Powderclaw VS Challenger

[Perk]

Ok, here is my .02....take it for what its worth

Posted by Slediot:

it doesnt pull the sled up on top and pick up speed like the CE does

This is exactly what I found too.

I put a powerclaw on my 04 king cat this fall. I had planned on putting a CE 162 x 16 x 2.5 on. I have always ran a 162 x 15 x 2.25 CE on this sled, but thought I'd change just to give me something new to try.

I got talked into the powerclaw, which wasn't hard because it looked pretty good. My riding buddy put my old 162 x 15 x 2.25 on his 04 Escape.

I did not change anything else on my sled. Just put on the powerclaw. We went up for our first ride and it was deep, dry powder. I started up the first drainage and within 200 yards I was diggin and wasn't goin much farther. I poured the n20 to her, but it just wasn't hooking up. I had been in the same conditions with my CE a million times and there was no question that the power claw was not working as well. Just to pour a little salt in the wound, by buddy rode right on past me with my old track on his escape. Granted, he did not blaze past, but he went up about another 75 yards and turned around and came back to help me dig out. The final straw was when a 3rd guy in our group brought his m7 (also with a 162 x 15 x 2.25 CE) and went right on around me.

There has never been a situation that we have been in where either of those sleds could go where I could when it was deep. We traded back and fourth all day and there was no question that, at least on my sled, the powerclaw was not working. It just would not get on top of the snow. At least not like the CE did.

I came home the next day and bought a new CE 162 x 16 x 2.5 spent the day swapping it out and headed back up again. There was no comparison. I rode right beside the same tracks I had made 2 days before and never got stuck. With the powerclaw on, I was stuck all day.

Everyone is touting this track. And maybe it works better on the newer chassis (why that would be I have no idea) but it did not work on my king cat.

Cheers!
Chris

 

[iluv2fly]

Ok, here is my .02....take it for what its worth

Posted by Slediot:


This is exactly what I found too.

I put a powerclaw on my 04 king cat this fall. I had planned on putting a CE 162 x 16 x 2.5 on. I have always ran a 162 x 15 x 2.25 CE on this sled, but thought I'd change just to give me something new to try.

I got talked into the powerclaw, which wasn't hard because it looked pretty good. My riding buddy put my old 162 x 15 x 2.25 on his 04 Escape.

I did not change anything else on my sled. Just put on the powerclaw. We went up for our first ride and it was deep, dry powder. I started up the first drainage and within 200 yards I was diggin and wasn't goin much farther. I poured the n20 to her, but it just wasn't hooking up. I had been in the same conditions with my CE a million times and there was no question that the power claw was not working as well. Just to pour a little salt in the wound, by buddy rode right on past me with my old track on his escape. Granted, he did not blaze past, but he went up about another 75 yards and turned around and came back to help me dig out. The final straw was when a 3rd guy in our group brought his m7 (also with a 162 x 15 x 2.25 CE) and went right on around me.

There has never been a situation that we have been in where either of those sleds could go where I could when it was deep. We traded back and fourth all day and there was no question that, at least on my sled, the powerclaw was not working. It just would not get on top of the snow. At least not like the CE did.

I came home the next day and bought a new CE 162 x 16 x 2.5 spent the day swapping it out and headed back up again. There was no comparison. I rode right beside the same tracks I had made 2 days before and never got stuck. With the powerclaw on, I was stuck all day.

Everyone is touting this track. And maybe it works better on the newer chassis (why that would be I have no idea) but it did not work on my king cat.

Cheers!
Chris

You are also camparing different chassis here not just tracks. To me the M series goes through the deep snow much better than the old 1M chassis so that could make a difference also. There is no way my old challenger on my M7 even compares to the new powerclaw. My new 09 M8 would run circles around my 06 M7 and it was ported and tuned very well.

 

[summ8rmk]

A friend of mine pulled off his CE 162x16x2.5 and put on a powerclaw 162x15x2.25 and he said the only thing the CE did better was braking down a hill. He said the powerclaw was alot better at pulling the sled out of the snow and keeping it on top and it didn't trench no where near as bad as the CE. and this is on a 03 king cat 1100 BB. I have found that with everybody that I ride with(ski-doo) they can't keep up with me on my 09 M8 153. My sled will be pulling wheelies up the hill and there sleds will just trench. I can ride next to my friends on the hill and let off the gas let them pass me and hit the gas again lifting the ski's out of the snow and pass them . It doesn't matter if the snow is deep and dry or setup or wet and heavy my sled just out performs theres. The dryer the snow the bigger advatage I have. My friends want the powerclaw on there ski-doos but want to see how it holds up after a season of ridding first.

 

[cjfarm11]

Slediot i don't mean to call you out but your not really comparing apples to apples either. Isn't the m1000 alot heavier than the m7? i had a camo extreme on my m7 and put the power claw on and what a difference. The power claw is a way better track imo. Maybe if my sled had 200+ hp the extreme might be better but it is just to heavy for my application. I still have the camo extreme and it is for sale if anyone is interested.

 

[markoo]

This thread started out comparing the powerclaw to the stock challenger. Now your comparing it to the camoplast challenger extreme. These are 2 different tracks. The CE is way better than the stock challenger.

 

[SLEDIOT]

Slediot i don't mean to call you out but your not really comparing apples to apples either. Isn't the m1000 alot heavier than the m7? i had a camo extreme on my m7 and put the power claw on and what a difference. The power claw is a way better track imo. Maybe if my sled had 200+ hp the extreme might be better but it is just to heavy for my application. I still have the camo extreme and it is for sale if anyone is interested.

No offense taken my friend, ur kinda right. My m7-900 VE weighs in at about 420# dry. I'm prob off alil so I'll say even 430#'s. My m1000 had a piece of paper in the package that stated that it weighed 482 with a boss seat on it. The m1000 got blessed right out of the crate, D&D Y-pipe, D&D single and an mbrp can. So lets say it lost what 20 lbs? So that would put it at 462 dry? Ok so lets just say 30lbs difference and I'm sure thats all on the front end of the m1000. Side by side the suspension on the 100 is gutted compared to the m7 stock suspension. Now apples to apples the m7-900 D&D runs around 185 hp plus timbersled intake 188hp I'm probably over of course. The m1000 is suppose to be 162 out of the crate, y-pipe pipe and can should give it another 18-20 hp right? Ive read alot of articles on the D&D setup and seen anywheres from 12-15 hp just out of the y-pipe alone. So m-900= to just say 185 hp at 430lbs and the m1000 180hp at 462lbs. Not a heck of alot of a difference for me to see such an obvious difference between the two tracks. My m-9 doesnt trench until it slows right down and my m1000 trenches like a bastard with the power claw right from the get go. Ive had the oppurtunity to have both sleds sitting at the bottom of the same 4 ft deep powder hill at the same time and the m-9 went over in a full wheelie at 58mph track speed and the m1000 I had to turn out just before the crest in a 4ft trench at about 52 mph track speed. Apples to apples the power claw is not a challenger extreme!!!!!!!!!!! Trust me I was just as excited about this track as everyone else and just cant get it to perform. Ive played with my limiter strap and fox float pressure and everything to change attack angles and still not even close to the Chall extreme. I will trade my power claw and $100 cash to the first guy who brings me a new challenger extreme 2.5" 3.0 pitch 162". Looking for someone loally near Dawson, not interested in paying shipping for either party..........

 

[hatchers]

I ride with several guys who all have the PC/CamoX/stock POS

stock POS is great for the trails and parking lots
the PC is no joke and works very very well, best stock track IMO
the camo 2.5 will climb higher, period!

 

[yotedog]

I just took the attack 20 off my 162 m1000 snopro and went to the powerclaw. I'll never go back!!!! I can't give my attack 20 away.

 

[mrquick68]

No offense taken my friend, ur kinda right. My m7-900 VE weighs in at about 420# dry. I'm prob off alil so I'll say even 430#'s. My m1000 had a piece of paper in the package that stated that it weighed 482 with a boss seat on it. The m1000 got blessed right out of the crate, D&D Y-pipe, D&D single and an mbrp can. So lets say it lost what 20 lbs? So that would put it at 462 dry? Ok so lets just say 30lbs difference and I'm sure thats all on the front end of the m1000. Side by side the suspension on the 100 is gutted compared to the m7 stock suspension. Now apples to apples the m7-900 D&D runs around 185 hp plus timbersled intake 188hp I'm probably over of course. The m1000 is suppose to be 162 out of the crate, y-pipe pipe and can should give it another 18-20 hp right? Ive read alot of articles on the D&D setup and seen anywheres from 12-15 hp just out of the y-pipe alone. So m-900= to just say 185 hp at 430lbs and the m1000 180hp at 462lbs. Not a heck of alot of a difference for me to see such an obvious difference between the two tracks. My m-9 doesnt trench until it slows right down and my m1000 trenches like a bastard with the power claw right from the get go. Ive had the oppurtunity to have both sleds sitting at the bottom of the same 4 ft deep powder hill at the same time and the m-9 went over in a full wheelie at 58mph track speed and the m1000 I had to turn out just before the crest in a 4ft trench at about 52 mph track speed. Apples to apples the power claw is not a challenger extreme!!!!!!!!!!! Trust me I was just as excited about this track as everyone else and just cant get it to perform. Ive played with my limiter strap and fox float pressure and everything to change attack angles and still not even close to the Chall extreme. I will trade my power claw and $100 cash to the first guy who brings me a new challenger extreme 2.5" 3.0 pitch 162". Looking for someone loally near Dawson, not interested in paying shipping for either party..........

you are also comparing two different skids. the M7 skid is arguably the best powder skid ever put on a cat (stock), it sucks on the trail and on big hits, but it did powder like a champ!

 

[cjfarm11]

Slediot i value your input and im glad you like your camo extreme. But like i said in my previous post I believe that hp comes into play as well. On my stockish m7 i really felt like the camo extreme over powered my m. But with a lighter less aggressive track(power-claw) i gained track speed and some more floation over the extreme. Just my reasult with a relatively stock m7. But like you said your making 185 ish and im mking 140 maybe so 45 hp is alot!

 

[SLEDIOT]

Slediot i value your input and im glad you like your camo extreme. But like i said in my previous post I believe that hp comes into play as well. On my stockish m7 i really felt like the camo extreme over powered my m. But with a lighter less aggressive track(power-claw) i gained track speed and some more floation over the extreme. Just my reasult with a relatively stock m7. But like you said your making 185 ish and im mking 140 maybe so 45 hp is alot!

Its all good. The power claw is prob a good track, I just noticed that its not as good in our snow conditions right now. Al;so the CE has 2.5" lugs and the PC has 2.25" lugs. The CE has a way stiffer rubber compound as well. Most guys I think are comparing this track to the reg challenger track and dont know the difference between a challenger and a challenger extreme.

 

[mnsledder]

My good friend and I both run 07 m1000's with all the same aftermarket upgrades. Before our last trip (about 3 weeks ago to West Yellowstone) I went to the the PC track and we challenged each other in all types of snow that we could find. On hard pack, there was no comparison, PC hooked a lot more, Med powder, I climbed decent further than him. The deep and boondocken I had a full advantage on him. We thought that it could be "operator" so we switched for a few hours. At end of the day, we both agree that the $500 is a great investment to improve your sled performance and he has already put in PC on and ported it. Leavin this week for west again.

 

[jeffro]

mnsledder- What track did your friend have on his M1000? Attack 20 or Challenger?

-Jeff

 

[FurryCURT]

I just took the attack 20 off my 162 m1000 snopro and went to the powerclaw. I'll never go back!!!! I can't give my attack 20 away.

Bring it over along with $20 and leave it here... Problem solved.. Thanks

 

[thump426er]

I put both tracks on the scale when i changed to powerclaw they are the same.

This is a pretty good read (not the quote but the thread, I'll get to the quote in a sec), but as has been stated the comparisons are tough b/c of all the variables involved: sled weights, hp, etc. of different sleds.

What I was hoping to find when I started reading this thread is (and this fits my application of sled) has anyone really compared or been able to compare track speed. I know there are more things to look at wrt track comparison but I personally am looking at track speed differences...... and I have the extreme.

06 M7 with RKT 800, 10.4, 156 CE,,,,,, would my particular appliation get better results with the powerclaw??? I actually thought it was lighter just b/c the CE seems so friggen heavy until I read M7's comment about him weighing them..... seriously?? they are the same weight?? I have been told a few times that for my sled the 156 CE is too heavy for it too spin as effectively as, an eg; a lighter track such as the powerclaw (or so I thought was lighter) and that I would see better results. Does anyone have a similar spec sled that switched from a 156 CE to a powerclaw??? I went from an A20 so for the CE was a HUGE change for the better.

(If it makes any difference I've also dropped 31 lbs in various parts over my sled in stock form.)

 

[Vern]

i think one of the biggest things cat is claiming with the power claw is not so much the weight but how easy it turns being only a single ply. what do they claim? somethin like it takes 10 less hp to turn or somethin like that. not sure, this is just hear say so take it FWIW.

 

[Rixster]

Hit up johnny and ask him how his 2.5 CE did against my power claw yesterday in the 4 feet of fresh powder we had!!

Same Exact sled, not comparing different chassis or track lengths or any of that junk.
Dont get my wrong, I think the CE is a great all around track. I does everything pretty good, but in light fluffy utah powder it does tend to trench. IMO

 

[summ8rmk]

This is a pretty good read (not the quote but the thread, I'll get to the quote in a sec), but as has been stated the comparisons are tough b/c of all the variables involved: sled weights, hp, etc. of different sleds.

What I was hoping to find when I started reading this thread is (and this fits my application of sled) has anyone really compared or been able to compare track speed. I know there are more things to look at wrt track comparison but I personally am looking at track speed differences...... and I have the extreme.

06 M7 with RKT 800, 10.4, 156 CE,,,,,, would my particular appliation get better results with the powerclaw??? I actually thought it was lighter just b/c the CE seems so friggen heavy until I read M7's comment about him weighing them..... seriously?? they are the same weight?? I have been told a few times that for my sled the 156 CE is too heavy for it too spin as effectively as, an eg; a lighter track such as the powerclaw (or so I thought was lighter) and that I would see better results. Does anyone have a similar spec sled that switched from a 156 CE to a powerclaw??? I went from an A20 so for the CE was a HUGE change for the better.

(If it makes any difference I've also dropped 31 lbs in various parts over my sled in stock form.)

The Powerclaw and stock Challenger weigh the same. The CE or Challenger Extreme 156x2.5 weighs 10 lbs. more than the 153 Powerclaw and stock Challenger. The Powerclaw is a single ply instead of 2 ply which in turn rotates easier and Cat claims it takes 10 h.p. less to turn it at the same speed as the stock Challenger.

I am really impressed with the Powerclaw. I have never seen a track perform the way it does in the deep dry powder and it does not lack in any other conditions.

 

[Perk]

Wow, you gotta love this site....I just noticed someone gave me negative rep for posting my powerclaw vs challenger extreme REAL WORLD experience. And they called me a poser..... of course, the person left it so I can't tell who they are.

I know the rep points are kind of stupid, but they do mean something to me. They mean something because I have earned my greenies by spending literally hours typing responses on here helping people with technical issues. And I have spent so much time responding to PMs that my wife starts glaring at me if I even sit down at my desk and act like I am going to log onto Snowest. I have also recieved good rep points for sending other forum members spare parts that I don't need anymore for free (and I even paid the shipping).

Thanks for the negative rep whoever you are. I'd sure like to ride with you so I could take you into some of South West Idaho's finest backcountry and show you who the poser really is.

Cheers!
Chris

 

[Skinner]

Wow, you gotta love this site....I just noticed someone gave me negative rep for posting my powerclaw vs challenger extreme REAL WORLD experience. And they called me a poser..... of course, the person left it so I can't tell who they are.

I know the rep points are kind of stupid, but they do mean something to me. They mean something because I have earned my greenies by spending literally hours typing responses on here helping people with technical issues. And I have spent so much time responding to PMs that my wife starts glaring at me if I even sit down at my desk and act like I am going to log onto Snowest. I have also recieved good rep points for sending other forum members spare parts that I don't need anymore for free (and I even paid the shipping).

Thanks for the negative rep whoever you are. I'd sure like to ride with you so I could take you into some of South West Idaho's finest backcountry and show you who the poser really is.

Cheers!
Chris

Here is a little green to make up for it!