Carbed 2 stroke turbo guy's !!!

[Quadzillaracer]

We have spent a great deal of time and hours to develope our special Turbo "steel material" reeds. I went as far to develope a pressurized jig to simulate airflow and pressure to watch how stock petals and other brands twisted, lifted and finally break at various levels and not just from lean pops. This was very instrumental in our design process.

I agree 100% with Gus "stay away from STAINLESS STEEL REEDS"!!! We tried various thicknesses and grades of stainless and the material eventually looses memory and curls, not to mention greatly fatigues. When that happens its complete carnage of engine and turbo turbine wheel.

The next item that needs to be addressed is correct material thickness. A .014"-.018" SST reed is going to wreak havoc on throttle response and enhance lag effect plus suprisingly thicker material will fatigue faster. I use a special form and hardness of "spring" steel that we developed. Our thicknesses and 2-petal design features on Cats and Polaris twins helped to create a reed petal that opens initially quick for excellent throttle response and firms with tension in full position on forced induction applications.

As mentioned before we have really cranked the boost on our Vmax-4 version reeds to 36 pounds for numerous long dyno runs, where previously we experienced reed failure at around 28 pounds of boost or so and of course a few lean pops and your done. With the new reeds we had a few lean pops (cold) on dyno but no harm to new reeds (excellent). The other negative many of us experienced with fiber reeds is once they break off petals, the reeds chew up the turbine wheel of the turbo and they look ugly after a few reed deposits. Take time and separate your exhaust housing and look at your turbine wheel if you've had multiple reed blow thru! But its all part of this game.

The Polaris Twin Reeds will be available mid-next week. The Ski-Doo XP versions will be available around Christmas time and I have some other Ski-Doo models coming. Glenn Hall of D&D Racing is working on testing of the Cat twin reeds and those interested should contact Glenn for further details. Complete reed petal kits for the Polaris and Ski-Doo's will be $150.00 + shipping, they fasten to stock cages as well. Also I don't want anyone to think we are bashing on their products! There are many great ideas out there, this is just another option for many of you!

Take care,

Justin
Pro's Choice Power & Performance

 

[reddead]

I don't use metal anymore man....

My fiber set ups are surviving at 25 + psi..I am no longer going in that direction..

They even live at 15-18 psi on the antilag button without issue..

I realize it can be a pain, but I will back my reeds with a full season warranty..

Simply put,, if its at ALL lean,, even just a little on the lowend, it will burn them up when it even slightly coughs or backfires or kicksback on start up..

My set up is a double up of sorts, it involves a damper reed not a tensioning reed to control tip occialtions..

Driveline has been test dummy number 2 for the last 2 years,, no reed failures in his either..

to each his own, the reed that Justin ( quadzilla ) is producing could be the ticket for your needs too..

I have seen the carnage of the stainless failures,, complete destruction..

can;t kill the turbo with fiber either..

its all up to the consumer..

gus

gus???????

 

[gus bohne]

This is an informational post, for those who use carbed turbo two strokes..

Reddead, your posts are not wanted nor warranted.
please stop and move back to amsnow.

This person is another OT. block him on your edit screeen as he is now on mine.
He goes by radial reed on amsnow and has tried to sell this bogus agreement to many includng myself.
Dave Wahl will tell you more on this moron too...

too bad he follows but please , those who follow this thread,, for my sake, edit ignore list function and lets put this to bed.

Christopher, please take note of this and research his behavior on amsnow.


Justin's reeds may well be the next step in the evolution of this combination for many ,, give him a chance and lets roll this ball on around this little hurdle.. I have yet to push my reeds past 24psi.. I may be ordering some for the promod doo from glenn soon as theres ice..


Gus

 

[Quadzillaracer]

Haha... I was wondering why I kept getting emails with photos of the Radial Reed, classic, LOL! Whats the real deal with those anyways, just heard talk for the last 5-years or so.

Thanks for the kind words Gus. Its just another piece to the puzzle to help get these 2-stroke turbo sleds to the next level of performance and reliability for all of us.

We are designing and fabricating the reed petals for Cats, Polaris, and Ski-Doo's. Glenn and D&D Racing will be distributing and selling for the Arctic Cats only (I won't speak for them when they will be available, I believe they are testing still on mountain/race sleds, just sent them another batch). I will be selling producing our reeds for the other 2-brands. We have an order sheet started for reed petal kits spoken for. If any of you would like, feel free to drop a PM or you can send an email to quadzillaracer@hotmail.com ....Thanks

Justin

 

[reddead]

Haha... I was wondering why I kept getting emails with photos of the Radial Reed, classic, LOL! Whats the real deal with those anyways, just heard talk for the last 5-years or so.

Thanks for the kind words Gus. Its just another piece to the puzzle to help get these 2-stroke turbo sleds to the next level of performance and reliability for all of us.

We are designing and fabricating the reed petals for Cats, Polaris, and Ski-Doo's. Glenn and D&D Racing will be distributing and selling for the Arctic Cats only (I won't speak for them when they will be available, I believe they are testing still on mountain/race sleds, just sent them another batch). I will be selling producing our reeds for the other 2-brands. We have an order sheet started for reed petal kits spoken for. If any of you would like, feel free to drop a PM or you can send an email to quadzillaracer@hotmail.com ....Thanks

Justin

Radial reeds real deal. Better mousetrap(air trap). More durable too. factory looking

 

[00kitty]

devilrmk just wanted to say thanks for taking the time to answer some of my questions. after i put the new needle and seat in there is no more fuel leakage. so far! i guess the old ones were 10 years old. Im a little vervouse about clutching. i got thunder products heavy hitters and was just seeing if there was any special way to tune it or any tricks i should mabey know about.

 

[devilrmk]

No problem dude. I am new to this too, just a bit ahead of you in my project.

Clutching. Hopefully someone else thats got a better idea than me can chime in. I changed to a steeper straight angle helix. Was running a 50/34 before, I got just a straight 36 in there now with heavier wieghts in the primary. Seems most the guys I talk to are using straight angle helix. One guy told me its not about just adding wieght. A steeper helix will pull your R's down and help you not have to run so much wieght. Too much wieght tends to make them a bit lazy.
Thats where I am at right now, the tuning part. Working on tuning the low end, to minimize lag.

Only had 2 rides so far and its been great jumps in progress every time, and I didn't really think it was that bad the first time.

 

[gus bohne]

On a cat primary you would reshim spider.
on the polaris,,, same deal.

reduce spacing and tuck the weights for your engagment. bog gone..

its test and tune time...

On the rotax with tra3 splined clutches ,, I shim them OUT .080 for dragracing with antilag.

With no antilag we do not shim them out , less shift force, when tucked under and thats what you are looking for..

on the old cat 9 post just use two shims.062 thick instead of the stock 3 .

Gus

 

[rdr99]

I have read through this thread quite a few times now, some of the best info I have ever found on this site is in this thread. I have a couple questions. I didn't see much mention of the HX35 turbo. Is it too small? Or would I be better off using a HX35/40 hybrid? The HX35s are very easy to find. I don't need to go over 15psi, just want to cross over the 215-220 hp line on a 800 twin. Do I need a wastegated or non-wastegated? What about a VGT turbo with a standalone controller? Or is that too complicated?

 

[devilrmk]

Just going off the Turbo maps it looks to be reasonably sized. I don't know any issues that might arise that would be different with that turbo like way too restrictive hot side or something. I have not seen one.

Wastegated for sure.


VGT would be fun to tinker with but yes, too complicated. Theres so much going on anyway you don't need another thing to complicate it.

 

[Tonysnoo]

I finished up a bunch of loose ends ...... and took it for it's maiden voyage this afternoon. I was just playing around on the lot next door and across the street on a fresh.(We have about 8" hanging around) 100 yard run along an untouched roadside. I could hold it wide open for about 1.5 seconds on the lot and about 2.5 seconds on the snowy roadside.

I never saw more than 3 psi indicated, but the thing ran way beyond my expectations. Once it was warmed up it had no lag, and it felt as frisky as with my twins and normally aspirated. I am full of funny emotions right now. I'm kinda shell shocked, trying to figure out why it's coming together so well. It just feels like something should need tweeking or?????...weird!

Gus, Ya musta schooled us real well. I'm going to call you on Sat AM to get your thoughts on a game plan for the test and tune ride.

I'm planning to take it out Sunday for a test and tune day. I'm sure the gremlins will more than show their ugly heads when we can get it out on some open terrain. Actually I'm going to try to sneak up on them slowly.

I assume the first order of business will be to work on the trail, checking fueling to see how it transistions into boost. I'm going to bet that dialing the wide open throttle stuff will be easy. It's the mid range transistion that may be interesting and of course the clutching and handling will need to be looked at.

We will know a lot more on Sunday eve, weather permitting. Wish me luck!

 

[Todd H]

Looking for alittle help. Running a 900 Crankshop twin (based on the 800 Rotax) using a CPI turbo kit. I have it running really well on the top end, but it is poor on the bottom. It seems like it is rich, but I doubt I should be going leaner on the pilot. (running factory '04 Summit 800 needle and pilot, I don't have the #'s handy at the moment) It seems like it is flooding at low RPM's at elevation (6500 to 7500') The fuel mileage is terriable, but it wasn't great with the engine normally aspirated. When coming down a climb it almost seems to flood itself. Could the needle seat be causing me some issues from being worn out? Any help would be appreciated, and great thread!

Todd

 

[devilrmk]

Why were you only getting 3 psi?

Sounds like you have done your homework, taken your time and done a good job. Hicups will be minimal I am sure.

Good luck keep us posted.

I added a BOV today, trimmed my powerjets, leaned out my pilots, and adjusting it up to 10psi. Going out tomorrow to do a little tuning. Theres not enough coverage to do any more than a road ride but that will work for what I need to do.

 

[devilrmk]

Looking for alittle help. Running a 900 Crankshop twin (based on the 800 Rotax) using a CPI turbo kit. I have it running really well on the top end, but it is poor on the bottom. It seems like it is rich, but I doubt I should be going leaner on the pilot. (running factory '04 Summit 800 needle and pilot, I don't have the #'s handy at the moment) It seems like it is flooding at low RPM's at elevation (6500 to 7500') The fuel mileage is terriable, but it wasn't great with the engine normally aspirated. When coming down a climb it almost seems to flood itself. Could the needle seat be causing me some issues from being worn out? Any help would be appreciated, and great thread!

Todd

The turbo will stuff it up a bit on the low end. I dropped my pilots from 4.5 to 3.0. Seems pretty good just running it on the stand, we will see tomorrow how it works.

Yes if the needle and seat is worn and leaking it will cause problems like that.

 

[gus bohne]

Man, My cell phone is on and waiting TONY !!!
Good deal guys,,
Todd, Drop to 17.5 pilots , You might have to go even lower...

Make sure the wastegate is closed tight. the mitsu is prone to being dropped during shipping ..LOL
Thats the excuse I got ,,lol you might have to use washer under the mounting plate of the waste gate to pull it back and load it tight closed.

And if you did not double up the reed petals it will be worse.
Get some of the 600 ho carbed cage/boot assys. they are much better for turbo use..double v stack reeds are not good under boost.. to soft..liek using butter instead of cement for the fence post's..

Gus

 

[Tonysnoo]

Why were you only getting 3 psi?

Sounds like you have done your homework, taken your time and done a good job. Hicups will be minimal I am sure.

Good luck keep us posted.

I added a BOV today, trimmed my powerjets, leaned out my pilots, and adjusting it up to 10psi. Going out tomorrow to do a little tuning. Theres not enough coverage to do any more than a road ride but that will work for what I need to do.

I was surprized to get that much. I was on loose snow over ice/dirt with no real test space and absolutely no hookup........just a fancy snowblower.....LOL.

I assumed it was not a lot more load than being on the jackstand and that the real test would be on Sunday when I go up for a test tune ride.

 

[canucklehead]

Way to go Tony!

Good luck on the maiden voyage. I have read this thread front to back several times and everytime I learn something, thanks Gus. Huge props for building the kit on your own, something not very many people have the ability to do.

 

[Todd H]

Todd, Drop to 17.5 pilots , You might have to go even lower...

Make sure the wastegate is closed tight. the mitsu is prone to being dropped during shipping ..LOL
Thats the excuse I got ,,lol you might have to use washer under the mounting plate of the waste gate to pull it back and load it tight closed.

And if you did not double up the reed petals it will be worse.
Get some of the 600 ho carbed cage/boot assys. they are much better for turbo use..double v stack reeds are not good under boost.. to soft..liek using butter instead of cement for the fence post's..

Gus

I'm running 17.5 pilot now, should I try a 15? What is everone running on the 800's at elevation? As far as the reeds go I'm running V-force cages and petals. Could this be a problem, I haven't even checked, maybe the reeds are bad. But as elevation changes ( gets lower) it cleans up, runs great on the bottom. So I'm leaning towards jetting...

You had mentioned that the TMX carbs are a solution for some applications, should I consider these?

 

[Todd H]

Also, Can the air screw be utilized to clean some of this up? How much does the air screw effect fuel flow at idle to say, 1/4 throttle? From what I understand, and please correct me if I'm wrong the air screw changes the air charge that is mixed with the fuel from the pilot? Or am I way off?

I have struggled to say the least with the tuning of this motor. Fat on the bottom, lean in the mid range and good on top. The lean midrange is a pita on the trail to the hills ( 2500' to 7500' elevation change), but it is good at elevation. The transition from say engagement to mid range is where this thing is the worst. I have seen a remote jet to richen the pilot jet somewhere on the internet, has anyone tried these in a turbo application?

 

[canucklehead]

I'm running 17.5 pilot now, should I try a 15? What is everone running on the 800's at elevation? As far as the reeds go I'm running V-force cages and petals. Could this be a problem, I haven't even checked, maybe the reeds are bad. But as elevation changes ( gets lower) it cleans up, runs great on the bottom. So I'm leaning towards jetting...

You had mentioned that the TMX carbs are a solution for some applications, should I consider these?

I'm new to the doo turbo crew this year and only have about 10 miles on mine but from my research the reeds are an issue. Mike @ CPI said he gets about 600 miles on a set, I have read posts where someone said they couldn't get 60 miles on a set. V-force has a bad rep as a turbo reed, I would pull them and see.