so half the country wants another 4 years?

[skidoorulz]

If he said actually said that stuff then even I cannot refute it. All valid points. I forgot how much he promised, but I can clearly see how little he did.

I deleted a couple of posts I made about your previous posts. Reading this from you I see that there may be a spark of hope in you that may grow into a flame. And I didn't want to be the one who put that flame out.

Get informed. He actually did promise all this and a lot more that he has not delivered. But hey if he gets elected this time he can do anything he wants.

Doesn't that scare you? It does me!

 

[mtsummitx]

I have talked to them frequently about it, and just to make sure I asked again and they said their bill hasn't gone up due to Obamacare. Have you ever had kids? When you have your health insurance it doesn't go up much when you have your own kid on there as opposed to when you are on your own as a kid. My parents are both voting for Obama because they don't want me or my sister to have to go without insurance or to have to buy our own because it is so expensive(my parents get it from work).

Hi polarisdude, just want you to see a hard fact regarding the costs of insuring children. Yes I have children. And no I'm not complaining, it is my responsibility to provide for my child. Just want you to see a FACT.

It costs me $419.36 per month to provide health insurance for myself and my son.

If I only had to insure myself it would cost me $167.00 per month.

That is a difference of $252.36 per month that I am paying extra to insure my son.

Now figure that out for an additional 6 years to insure my son from 18 to 24. That is $18169.92 out of my pocket. (Assuming premiums stay the same, which they won't)

So, when your parents say Obamacare isn't costing them anymore, I say BS!. It may not be costing anymore yet in the upfront premiums, but the #'s I just provided proves IT DOES COST MORE.

I left the house and joined the work force when I was 18 years old as an adult. I went many many years without health insurance because the cost was to much. But, I never felt it was my parents responsiblity to bear the burden of another $20000.00 in expenses for me untill I reached the point that I could afford my own insurance. If you want to be in this world as an adult, be an adult.

Just my 2cents

 

[ruffryder]

Hi polarisdude, just want you to see a hard fact regarding the costs of insuring children. Yes I have children. And no I'm not complaining, it is my responsibility to provide for my child. Just want you to see a FACT.

It costs me $419.36 per month to provide health insurance for myself and my son.

If I only had to insure myself it would cost me $167.00 per month.

That is a difference of $252.36 per month that I am paying extra to insure my son.

Now figure that out for an additional 6 years to insure my son from 18 to 24. That is $18169.92 out of my pocket. (Assuming premiums stay the same, which they won't)

So, when your parents say Obamacare isn't costing them anymore, I say BS!. It may not be costing anymore yet in the upfront premiums, but the #'s I just provided proves IT DOES COST MORE.

I left the house and joined the work force when I was 18 years old as an adult. I went many many years without health insurance because the cost was to much. But, I never felt it was my parents responsiblity to bear the burden of another $20000.00 in expenses for me untill I reached the point that I could afford my own insurance. If you want to be in this world as an adult, be an adult.

Just my 2cents

The cost structure of you buying insurance for yourself vs your family is much different then someone getting insurance for themselves vs. their wife and children with a large company. The pooling effect minimizes cost increases due to small changes in the pool size.

Just pointing out that your example does not reflect his example. You guys appear to be in two different systems.

 

[mtsummitx]

The cost structure of you buying insurance for yourself vs your family is much different then someone getting insurance for themselves vs. their wife and children with a large company. The pooling effect minimizes cost increases due to small changes in the pool size.

Just pointing out that your example does not reflect his example. You guys appear to be in two different systems.

Ruffy, I'm a little unsure of the point you are trying to make. I work for a good sized company and those figures given are my potion of the premiums that I have to pay out of my pocket. It doesn't matter whether you work for a large company or are self insured. It costs more to have a family plan than it would to have an employee plus spouse plan or even just an employee plan as it would be for me if I was not insuring a child. My point is with the added burden of insuring a child for an additional 6 years, Obamacare is costing polarisdude's parents more money whether they choose to admit it or not.

 

[mold]

Ruffy, I'm a little unsure of the point you are trying to make. I work for a good sized company and those figures given are my potion of the premiums that I have to pay out of my pocket. It doesn't matter whether you work for a large company or are self insured. It costs more to have a family plan than it would to have an employee plus spouse plan or even just an employee plan as it would be for me if I was not insuring a child. My point is with the added burden of insuring a child for an additional 6 years, Obamacare is costing polarisdude's parents more money whether they choose to admit it or not.

but certainly not as much as if he had to self-insure

 

[mtsummitx]

but certainly not as much as if he had to self-insure

I'm pretty sure his post said that his parents told him that Obamacare is not costing them anymore money (you should read more carefully mold). And therefore I have provided just one little piece of how Obamacare IS costing them more money. There are many more ways that it is going to cost us as well. This wasn't a debate over cost self insurance vs. cost of insurance through job. Fact is, it will cost his parents more which they stated it does not.

 

[mtsummitx]

Here's a list of some of the new taxes due to Obamacare

http://s3.amazonaws.com/atrfiles/files/files/obamacare-tax-hikes.pdf

 

[polaris dude]

Hi polarisdude, just want you to see a hard fact regarding the costs of insuring children. Yes I have children. And no I'm not complaining, it is my responsibility to provide for my child. Just want you to see a FACT.

It costs me $419.36 per month to provide health insurance for myself and my son.

If I only had to insure myself it would cost me $167.00 per month.

That is a difference of $252.36 per month that I am paying extra to insure my son.

Now figure that out for an additional 6 years to insure my son from 18 to 24. That is $18169.92 out of my pocket. (Assuming premiums stay the same, which they won't)

So, when your parents say Obamacare isn't costing them anymore, I say BS!. It may not be costing anymore yet in the upfront premiums, but the #'s I just provided proves IT DOES COST MORE.

I left the house and joined the work force when I was 18 years old as an adult. I went many many years without health insurance because the cost was to much. But, I never felt it was my parents responsiblity to bear the burden of another $20000.00 in expenses for me untill I reached the point that I could afford my own insurance. If you want to be in this world as an adult, be an adult.

Just my 2cents

Yes, but I have a family of 5 so yeah ruffy would be right about the pooling effect. And assuming me and my parents money are pooled together and I had to have insurance regardless of who pays it would be much more expensive for me to be by myself. Thus to minimize the cost for either of us it is much cheaper to stay with my parents.

A friend of mine is like most of you guys. His parents are divorced and his mom kicked him off their insurance when he turned 18. He's 22 now and asked a couple weeks ago where he could go to the doctor cuz he was feeling sick. His mom AND dad said they weren't insuring him. Well, last night he though his appendix ruptured. He is lucky and it didn't he just has pancreatitis but still had to stay the night at the hospital.
Now, guess what he found out? He qualifies for Medicade! So next time anything happens to him taxpayers can pay his bill!

 

[turbolover]

I do have kids. I do get insurance for myself and my family through the.military. That is one of the benefits that come with my job. (25 years)
It does cost me more for the insurance for my family. Their copays and premiums cost more than it does for me.
After I get out pf the military I will have to pay those premiums out of my own pocket. Believe me I have looked into it because I am retiring next year.

 

[POLZIN]

Not defending obama but I sure hope you all are ready for romenys failed promises too. I hope you will scutinize his accomplishments or lack off in the same manner as obamas failures and not be blind to that reality when it comes.

from reading this thread its obvious that some of you are blind to the reality that past admins ARE just as giulty and pilling up debt and passing unconstitutional laws. who was it that passed the patriot act and etc.

 

[snowmobiler]

lets all move to canada

 

[polaris dude]

Not defending obama but I sure hope you all are ready for romenys failed promises too. I hope you will scutinize his accomplishments or lack off in the same manner as obamas failures and not be blind to that reality when it comes.

from reading this thread its obvious that some of you are blind to the reality that past admins ARE just as giulty and pilling up debt and passing unconstitutional laws. who was it that passed the patriot act and etc.

Has Romney promised that much really? Honestly I think people hype him up a lot more than needed because he ran a successful investment company. He knows nothing about foreign policy, just money imo.

 

[mtsummitx]

Yes, but I have a family of 5 so yeah ruffy would be right about the pooling effect. And assuming me and my parents money are pooled together and I had to have insurance regardless of who pays it would be much more expensive for me to be by myself. Thus to minimize the cost for either of us it is much cheaper to stay with my parents.

A friend of mine is like most of you guys. His parents are divorced and his mom kicked him off their insurance when he turned 18. He's 22 now and asked a couple weeks ago where he could go to the doctor cuz he was feeling sick. His mom AND dad said they weren't insuring him. Well, last night he though his appendix ruptured. He is lucky and it didn't he just has pancreatitis but still had to stay the night at the hospital.
Now, guess what he found out? He qualifies for Medicade! So next time anything happens to him taxpayers can pay his bill!

Again, completely missing the point. You stated that your parents say Obamacare is not costing them anymore $$$. And that is wrong because they are going to pay your insurance longer (becuse of Obamacare) therefore it is going to cost them more. I personally don't feel it is the parents resposibilty to pay for their childs insurance once they reach adulthood. We all gotta grow up sometime. And you just wait to see what happens to insurance premiums when Barrycare goes into full effect. Somebody is going to pay for all those people that aren't paying for themselves. There is a quote that sums all this entitlement mentality up and it goes something like this "Government cannot provide for those not willing to provide for themselves, without taking from those that do"

As far as your friend qualifying for Medicaid, well there was a time that even when people qualified for a govt. handout, they would not except it unless they absolutely had to. Because once upon a time, people took pride in providing for themselves.

 

[mold]

I'm pretty sure his post said that his parents told him that Obamacare is not costing them anymore money (you should read more carefully mold). And therefore I have provided just one little piece of how Obamacare IS costing them more money. There are many more ways that it is going to cost us as well. This wasn't a debate over cost self insurance vs. cost of insurance through job. Fact is, it will cost his parents more which they stated it does not.

I am a very capable reader and the fact is that they were paying for his insurance before and with Obamacare are now able to continue to provide him coverage. I haven't seen their group policy but I suspect that the cost remained constant. So, your fact is in- fact fiction, it is not costing them anymore than they were already paying. But then fiction seems to run rampant with Mittsters.

 

[skidoorulz]

The cost structure of you buying insurance for yourself vs your family is much different then someone getting insurance for themselves vs. their wife and children with a large company. The pooling effect minimizes cost increases due to small changes in the pool size.

Just pointing out that your example does not reflect his example. You guys appear to be in two different systems.

Mold are you really that far off you rocker? MT's example does reflect dudes example. His parents are insuring him which is a greater cost than if they were just insuring themselves. Mt is insuring his son, although it is mt's responsibility to provide insurance for his son, til 18 somehow whether that be a work policy or a individual policy. It should not be his responsibility to insure him after 18. And it dam sure should not be forced on to the insurance company by the government to provide a lower rate for that child from 18 to 26 as a rider on mommy and daddy's insurance. And why should a company that is providing insurance for their employees and families be required by the gov to keep a 24 year old man on a family plan?

 

[mold]

Mold are you really that far off you rocker? MT's example does reflect dudes example. His parents are insuring him which is a greater cost than if they were just insuring themselves. Mt is insuring his son, although it is mt's responsibility to provide insurance for his son, til 18 somehow whether that be a work policy or a individual policy. It should not be his responsibility to insure him after 18. And it dam sure should not be forced on to the insurance company by the government to provide a lower rate for that child from 18 to 26 as a rider on mommy and daddy's insurance

I said nothing about responsibility. Just stated fact.

And while we are on the subject, what about all the college students in Idaho and Utah that utilize Medicaid to pay for their first and often second born?

 

[Vern]

Not defending obama but I sure hope you all are ready for romenys failed promises too. I hope you will scutinize his accomplishments or lack off in the same manner as obamas failures and not be blind to that reality when it comes.

from reading this thread its obvious that some of you are blind to the reality that past admins ARE just as giulty and pilling up debt and passing unconstitutional laws. who was it that passed the patriot act and etc.

you can be pretty sure that if mitt gets elected and fails to do what he says and runs this country farther into the crapper there will be plenty of people bitching about him to. bitchin and moaning seems to be most peoples favorite past time these days.

i haven't seen anyone arguing that past admin. started to run the country into the crapper, just that Obama has failed to live up to any of the promises he made and has done completely the oppisite and actually made worse most of the problems he swore he'd work on fixing.

 

[mtsummitx]

I am a very capable reader and the fact is that they were paying for his insurance before and with Obamacare are now able to continue to provide him coverage. I haven't seen their group policy but I suspect that the cost remained constant. So, your fact is in- fact fiction, it is not costing them anymore than they were already paying. But then fiction seems to run rampant with Mittsters.

Fact: Insurance premiums are cheaper for 2 people (employee and spouse), than they are for family rates.

Fact: Once polarisdudes parents children are off of their insurance policy, their insurance premiums will be cheaper.

Fact: Due to Barrycare, polarisdude and his siblings can stay on his parents insurance longer. There for his parents will be spending more $$$$$$.

Why are they spending more money you ask??? Because they are paying to provide their adult children's insurance. How is this possible you ask??? Because of Obamacare.

Is this concept really that hard to understand????

I will state this again, upfront in the here and now it may not be costing them anymore. But, because of the long term effects it will cost them significatly more.

 

[polaris dude]

Again, completely missing the point. You stated that your parents say Obamacare is not costing them anymore $$$. And that is wrong because they are going to pay your insurance longer (becuse of Obamacare) therefore it is going to cost them more. I personally don't feel it is the parents resposibilty to pay for their childs insurance once they reach adulthood. We all gotta grow up sometime. And you just wait to see what happens to insurance premiums when Barrycare goes into full effect. Somebody is going to pay for all those people that aren't paying for themselves. There is a quote that sums all this entitlement mentality up and it goes something like this "Government cannot provide for those not willing to provide for themselves, without taking from those that do"

As far as your friend qualifying for Medicaid, well there was a time that even when people qualified for a govt. handout, they would not except it unless they absolutely had to. Because once upon a time, people took pride in providing for themselves.

no, You are missing the point. Before/after obama care it does not change the cost to insure me on a year to year basis. Of course it will cost them more to insure me additional years, but not as much as it would cost to insure me independently or any other way.

And while it isn't their responsibility to pay for my insurance(or help on living expenses) they feel like they are in good enough financial position to help me through college. They have been planning on helping me through college since I was born so it isn't impacting them too much.

As far as entitlement you are correct, so does it not make sense to force people to get insurance? It's like car insurance- Everyone has to have it no matter if your a good driver or not. Not all people today take pride in providing for themselves. And depending on your point of view the same could be said for me. To a point I would agree I don't mind my parents helping me a little bit longer while I am in school. It would be foolish of me to deny help when I obviously need it.

 

[skidoorulz]

I am a very capable reader and the fact is that they were paying for his insurance before and with Obamacare are now able to continue to provide him coverage. I haven't seen their group policy but I suspect that the cost remained constant. So, your fact is in- fact fiction, it is not costing them anymore than they were already paying. But then fiction seems to run rampant with Mittsters.

It is in fact costing them more money. And is costing the employer more money do to the fact that he can be on his parents insurance 5 more years. Tell me how that is not costing anyone anymore money????? Not to mention that because of Odumbass care when and if his parents sell their home 3.8% of that sale will go to fund Odumbass care. I have said it once and I will say it again. When the government takes away all incentive to work. That government and country will cease to exist. History has proven that