Yes, and look at all the posts by people who only have a couple posts and just happened to join up and only post in this thread, and similar threads. Whom I'm sure the staff can tell you have matching IPs to other users who tend to complain alot..
SNOWEST FORUMS: Member Comments on "Letter to All Members"
- Thread starter Adrenaline Revolution
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Yes, and look at all the posts by people who only have a couple posts and just happened to join up and only post in this thread, and similar threads. Whom I'm sure the staff can tell you have matching IPs to other users who tend to complain alot..
I am sorry that after reading/replying to some 1,100 posts in this thread you feel I am not listening to the arguments being made. While there are many who think this will be the utter demise of SnoWest, there are also many who disagree with that point of view.
Will the forums change? YES.
There can be no doubt about it.
But while change is always painful and often unwelcome, it is not always bad or the end of the world as we know it.
I can only invite you to stick around, continue participating and watch how this all unfolds over the next several weeks. Perhaps you will be pleasantly surprised.
I think it's fair to say everyone in this thread is concerned for the well being of SnoWest and most have some deeply held passions for this place.
Sorry if my hundreds of replies in this thread come across as unprofessional or lacking in informational content. I will continue to try harder to do a better job.
In August 5, 1864, Farragut won a great victory in the Battle of Mobile Bay. Mobile was then the Confederacy's last major port open on the Gulf of Mexico. The bay was heavily mined (tethered naval mines were known as torpedoes at the time) [1]. Farragut ordered his fleet to charge the bay. When the monitor USS Tecumseh struck a mine and sank, the others began to pull back.
Farragut could see the ships pulling back from his high perch, lashed to the rigging of his flagship the USS Hartford. "What's the trouble?" was shouted through a trumpet from the flagship to the USS Brooklyn.
"Torpedoes!" was shouted back in reply. "Damn the torpedoes!" said Farragut, "Four bells. Captain Drayton, go ahead! Jouett, full speed!"[2][3] The bulk of the fleet succeeded in entering the bay. Farragut then triumphed over the opposition of heavy batteries in Fort Morgan and Fort Gaines to defeat the squadron of Admiral Franklin Buchanan.
He was promoted to vice admiral on December 21, 1864, and to admiral on July 25, 1866, after the war.
With a poll its very easy to obtain the outcome you desire.
And while they continue to say its not about the money, and there is some truth to that, its also all about the money.
Two opposing views of the very same coin. While opposite still one in the same. You really can't separate the one from the other in reality.
A better analogy would be if someone got in your favorite truck and moved the seat position, mirrors and radio settings..then broke off all the controls. When you told them you did not like the new settings...they slapped you with a 10$ fee and told you not to worry it was just a few changes for the better...you will get use to it.
With literally millions of free sites, it is easy to cherry pick sites to argue both sides of this debate.
Bottom line is that if free sites were not profitable, the internet would die off.
Harris has infered that they just wants the forum to pay for itself. It should not be hard to get enough ad revenue to break even.
The value of this forum comes from it members, not copy editors, writers, glossy photos, or real industry players. The only compensation that we get is to have a FREE place to share information. Harris does not pay one red cent to the number one asset on this site. It's MEMBERS.
How about 10 bucks a month for our snow reports or ride reports? Can we charge for the photos we post?
Some of the posts here are downright funny. Any rebate for humor?
Is it so wrong to wonder why one of the biggest and best sled sites on the
web can't even break even?
If you truly had no control over anything that has changed, that would be the case. But since both you and I know that you DO have control over much of it, we both know thats not the case.
This has been much debate if the decision was foolhardly or brave.
Many ships and lives were lost. Many feel that a blockade would have accomplished the same without the losses.
Sometimes it just boils down to, "fools rush in".
Christopher,
Are you SURE you've read every post? Or are you playing hot potato with this question?
I agree, however I think the issue is multifold though, people aren't understanding the correlation between all the different things they are complaining about. The changes to the site, the site being slow and the requirement to go pay.
They are seeing it as.
A)
The Site was changed --> Now it's slow --> which means we need to upgrade the hardware --> which means it needs to go to pay.
When in reality from what I understand
B)
The Site needed to go to pay ---> changes were made to make it to improve the site to make it worth while to go to pay ---> change, and most likely dying old hardware, and increased traffic as we move into the winter months slowed the site down ---> thus requiring new hardware (in theory..see my other post in regards to threading, and concurrent request)
Once the people in group A) stop having temper tantrums, and realize what's going on is B). I think things will hum along nicely
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A lot of big sites can't break even, and in all honestly snowest isn't that big. It's ranked 30,316 in the US
While other special interest forums, of the same caliber are all ranked much higher (for example)
Reefs Reefcentral.com is ranked 6,123
Jeeps
Jeepforum.com is ranked 6,157
Camera Gear
dpreview.com is ranked 820
Hot Rods
jalopyjournal is ranked 14,777
my point is.. Until Snowest gets up into the higher ranks it's going to be very hard for it to survive on ad dollars alone. There is a point where you get enough traffic that you require better gear, but not enough traffic that it can pay for it's self. I think SW is unfortunately in that stage.
Again, there are a lot of sites that are free that are struggling to make money. And I wouldn’t call it “cherry picking” if you pick some of the biggest sites as a sample. If anyone should be able to generate revenue, they should. As I argued earlier, they are able to command much higher per-click/view prices. And make no mistake, the pay model is coming, it's just a matter of when it arrives.
http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2343139,00.asp
http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2355962,00.asp
And the value of this community wouldn't exist without a generous donation by your friends at SW in providing the forum. While you prefer to imply an ulterior motive to SW charging, I'd prefer to take the statement that they can't generate enough revenue using ads on its face. In the end it doesn't really matter because they've ultimately decided this is what they want to do.
I notice you generally take what you want out of people's comments (things that are positive toward your view) and address only those.
What about the fact that forum's don't charge? AND, everyone I do business with says they're losing money? How long has this site been losing money?
And, if this site is going to be the biggest/baddest site, what about the revenue generated from all the businesses wanting to advertise here?
What about how smooth things were going 6 months ago vs. now? How many of the members have asked for these new bells and whistles? Will the price still be $10 per year 3 years from now, or will it be $20 per year?
And again I will say that it is possible to show plenty of special interest sites, both larger and smaller, that are profitable. As well as not profitable.
Snowest is one of the biggest and best of the sled forums. The big four routinely read this forum and react to feedback from here.
If this move is not about making big profits, then is should be possible to float this site on non-member revenues.
Snowest is one of the biggest and best of the sled forums. The big four routinely read this forum and react to feedback from here.
If this move is not about making big profits, then is should be possible to float this site on non-member revenues.
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well then someone has got your lingo and speach (in writing) pathology down to an absolute science.
you should be flattered, You now have your first 100% certifiable stalker
Thumpertalk.com and KTMTalk .com. Both bigger and both profitable.
Sure there are more bikers but then there are many more bike websites.
They work because the are the best at what they do. And they started out they same way as Snowest.
And articles about newspapers going pay for view is not valid.
No one is asking for a free digital copy of snowest magazine.
The newspapers are not written by their readers. The photos are not members photos. All the info on this site comes from it's members and not by a paid staff as it is on a newspaper.
But as you said. In the end it doesn't really matter because they've ultimately decided this is what they want to do. We just have to bend over and take it.
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