Shain is correct on adding the injectors in the throttle body instead of the charge tube or air box. When fuel is entered into the air it becomes heavier which in sence slows it down. You will also get a puddling effect in the airbox when you are on and off the throttle in the tree's or pulling a hill where you'r not just stuck wide open. You chop the throttle and the butterflys close all the remaining fuel and air stops. The fuel then deposits in the air box since the it can not stay suspended in the air when the velocity is gone. This is why you see sleds useing the dual throttle boddies haveing much more throttle response then sleds who put the injectors in the charge tube, air box, or intercooler.
Twisted Polaris
- Thread starter Lucky Lyle
- Start date
Good catch...
I made a type-o in saying before the plates instead of after.. my bad…
Also what I should have been clearer on, when I said:
Should have read: “ IMO, it would be improbable that the Dobek/Attitude box could independently control three sets of injectors”
Shouldn’t these supplemental injectors only tip in at WOT anyway.
Heck, the majority of production, unboosted, cars today run port fuel injection.
Big time drag cars (AKA Top Fuel) have been going with port injection since before the 70's when Hilborn and Kinsler mechanical systems were the only game in town. Many different reasons for this.... But you still get a mass cooling effect of the charge of these machines.... that and a nitromethane fuel supply also cools better... heck... those things are running nitromethane at an A/F ratio of about 2:1... constantly on the verge of hydrolock That’s A LOT of fuel!! Plus the roots type blower eats up around 500 hp alone to pressurize the intake to over 50 psi !! Holy Crap…Combustion temps over 6500 degrees F….
A whole different animal.
Some of the Race boat engines I’ve built for poker runs have been carbureted draw thru (mixed fuel and air) and made over 1,000 HP.
Now….. Back to the snowmobile show…
Interrupting laminar flow into the engine from a saturated charge and thru the reeds would be a problem.
So the Cats you build with the TB injectors have a problem with the fuel puddling and slow air flow with sub optimal performance??
Sincere question here that I hope you can elaborate on…. Many of the meth injection systems are adding hp to the engines and adding an atomized liquid to the airstream… Is this a limiting factor in the design?
All of this is moot point anyway as it would only really be a plus on hard core, high boost “Chuters”.
Brings back the point of cool air to the intake should be a very important part of your design and something I’ll be looking for when your kits make it past the proto stages of development and testing and hit the snow for the consumers.
I made a type-o in saying before the plates instead of after.. my bad…
Also what I should have been clearer on, when I said:
Should have read: “ IMO, it would be improbable that the Dobek/Attitude box could independently control three sets of injectors”
Shouldn’t these supplemental injectors only tip in at WOT anyway.
Heck, the majority of production, unboosted, cars today run port fuel injection.
Big time drag cars (AKA Top Fuel) have been going with port injection since before the 70's when Hilborn and Kinsler mechanical systems were the only game in town. Many different reasons for this.... But you still get a mass cooling effect of the charge of these machines.... that and a nitromethane fuel supply also cools better... heck... those things are running nitromethane at an A/F ratio of about 2:1... constantly on the verge of hydrolock That’s A LOT of fuel!! Plus the roots type blower eats up around 500 hp alone to pressurize the intake to over 50 psi !! Holy Crap…Combustion temps over 6500 degrees F….
A whole different animal.
Some of the Race boat engines I’ve built for poker runs have been carbureted draw thru (mixed fuel and air) and made over 1,000 HP.
Now….. Back to the snowmobile show…
Interrupting laminar flow into the engine from a saturated charge and thru the reeds would be a problem.
So the Cats you build with the TB injectors have a problem with the fuel puddling and slow air flow with sub optimal performance??
Sincere question here that I hope you can elaborate on…. Many of the meth injection systems are adding hp to the engines and adding an atomized liquid to the airstream… Is this a limiting factor in the design?
All of this is moot point anyway as it would only really be a plus on hard core, high boost “Chuters”.
Brings back the point of cool air to the intake should be a very important part of your design and something I’ll be looking for when your kits make it past the proto stages of development and testing and hit the snow for the consumers.
Last edited:
As far as the intake location goes...Your setup, with the location of your turbo, is positioned (if you choose) to have the ability to get clean, cold air drawn directly from the airbox rather than stagnant hot air from under the hood... Up high and with lots of intake filters (headlight, windshield, gauge pod, console side) into your turbo, easily.
This will be a huge "plus" to your system and would be a shame to pass up the opportunity to take full advantage of when your turbo inlet is so close to a good air supply ....IMO.'
Fresh air is more oxygen rich than underhood air as well.
I believe that turbo air intake this is the weak point on all but very few of the kits offered....any system that draws warm air from under the hood or becomes clogged with snow can definitely be improved by getting cool, clean air into the turbo... thus lowering the charge temps, lowering the octane requirements at any boost level without detonation and increasing durability of the engine.
Shain,
Are you making it part of your proto development to build in a cowl/headlight/console cold-air intake?
This will be a huge "plus" to your system and would be a shame to pass up the opportunity to take full advantage of when your turbo inlet is so close to a good air supply ....IMO.'
Fresh air is more oxygen rich than underhood air as well.
I believe that turbo air intake this is the weak point on all but very few of the kits offered....any system that draws warm air from under the hood or becomes clogged with snow can definitely be improved by getting cool, clean air into the turbo... thus lowering the charge temps, lowering the octane requirements at any boost level without detonation and increasing durability of the engine.
Shain,
Are you making it part of your proto development to build in a cowl/headlight/console cold-air intake?
Last edited:
P
product tester
Well-known member
its all ready done thanks paul.
Good job on the fabrication! I would be interested in a "quiet" version with a decent muffler on it. I've had the side exit turbo on my M6 and it echoed throughout the mountains not mention gave me a headache.
Will any of the new updates - pistons/head/reflash effect the way this kit performs or is that a wait and see type of thing?
Will any of the new updates - pistons/head/reflash effect the way this kit performs or is that a wait and see type of thing?
P
product tester
Well-known member
The new mapping should make it a lot finer tunned on the bottom and mid range. and more durrable.. the update should fix alot of problems.
this sled was built out the side with no muffler because thats the way he wanted it these kits will come how ever you want even in the tunnel and will all have a 6 in muffler (will post pics later) the stock hole is where mine is going. should be done by monday.
this sled was built out the side with no muffler because thats the way he wanted it these kits will come how ever you want even in the tunnel and will all have a 6 in muffler (will post pics later) the stock hole is where mine is going. should be done by monday.
Shain is this your sled or Lyle's ? are all you guys switching to polaris this year?
B
bradb1us
Member
Can somebody shoot me pricing (if available) on this kit?
I have an two 2009 Dragon 800's. I'm in Sandy.
Thanks,
Brad
bradishot@gmail.com
I have an two 2009 Dragon 800's. I'm in Sandy.
Thanks,
Brad
bradishot@gmail.com
P
product tester
Well-known member
Its both of ours. Iwill be riding polaris this year.
I have a question about the up pipe from the expansion chamber to the turbo. I remember the psi and ski doo ran a center tap stinger off there exhaust . It would I think shorten the up pipe a little.
I really don't know crap about turbos, I hope to own one some day, I just saw the pics and this questions just ....... I had to ask.
Thanks.
I really don't know crap about turbos, I hope to own one some day, I just saw the pics and this questions just ....... I had to ask.
Thanks.
With the center dump question you'd loose drive pressure to the turbo. You'd keep the same back pressure in the pipe but loose the velocity of the gas that would help spool the turbo.
I want one!! Going to see if the update works then will give you guys a call probably not till next year but time will tell how the update works will definatly be watching how this kit works and how I hope the upate works this time around. Awesome looking build been watching your stuff for awhile and always hear and read good results. Almost bought an AC just so I could have one of your Turbos!
2
2mileshigh
Active member
Great work,
Last edited:
wow! that is one bad a$$ lookin set up.
P
product tester
Well-known member
this sled will be in spokane this week end at the 509 premeir
Where is that being held at?? I may swing by if Im over there.
Jake
Jake
