Too all those retarded mt. Riders
- Thread starter mwv
- Start date
Too those that are going to ride in the interior in BC this weekend, BE VERY CAREFULL!!! the avy report has just gone up too high/extreme. Please as safe as possible this weekend.....
R
Raff_9001M
Well-known member
I have been a wildland firefighter for the USFS for about 15 years. What does that have to do with Avalanches - not much but it does lend itself well to analyzing risk in an unpredictable einvironment. In our line of work it is the most experienced and the least experienced that are at the forefront of fireline fatalities.
That being said and reading posts that highlight statistics that indicate a higher percentage of avy deaths are those that have had training and experience -- I would ask if the article relates the amount of lives saved because of training and experience. As stated in earlier posts I think more experience means more exposure which increases risk but can lead to more knowledge. The only thing that scares me about training (I see this ALL the time in the fire world) is that it can teach you all the terminology and you can sound like an expert but you may be a complete idiot in the field. We probably all know these kinds of people.
The other thing I question are those posts that say ride the trail because it is less risky. I certainly have no data to back this up but I would guess more riders die, are injured or have very close calls on the trail than in the backcountry in a given year. Anyone who has ridden the Black Hills over President's Day weekend might agree with that.
That being said and reading posts that highlight statistics that indicate a higher percentage of avy deaths are those that have had training and experience -- I would ask if the article relates the amount of lives saved because of training and experience. As stated in earlier posts I think more experience means more exposure which increases risk but can lead to more knowledge. The only thing that scares me about training (I see this ALL the time in the fire world) is that it can teach you all the terminology and you can sound like an expert but you may be a complete idiot in the field. We probably all know these kinds of people.
The other thing I question are those posts that say ride the trail because it is less risky. I certainly have no data to back this up but I would guess more riders die, are injured or have very close calls on the trail than in the backcountry in a given year. Anyone who has ridden the Black Hills over President's Day weekend might agree with that.
Or anyone that has ridden trails in MN or the like. High speeds, narrow trails, blind corners, lots of drinkers, lots of machines on the trail. It isn't avy danger but they stuff lots of sleds into trees, fences, other sleds in the midwest.
Then come to Silverton CO and ride the trail out of town to Deer Park. Just try and tell me there isn't SERIOUS avy danger on that trail. I am sure there are lots of them like that out there.
Regardless, mother nature is incredibly unpredictable. Just when you think you know it all, watch out for the curve ball coming your way. We take risks when riding. The wiser more experienced among us have more to work with calculating those risks, and we all get lucky now and then.
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Today I was the "Retard". I don't have my own sled right now so I was riding my brothers old XLT. I am a big guy and that sled just will not climb very high in the powder with me on it. I was riding away today and just having a good time side hilling along the bottom of the hill and saw a guy stuck. I thought I would be nice and side hill over to him and help him out. He was not high on the hill at all and I still could not make it to him. I had to turn and come down. As I was coming down I looked at the dude that was stuck. I noticed that the hill was coming down. It was not sliding fast and it was not a big slide, but it still could have covered me or the guy that was stuck. The slab was exactly as wide as my my sidehill mark. I am so greatful that I couldn't make it to the stuck sled, because if I would have the slab would have been wider and it would have rolled us both. At that moment I realized that I just did something very stupid and I put someone else in danger. His riding buddies were really nice to me considering what had just happened. I have been riding the mountains around Star Valley Wyoming for a long time. I have never seen an avalanche, I had a real wake up call today. I am very greatful that I got my wake up call with out getting myself or someone else hurt or killed. It is so easy to get focused on riding and over look danger. I will ride with a different awareness for the rest of my life. It can happen anytime anywere, I would have never thought that were I was riding would trigger a slide. I was really low on the hill and it was not really that steep. The mistake I made was not thinking about the steep hill above me and the line I just cut at the bottom of it, which cause the slab to fracture much higher on the hill. The snow was pretty unstable in spots today so we were being cautious, and it still happened. I will ALWAYS give other riders proper space from now on. Trying to be nice almost ended really bad today. If I am going to trigger a slide I don't want to get someone else caught in it.
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Kaleb,
eeeeasy brother we are on agreement here !
Yes I ride in the mountians, sometimes in your own backyard. I wear a beacon, carry a probe and have the gear I need and some for others that should have. I have learned some things along the way, many the hard way.
I was simply pointing out there is more to avy deaths then just burial which is the only cause a beacon addresses. I am very pro beacon, theres no gray there.
The only thing black in white is the decison, PERIOD !
Ease up brother I'm on your side of this
E
EagleRiverDee
Well-known member
Great post. You made a mistake, recognized it, and didn't just shrug it off- you learned from it. And better yet, posted it here so the rest of us could learn too. Thanks much.
I couldn't disagree with you more. Thats about the same as saying we don't need paramedics just morticians. Check my pics and see... Trauma or not I'm sure glad we had the equipment since there was no way I lived. Glad they didn't wait and come back the next day to dig out my corpse.
I don't know how many times I've waved off guys or yelled down to the group or got on the radio that I don't need help to get unstuck......and they don't listen.
Don't get me wrong....I love the help and appreciate it but....why put another person in danger.
With a shovel and a thought out plan to get going again, you should be able to handle your situation yourself.....most of the time. Just one aspect of this thread....and...
Usually in the group I ride with...if one person has doubts about snow stability or the area then the whole group moves on....usually. And when the whole group doesn't agree you see it split into two distinct groups...those that agree and those that don't.
Don't get me wrong....I love the help and appreciate it but....why put another person in danger.
With a shovel and a thought out plan to get going again, you should be able to handle your situation yourself.....most of the time. Just one aspect of this thread....and...
Usually in the group I ride with...if one person has doubts about snow stability or the area then the whole group moves on....usually. And when the whole group doesn't agree you see it split into two distinct groups...those that agree and those that don't.
And then in those few breaths you realize what you smell......booze and dope.
That explains a lot....stupid is as stupid does.
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Yeah, Batgirl & I have a couple neighbors that ride in the same place unfortunately from time to time. They can't do ANYTHING without being wasted, we avoid them like the PLAGUE!!!!!!!
Drunktarded is no way to ride.
Whats a "beacon"? Whats a "highmark"? "Avy"? I live in Jamaica but would like to ride in your "mountainys" someday. But honestly... that guy at the beginning who wants to come scream at me and belittle me kinda is scary. A ways back... even though we never seen snow, we here in Jamaica decided to enter the olympics with a bobsled team. Had NO CLUE what we were doing... but with help, coaching and time... we actually competed with skill!
Just thought I would lighten the mood and make a point together. The mountains are the HOLY GRAIL of snowmobiling. But just like the freeway... not everyone is smart or knows what they are doing. Gettin mad yourself wont change anything...
Just thought I would lighten the mood and make a point together.
The mountains are the HOLY GRAIL of snowmobiling. But just like the freeway... not everyone is smart or knows what they are doing. Gettin mad yourself wont change anything...
S
snowmobiler
Well-known member
i agree but there is way more stupid straight folks out there than drunktards imo.
Wtf
So much negativity, should try and get rid of all that pent up Sh&t and go for a mountian ride does wonders for the soul
So much negativity, should try and get rid of all that pent up Sh&t and go for a mountian ride does wonders for the soul
H
high time
Well-known member
Responding to the original post..You're so right!!!!!!
We're lucky to get out West once a year. Yes, we'd like to climb, but we can lay off, if it seems like we should. A good wake up call last year watching a recovery at Jefferson last year.
I could see by the tracks there had been a lot of stupid riding just before the accident. By a lot of riders. That scares me. Because just blindly following the wrong guy can kill you. Don't follow someone into a trap. Use your own brain.
Owen
We're lucky to get out West once a year. Yes, we'd like to climb, but we can lay off, if it seems like we should. A good wake up call last year watching a recovery at Jefferson last year.
I could see by the tracks there had been a lot of stupid riding just before the accident. By a lot of riders. That scares me. Because just blindly following the wrong guy can kill you. Don't follow someone into a trap. Use your own brain.
Owen
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