!?
The only saving grace in our situation was that we were doing a low-level survey guided by diffrential GPS. The proof from our mapping software on-board the helo showed we never entered the airspace a 'ranger' on the ground said we did. Yes, it was a serious WTF senario that came with a really stupid and WAY over-the-top response, but happened nonetheless!
I can only imagine the response if a 'ranger' saw a helo long-lining a sled well inside a wilderness area!
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Why do you need pictures of a wrecked sled or the location of it to help with suggestions to get it out of where it's at? I wouldn't post the location for alot of reasons besides people steeling off of it.
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