The obama list

[khaddon2110]

i just got off of the phone with the sec of states office. every state does the electoral vote differently. In idaho there is 4 electoral votes. We vote in the elcetoral voters and they vote for us. The popular vote in idaho doesn't really matter much.

I agree with you about how the process works but, to say the popular vote doesn't matter much is a stretch.... I bet if you asked the sec of state when the last time the 4 votes were assigned opposite of the populare vote you would find it hasn't happened....

the general election for president is a winner take all popular vote in each state..... the candidate to get the most votes takes all the electoral votes from that state...

I may be wrong, (it may have happened before sometime) but could you immagine the uproar if it was not based on popular vote in each state..... lets say obama wins washingtons popular vote, but the electoral votes end up going to McCain....... You can bet with all the hemp growin hippies up there that you would have a serious revolution.....

 

[TIM]

khaddon

it is not based on popular vote in idaho. the 4 electoral voters vote on how they feel the state wants. some states the electoral goes on who wins the popular vote. but idaho is not one of those states.

tim

 

[Mooseknuckle]

khaddon

it is not based on popular vote in idaho. the 4 electoral voters vote on how they feel the state wants. some states the electoral goes on who wins the popular vote. but idaho is not one of those states.

tim

I think thats really the same, No?


not to go all civics class

The final electors for each state are voted on by the state's residents on voting day. In many states, the electors' names are printed on the ballots -- where those names "sit" depends on the state. For example, the electors could be listed directly under the presidential candidates' names (Democrats with the Democratic nominee, Libertarians with the Libertarian nominee, Republicans with the Republican nominee and so on) or simply grouped by party somewhere else on the ballot. And, of course, the names might not even be listed at all. Essentially, it is the electors who get voted "in" who end up casting the "real" vote. Hold on, it seems like the last two sentences don't go together, "How can someone be voted "in" if they're not even on a ballot?"

Consider this information from the Department of the Secretary of State for North Carolina:

Under North Carolina General Statute § 163-209, the names of candidates for electors of President and Vice-President nominated by any political party recognized in this State under North Carolina General Statute § 163-96 or by any unaffiliated candidate for President of the United States who has qualified to have his name printed on the general election ballot under North Carolina General Statute § 163-122 must be filed with the Secretary of State. A vote for the candidates for President and Vice-President named on the ballot is a vote for the electors of the party or unaffiliated candidate by which those candidates for elector were nominated and whose names have been filed with the Secretary of State.

The key is this part, "A vote for the candidates for President and Vice-President named on the ballot is a vote for the electors..."

This is the case for 48 states -- it's known as the "winner-take-all system." The other system, known as the "district system," is observed in both Maine and Nebraska. In these states, two electors' votes are made based on the candidate who received the most votes statewide. The remaining electoral votes go by congressional districts, awarding the vote to the candidate who received the most votes in each district.
Now, in regard to "winner-take-all" states, keep in mind what we said in the last section: Most of the time, electors cast their votes for the candidate who has received the most votes in that particular state. However, there have been times when electors have voted contrary to the people's decision, which is entirely legal.

Although if you do vote against your party, you'll most likely be simultaneously forfeiting your post as elector and you may even incur a hefty fine -- see the sidebar on faithless electors.

Apparently during the 2000 election, one elector from Minnesota decided to vote for John Edwards, even though he was a vp candidate.

So if you vote against your popular concensus and "simutaneously" lose your standing as an elector - then your vote wouldn't count. But you still had a seat when the thing started, so the candidate would still need 270 to win even though there are not 538 electoral votes.

"Faithless Electors"
It turns out there is no federal law that requires an elector to vote according to their pledge (to their respective party). And so, more than a few electors have cast their votes without following the popular vote or their party. These electors are called "faithless electors."



Wanna have some real fun - start doing a connect the dots for your favorite legislator. For instance VP Cheney shoots dude in face at ranch owned by Katherine Armstrong whose father invested in Karl Roves consulting firm which managed "dub-yas" election campaigns. Her mother (Anne) was appointed to the Foreign Intelligence Advisory Board, by Reagan after her tenure as ambassador to the UK under President Ford whose chief of staff was Dick Cheney. Anne Armstrong served on the board of Directors for Halliburton which hired Cheney to CEO until he became "dub-yas" number two- back to Katherine who was a lobbyist for a Houston Law firm founded by James A Baker III who was chief of staff for Reagan and secretary of State under Bush I who worked vociferously during the election of Bush II version I - she recently lobbyed for a construction firm for contracts in Iraq of which a company by the name of Halliburton who is also there in Iraq doing support service for the Gov't and business whose stock has increased about 9 fold since the beginning of the war. Absolutley random coincidence I'm sure.

Now all you right wingers ease up, I used these examples only because I was reading them the other day. Do the same with my "cousin" Al Gore - look at what he was do during the negotiation of the Kyoto agreement (enviro my arse) - , Clinton(s), Terry McAuliffe etc.


It not that our votes don't count, its just they don't have a heck of a lot of influence sometimes.

Sorry I really drove this off the track.

 

[ericbigbore]

Moosenuckle,

Thanks for the refresher course! It's a crazy system thats way out of date and touch in my opinion.

 

[ruffryder]

Wanna have some real fun - start doing a connect the dots for your favorite legislator. For instance VP Cheney shoots dude in face at ranch owned by Katherine Armstrong whose father invested in Karl Roves consulting firm which managed "dub-yas" election campaigns. Her mother (Anne) was appointed to the Foreign Intelligence Advisory Board, by Reagan after her tenure as ambassador to the UK under President Ford whose chief of staff was Dick Cheney. Anne Armstrong served on the board of Directors for Halliburton which hired Cheney to CEO until he became "dub-yas" number two- back to Katherine who was a lobbyist for a Houston Law firm founded by James A Baker III who was chief of staff for Reagan and secretary of State under Bush I who worked vociferously during the election of Bush II version I - she recently lobbyed for a construction firm for contracts in Iraq of which a company by the name of Halliburton who is also there in Iraq doing support service for the Gov't and business whose stock has increased about 9 fold since the beginning of the war. Absolutley random coincidence I'm sure.

Excellent post. This is one of my main reasons why I might vote for Obama. Being a post turtle, as people like to call him, he is not as intertwined with the whole master plan everyone involved with everyone type of thing that has been going on. That is also why I like movie stars as govt officials also, BTW.

 

[khaddon2110]

I think thats really the same, No?

I see it as the same thing..... The popular vote in the state is how the state wants the vote to be made....



all i was saying is to find an instance where the electorates voted against the popular vote in the general election and it appears it has happened..... after thinking about it I was sure somebody could find an instance where it had with our crazy system.... flawed as it is, I still believe if we were to get rid of the electoral college system, states in the middle of the country would be forgotten.

 

[Mooseknuckle]

Ruffy I don't think he is as much a fence sitter as the public would like to think. I believe he is doing the same thing that Clinton did in '91-92, that is come out as a left winger and as the race tightens, move to the middle.

As to being intertwined, I think I'd rather be a "friend" of Bush II (Scooter Libby)than a "friend" of Clinton (Vince Foster)

Unfortunately $$$$$ talks in politics. Take a look at B.O. (unfortunate initials)

http://www.opensecrets.org/pres08/contrib.php?cycle=2008&cid=N00009638

http://www.opensecrets.org/pres08/indus.php?cycle=2008&cid=N00009638

J.M.

http://www.opensecrets.org/pres08/contrib.php?cycle=2008&cid=N00006424

http://www.opensecrets.org/pres08/indus.php?cycle=2008&cid=N00006424


Lots of ????????

Shall we discuss the difference between the candidates supporters

 

[Pukeandride]

he is such a idiot dumbazz

 

[hilinerider]

now obama is saying our kids should learn spanish


how do you think he will be on elligal imigration

 

[Ollie]

Excellent post. This is one of my main reasons why I might vote for Obama. Being a post turtle, as people like to call him, he is not as intertwined with the whole master plan everyone involved with everyone type of thing that has been going on. That is also why I like movie stars as govt officials also, BTW.

Obama's mentor is Ted Kennedy. How much more connected do you want.

 

[ruffryder]

Obama's mentor is Ted Kennedy. How much more connected do you want.

That is almost too much as it is, but it is much much less than everyone else it seems.

 

[Wade]

Sorry, I can't agree with you on this. It is a travesty to the whole voting system to vote based on other things than the person that you want to be president. I think it is the main reason why we are getting presidents that nobody wants, because people are too cowardly to actually take a stand and vote for the person they think is right for the job. Seems like a bunch of sheep to me. I am not saying vote for Obama, vote for McCain, just vote for the guy you want to lead the country. Voting is the one major way the people have a say in THEIR government. Is it surprising that voting has become such a joke in this society, when we don't even use it how it should?

Seems on here at least (I doubt it is much different elsewhere) that people are voting for McCain just so Obama won't win. Well what happens when the majority of people are voting for McCain, but don't really want him to be president, and would rather have someone else.

Seems if those people actually voiced who they wanted they might actually get there way or at least a better opportunity for getting there way.

Before you say, well, that is not how the world works, I ask you why? Again it is the complacency of Americans for how the US system works. If you don't like it, then try and fix it. Take ownership of your country instead of taking the victim mentality. The problems in this country are from US, WE, you AND me! It is OUR country, but people seem to forget that.

Kind of like this saying...
If it was a good idea, everyone would be doing.
How do good idea's come to be? It is a chicken and the egg argument.

There is a Thursday rant for you.

To be president, you pretty much need the support of a major party. (based on recent history). To be considered for president of a major party, you have to be one sneaky, lying, backstabbing, in it for the power, kind of person. Decent people aren't like that, so you will probably never see a decent person as a major contender for president. If there was someone I liked, I'd vote for him. But, what's the chance of finding someone with honor, and a love of snowmobiling, doesn't bring religion into the campaign, and believes in punishing the user not the used, believes in a streamlined legal system, and that all children should have an opportunity to succeed but only if they put in the effort.

I refer to the average American voter as a Wal-Mart voter. Their the type of person that whines about losing their assembly job to someone overseas, then take their severance paycheck to Wal-Mart, cause they have low prices. These sheep don't want a leader, they want drama. Their lives are so abundant, they want to pull America down, just to create a reason to live.

 

[Ollie]

That is almost too much as it is, but it is much much less than everyone else it seems.

No, it just means he is a good study.
Mr. Kennedy has tought him well.

You are talking about a guy that has never had a real job.
Never been in the military, thus never had to defend any one or anything other than himself (nor care about anyone or anything other than himself).
has never earned a pay check that wasn't paid for by tax dollars.
Has never had to worry about paying the bills.
Has never had to WORK for anything.
He is a spoiled, arrogent, condesending elitest that even members of his own party consider WAY to liberal to lead in an effective way.

Show me in any of the above qualifications why anyone should vote for him??
I will grant you he talks a great game, but has ZERO experience or knowledge of how to lead or even WHERE to lead.

His policies will cripple this country. He has no idea of what he is doing or what the long term ramifications will be, that or he doesn't care. He is just towing the liberal line, just like his mentor Ted Kennedy has told him too.

 

[Mooseknuckle]

You are talking about a guy that has never had a real job.
Never been in the military, thus never had to defend any one or anything other than himself (nor care about anyone or anything other than himself).
has never earned a pay check that wasn't paid for by tax dollars.
Has never had to worry about paying the bills.
Has never had to WORK for anything.
He is a spoiled, arrogent, condesending elitest that even members of his own party consider WAY to liberal to lead in an effective way.

Is this in 92 or 08?

 

[ericbigbore]

To be president, you pretty much need the support of a major party. (based on recent history). To be considered for president of a major party, you have to be one sneaky, lying, backstabbing, in it for the power, kind of person. Decent people aren't like that, so you will probably never see a decent person as a major contender for president. If there was someone I liked, I'd vote for him. But, what's the chance of finding someone with honor, and a love of snowmobiling, doesn't bring religion into the campaign, and believes in punishing the user not the used, believes in a streamlined legal system, and that all children should have an opportunity to succeed but only if they put in the effort.

I refer to the average American voter as a Wal-Mart voter. Their the type of person that whines about losing their assembly job to someone overseas, then take their severance paycheck to Wal-Mart, cause they have low prices. These sheep don't want a leader, they want drama. Their lives are so abundant, they want to pull America down, just to create a reason to live.

I'm writing in WADE FOR PRESIDENT! Good post!

 

[ruffryder]

No, it just means he is a good study.
Mr. Kennedy has tought him well.

You are talking about a guy that has never had a real job.

So you get to define what a real job is? Please...... I guess there is a lot of people getting paid lots of money to do nothing these days....

Never been in the military, thus never had to defend any one or anything other than himself (nor care about anyone or anything other than himself).

So if someone doesn't fight in the military then they are automatically selfish, and have never stood up for what is right in there life? Come on, you can do better than that.

has never earned a pay check that wasn't paid for by tax dollars.

So the government is the largest employer in the US, so those that haven't had a job that was not in some way paid for by the government they are less of a person? Seems a bunch of firemen and policemen and road crews and bridge builders and..... oh, you didn't mean all them did you...

Has never had to worry about paying the bills.

Name a politician that has? Pretty short list. How do you know if he has had to worry about anything anyways? Did he tell you?

Has never had to WORK for anything.

Seems contradictory to the whole getting paid by the government thing, but oh well that seems to be the way your argument goes...

He is a spoiled, arrogent, condesending elitest that even members of his own party consider WAY to liberal to lead in an effective way.

Ha ha, sure buddy. That is not what I got when hearing him speak and the message that he was trying to send. So he is so liberal that some of his policies are similar to McCains? Another statement with no basis.

Show me in any of the above qualifications why anyone should vote for him?? I will grant you he talks a great game, but has ZERO experience or knowledge of how to lead or even WHERE to lead.

So lets play a game, it is called I will make up the qualifications of being president that I deem most jaded to Obama, then you can try and prove me wrong. Wait for it, wait for it..... there we go.

His policies will cripple this country. He has no idea of what he is doing or what the long term ramifications will be, that or he doesn't care. He is just towing the liberal line, just like his mentor Ted Kennedy has told him too.

Chicken little, Chicken little...Typical rant with zero credibility.....you seem to know soo much about Obama's personal life, beliefs and capabilities... oh wait you are just making broad assumptions and generalizations again.

I think the my eyes rolled so much they did a loop.


Part of me is hoping he becomes president so all the snowmobilers will go into hiding, sleeping in there caves with canned goods and stocks of ammunition, while I will get the mountains all to myself. I can dig that.

 

[ruffryder]

you have to be one sneaky, lying, backstabbing, in it for the power, kind of person. Decent people aren't like that, so you will probably never see a decent person as a major contender for president.

Seems that many are sneaky, lying, backstabbing, types of people, and we easily make the generalization that they all are, so therefore if a decent person ever did try to become president, we wouldn't believe it anyways.

 

[ericbigbore]

Seems that many are sneaky, lying, backstabbing, types of people, and we easily make the generalization that they all are, so therefore if a decent person ever did try to become president, we wouldn't believe it anyways.

You can't blame us for that, they are ALL scumbags so far, just some less than others. Good points.

 

[maluchm]

This is one of my main reasons why I might vote for Obama.

Part of me is actually hoping he becomes president

Are you starting to loose faith or are you just worried that someone will rip his nutz off?

 

[ruffryder]

Are you starting to loose faith or are you just worried that someone will rip his nutz off?

Haven't really been decided one way or another on who I am actually going to vote for. I figure I will make up my mind closer to the election period and the general election gets underway. Lots of things can happen before then. BTW, I think I stated that incorrectly. Should have said "Part of me is hoping he becomes president so all the snowmobilers..."