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850 gone down already??
- Thread starter ANTHONY11
- Start date
This thread contains-
1. 30 years of honing experience
2. Nicasil and silicon carbide are the same.
3. Engine info that we would never ever know
4. Possible throwdown on the mountain.
5. If you piss off Dan for 10 years and you see him on the hill, keep your helmet on.
6. 40,000 views
What more can one want from a forum? This thread rocks. The views prove it. Posssibly the daily fastest view count.
1. 30 years of honing experience
2. Nicasil and silicon carbide are the same.
3. Engine info that we would never ever know
4. Possible throwdown on the mountain.
5. If you piss off Dan for 10 years and you see him on the hill, keep your helmet on.
6. 40,000 views
What more can one want from a forum? This thread rocks. The views prove it. Posssibly the daily fastest view count.
I still want to know who's building the cranks for polaris now that Fuji is out of the small engine game.
I want to see how well it works to have the crank be the inner race. Seems like no way to change out bad bearings any more, have to change the crank.
I was told today that the old twin Mountain Max 600 sleds used this same technology, only they had a sleeve on the crank that liked to walk on the crank and go through the seals.
I am so glad I sell my sleds every year, I would hate to have to work on these things!
I was told today that the old twin Mountain Max 600 sleds used this same technology, only they had a sleeve on the crank that liked to walk on the crank and go through the seals.
I am so glad I sell my sleds every year, I would hate to have to work on these things!
This thread has been education and entertaining too. Kind of like an early Christmas present.....like our 850's. None of this has me concerned with the warranty we have. It would suck to have a new sled go down when in the no tow out stashes, that can happen on any sled though.
Merry Christmas everyone!!
Merry Christmas everyone!!
Lots of us from other forums clicking on this thread including the big group...flatlanders. All makes and models of course.
I've been following this thread since it started. All I can say is that I wish Dan worked on Cats too.
Now Skeeter, take it easy, he ain't tryin to start nuttin.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=AcptkEABHzQ
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S
snowmobiler
Well-known member
wonder why doo has a snap ring and a locating pin on the pto if they dont need it
Search "compression leakdown test". Its much more useful than just a compression test.
Sent from my SM-A530W using Tapatalk
This has been the best thread in a long time.
Impressed with how quickly Dan identified problem and implemented a fix. (Implementing fixes this quickly is truly the difficult part)
Question to you Dan,
If you observed this engine being assembled at Polaris, would you have been able to foresee these issues?
If so, this is the kind of consultation that would have paid off in spades had they invested in it.
As mentioned several times, hand built prototypes will often times not expose vulnerabilities of production units.
Engineers are smart, very smart. But few have the real world experience to predict how things will react different than numbers and equations.
Impressed with how quickly Dan identified problem and implemented a fix. (Implementing fixes this quickly is truly the difficult part)
Question to you Dan,
If you observed this engine being assembled at Polaris, would you have been able to foresee these issues?
If so, this is the kind of consultation that would have paid off in spades had they invested in it.
As mentioned several times, hand built prototypes will often times not expose vulnerabilities of production units.
Engineers are smart, very smart. But few have the real world experience to predict how things will react different than numbers and equations.
I've done this on four strokes, but never on a two stroke. I never thought I could get valuable data from a single ring piston that way. I guess I was wrong.
BINGO. The attention to details and such is usually far better for the prototypes than the assembly line units.
Nothing, it's just not called "Indy Dan HG7 Honing" and he doesn't make any money off of it.
Again the stuff he speaks of isn't new, its all written in books anyone with ambition can pick up and read (Plateau honing/ultra finish honing). RKTech and Indy are amazing at selling they're re-invented wheels. Then going after others for "stealing" they're ideas.
Back to the 850..
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Battlestorm
I have never seen Millenniums mirror finish ( if they offer this option now they have not shown me )
( The Bob) .... Be carful how you make statements without being sure about being able back them.
That was a bit of a cocky mouth off.
Plateau finishing isn't new no one claimed it was.
But until I lost me ass and figure out how in fact to do it to plated cylinders a plateau finish did not exist on A silicon carbide cylinder.
Obviously know one thought it mattered.
And I never claimed anyone stole anything for me...... What is there to steel ?
I provide a service...... Knock yourself out open up a shop and have at it.
Dan
I have never seen Millenniums mirror finish ( if they offer this option now they have not shown me )
( The Bob) .... Be carful how you make statements without being sure about being able back them.
That was a bit of a cocky mouth off.
Plateau finishing isn't new no one claimed it was.
But until I lost me ass and figure out how in fact to do it to plated cylinders a plateau finish did not exist on A silicon carbide cylinder.
Obviously know one thought it mattered.
And I never claimed anyone stole anything for me...... What is there to steel ?
I provide a service...... Knock yourself out open up a shop and have at it.
Dan
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I leak down everything, race motor to sleds....just a good tool to have in the box for info
I don’t know for fact that Polaris does it this way, but would bet money that they do... “Test” units usually go through different iterations. This would be a general progression. Different manufacturers and even different projects will vary slightly, but the general theory is likely the same. There are often stages in between what I’m laying out below, but this would cover the higher level steps.
Step 1: skunk works prototype, “mule”. Kind of a proof of concept. Hand built, using non-production procedures and components. A lot of times the “testing” done here is more around design concepts and not so much around repair frequency tracking.
Step 2: full prototype. This is where you’d have maybe 70-80% final product components and some level of production procedures, but not many. These are the units that would go through the majority of the testing and failure analysis. Many engineering changes and component changes based on what they learn. The units are updated periodically with new designs and testing continues
Step 3: pilot units. This is as much a test of manufacturing process as it is anything else. The product is 95% or more “final” product. These units will have some specific test requirements and used for auditing numerous aspects of the project. Everything is built in the production environment. Very few changes to the product can be made at this point. If there are, step 2 was a failure and there will be a delay in the project for additional test needs.
To say engineers working on these projects don’t have real world experience is complete ignorance. Yes, some (many) design engineers fit that label, but design engineering is only one piece. Test engineers are often mechanics, engineers, riders, users, etc... they don’t sit behind a computer screen in CAD all day, but they can... there are also technical service personnel that are very involved in these projects that bring data from past experience, serviceability, warranty issues, etc.
There is a lot of hyperbole in this thread. What Dan proposes in all these situations is what we consider a “10X” fix. Basically, spend any amount of money, over engineer it, and push out a fix that is almost certain to never fail (10x stronger/better than it needs to be). IF Polaris starts experiencing a 20+% failure rate throughout the entire vehicle park, that might be something they consider. But I doubt that happens or the project wouldn’t have been released. If they see failures, they are going to go into failure analysis and fix the root cause of the issue...not just do a 10X fix because that changes down steam variables.
