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Long Rod PRO Motor

Polaris started out as a backyard shop. :face-icon-small-hap

....and the most reliable 2-stroke in Polaris' lineup over the last half-dozen years (and most over-achieving) came into existence almost 15 years ago. That isn't exactly a ringing endorsement of their current engineering team....
 
I was also wondering this. Thx!

Great question, requires a complex anwser.

Piston life is different for different people ( Alot is riding on the sled owner. )

Example, I have a few customers from the Midwest that are an exception to the rule......Example.

These guys and over 50 and they don't drink anymore.......there sleds are kept in a heated garage and before they go riding the warm up their motors before they go and when they ride its 250 to 350 miles per day normaly.
and if their sleds sit out over night they heat cycle them and give the motors plenty of time to get happy. I just built a motor for one of these guys and he ask when he needs to come back for pistons. I told him 15,000 miles.

Now if your a 20 year old and your sled sits outside and you bar hop all day and the sled gets started & stopped every hour all day long and has almost no warm up...........Pistons in this type of sled ( should ) be addressed sooner.

Now that explains flatlanders.

As for Mountain sled & sled owners its a little different.

I question people closely about where & how they ride, and what type of aftermarket parts are on the sled.

Warm-up proceedure
Riding area
Sled owner age
Riding style have effects ( Such as jumping ) and mass over REVS from inexperience throttle control. ( Landing at full throttle on high traction snow )

All these differences have cause & effect reactions to the motor.

Your exact question can not be answer other then I have a 3 year warranty on the $2500 package and warranty the motor completely other then.........

Lean condition
Detonation
Lack of proper lubrication.
Poor warm up ( This is the easiest to see when you open a motor )

You can search the internet, And you will be hard pressed to find a customer of mine that has had a problem at Indy Specialty with a warranty issue. Even when a customer has done something wrong its noramly covered & followed by a small tongue lashing.

In the 800 Big Block prime I was doing between 150 & 250 bottom-ends a season. ( There are few shops ) that can handle this type of load.

18 work benches for 2 guys and there were times that wasn't enough.

I don't know if I answered your question but thats all I got on that topic.

Dan
 
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Thank you Dan for the response. Your Long Rod Pro engine is exactly what the doctor ordered IMHO for what I want -- which is a reliable motor that will last years. We've spoke on the phone twice and you can expect my Pro down there in Welch in about 2 years, if not sooner. Thank you.
 
ok Dan, i got a quick question for you because i ain't to smart. when you change the height between the top of the case to the bottom of the cylinder on a turbo charged pro. does this affect the way the engine runs. i ask this since i have been thinking that you are going to be adding case volume to the motor and would that cause a lean or rich condition. and it might not cause either. that is why i am asking. myself and whittaker will be sending you both motors just waiting for the season to end. and if i do send you the motor, how much of it do you need. ie what do i take off of it before i ship it to you.
 
ok Dan, i got a quick question for you because i ain't to smart. when you change the height between the top of the case to the bottom of the cylinder on a turbo charged pro. does this affect the way the engine runs. i ask this since i have been thinking that you are going to be adding case volume to the motor and would that cause a lean or rich condition. and it might not cause either. that is why i am asking. myself and whittaker will be sending you both motors just waiting for the season to end. and if i do send you the motor, how much of it do you need. ie what do i take off of it before i ship it to you.


You need to remove your engine from the sled and ship in to Indy Dan. Or just bring your whole sled to him. That's what he told me anyways. I've never removed a motor from a sled so I'm not sure which option I'll go with.
 
ok Dan, i got a quick question for you because i ain't to smart. when you change the height between the top of the case to the bottom of the cylinder on a turbo charged pro. does this affect the way the engine runs. i ask this since i have been thinking that you are going to be adding case volume to the motor and would that cause a lean or rich condition. and it might not cause either. that is why i am asking. myself and whittaker will be sending you both motors just waiting for the season to end. and if i do send you the motor, how much of it do you need. ie what do i take off of it before i ship it to you.

As for the motor all I need is - Complete motor less electrical & fuel system.

Has super said, You can pull it yourself, Or if your not comfortable with that you can bring it here or have a trusted shop around you pull it.

I have not personaly run a turbo set up yet, however we are going to run a turbo on the asphalt next spring. ( I have no concerns of this being a problem )

Dan

Dan
 
Hey Dan I have a question about the long rod motor. You give a price of $2500 for it if the cores are in decent shape. What would a guy be looking at if he lost a skirt and smoked his motor and then came to you?
 
Hey Dan I have a question about the long rod motor. You give a price of $2500 for it if the cores are in decent shape. What would a guy be looking at if he lost a skirt and smoked his motor and then came to you?

Great question, The $2500.00 is based on a running motor for the most part ( BUT ) if the cylinder sleeves are broken off there is no upcharge.

If the case is broken, or it needs the water pump seals replaced, then there is a welding charge, and a small labor charge to rebuild the case water pump. after welding they have to be replaced.

It never hurts to send you case no matter how bad its broken we can fix case you can't imagin can be repaired. If we say we can repair it then we still warranty it for 3 years.

Dan
 
Thanks for the quick response Dan. So seems like this would be a more cost effective route than having a dealer replace the motor.

This would be my route if my sled goes down, hoping it doesn't haha.
 
Great question, The $2500.00 is based on a running motor for the most part ( BUT ) if the cylinder sleeves are broken off there is no upcharge.

If the case is broken, or it needs the water pump seals replaced, then there is a welding charge, and a small labor charge to rebuild the case water pump. after welding they have to be replaced.

It never hurts to send you case no matter how bad its broken we can fix case you can't imagin can be repaired. If we say we can repair it then we still warranty it for 3 years.

Dan


Hey Dan: What if catastrophe strikes, and a piece of cylinder chunk breaks off and falls down into the crank and takes that out? How much upchrge then? :face-icon-small-hap
 
Hey Dan: What if catastrophe strikes, and a piece of cylinder chunk breaks off and falls down into the crank and takes that out? How much upchrge then? :face-icon-small-hap

We get alot of case sent in that have holes blowen thru the bottom and the injector area by the reed cage gets wasted, and we repair and remachine it. $50 to a $250.00 welding and machining charge.

all depends on the damage, much past $250.00 we normaly suggest a new case unless the customer approves more work.

if we fix it we warranty it.

Dan
 
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Dan, what if I want to have a better performing motor. Do you have any options for porting or a different cylinder head? What about using someone else's products ie; Doug Ruth Porting and PAR cylinder head and CPI pipe along with your bottom end and pistons?

Thanks, Dawg
 
Hey Dan...I gots a few questions...

what...

oil should I run?
sparkplug?
what weights?
helix angle?
gearing?
jetting?:face-icon-small-ton
when is my motor done?
if I come down can I borrow some tools?
the internet said I should....
are you busy?
it will only take a minute
I'm on the way...can you stay open for 5 more minutes (or an hour)...LOL
plus many many more............................

Not sure why I got into this biz AFTER the abuse "I" inflicted on you...cant thank you enough for "learning me" (circa 1988 to 1992) a few things about these snowmachines...BJ:face-icon-small-coo
 
Hey Dan...I gots a few questions...

what...

oil should I run?
sparkplug?
what weights?
helix angle?
gearing?
jetting?:face-icon-small-ton
when is my motor done?
if I come down can I borrow some tools?
the internet said I should....
are you busy?
it will only take a minute
I'm on the way...can you stay open for 5 more minutes (or an hour)...LOL
plus many many more............................

Not sure why I got into this biz AFTER the abuse "I" inflicted on you...cant thank you enough for "learning me" (circa 1988 to 1992) a few things about these snowmachines...BJ:face-icon-small-coo

LMFAO.... thats some good sh!t there....lol
 
2012 800 RUSH

Dan, what if I want to have a better performing motor. Do you have any options for porting or a different cylinder head? What about using someone else's products ie; Doug Ruth Porting and PAR cylinder head and CPI pipe along with your bottom end and pistons?

Thanks, Dawg

Wow !! You asked alot of questions in a short paragraph.

#1 I am a big fan of Dougs porting in Lake race & Full Mod Motors ( have not seen alot of his porting for pump gas trail motors. )

Translation of sled customer to performance shop is a very complex arena.

Most of the time the sled owner wants more then is possible given his or her situation, And most sled shops main goals are to improve performance. The amount of horse power the OEM's get out of the motors has gone up.

The quality of the fuel has gone down ( If you think about it, That is an amazing undertaking ).

It is important for the sled owner and the performance shop to get on the same page....... But sometimes they are not even on the same chapter.

The reason for this gets more complex every year, Alot of times the sled shop knows that the customer is expecting more then is possible with the amount of $$$$$ set aside for the project.

Indy Specialty for the everyday rider is not a big fan of porting or Big Bores....... Reason being ( Me the Owner Dan Turen ) Is 50 yrs old this year. And alot of our customers want mainly 3 things.

#1 - Above all.... dependability.
#2 - Easy of service, and they do not want to be put on the trailer by exclusive parts that cannot be repaired or exchanged at a dealer.
#3 - Bang for Buck.

When the big twin made its way into the market and the 3 cyl died off, I have stayed away from the performance side of the twin simply because
the gains for the money never mde much sense to me.

And the fuel injection systems Polaris has designed prior to the CFI 2 has not given Indy Specialty a warm fuzy feeling.

Porting makes cylinder exchange unpractical so we rarely do it anymore.
Big Bores make motors to exclusive for the direction Indy Specialty is going in.

Indy Specialty Has been laying in the weeds for many years somewhat hiding from motors and chassis that just have seemed alittle behind unless the sled owner took charge and made the sled work for him or here.

Last fall I bought a new Victory Vision, And I must say Polaris proved to me that if they put their minds to it they can build some of the most amazing products.

The New PRO Chassis ( RMK, Or RUSH ) with the CFI 2 Motors has lite a fire in Indy Specialty and made Snowmobiling fun again.

Last Winter my local Polaris Dealer ( Red Wing Polaris ) Rerally push me to get a New 800 PRO R RUSH.

After the frist trip the Ash River in Northern Minnesota I was hooked on the chassis and really could not believe how much I enjoyed riding it. ( Were talking about a guy who only liked lake racing and bar hoping 40 miles a day max ) To a 50 yr old that now wanted to ride all day !!

I had the Big Windshield on it, and i had the side wind protectors on it, and all the storage bags......This machine was Warm to ride, had lots of storage, and most of all fun to ride.

My only disappointment was the top end speed, ( 99mph flat out on the lake ) The first trip I was schooled by a new 2012 E-Tech Ski Doo.

Next trip we did alittle work to the clutching, and brought a few extra clutches with so we could tune and adjust fast.

The first test ride out on the lake i knew i was onto something. ( 105mph ) The ski doo boys had heard in the bar that I had the 800 Rush running alittle better this year. ( There were 3 800r's this trip ) and a white 2011 they said was the fastest. We lined them up un a fire road and they drop an arm. The RUSH jumped the DOO pretty bad out of the ole and I never saw him for at least a 1/4 mile. ( I did over hear him tell his buddies he was catching me ) That is possible because that night out on the lake at extended full throttle for miles on Kabetogama 2 of the Doo's got by me at creap. My speedo was on 106mph on the max.

The next morning i made one more change and went for a test ride ahead of the group and saw 110mph on the max speed indicastor and could hold 108 pretty easy.

The Doo Boys rode with another group that day I and I never got my chance get back into the top end war.

This was with stock 22/36 gears with the biggest wide clyde windshield polaris makes.

All the ski doo's had the mid-high windshields, I refused to to go to the mid-high windshield. This windshield costs you a solid 2 to 3 mph on the big end.

The wrap up.

This summer I want to get my head around tuning this sled and learning the CFI2 on the asphalt. so we pounded this sled all summer 7 race week-ends of test and tune 5 to six hours every Saturday and race on Sunday.

1/8 Mile track ( 660 Feet )

This 2012 800 PROR went from 92mph the first week-end.

To Week Seven, To 115.8mph Back to back runs

Stock porting, Stock Bore, Stock Crankcase, Stock Stroke.
Altered OEM Pipe. Altered OEM Canister ( Stock sound ).It has a fuel management system on it.

It was running race fuel, as would any other Single pipes OEM 800 or Big Bore for that matter to run this speed. A turbo would need race fuel to run 115mph.

It was an eye opening summer to take a trail sled to numbers most people can't imagin. I will post the time slips.

3 time trials -

C. Miller my Step son is the driver.

Dan
 

Attachments

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Hey Dan...I gots a few questions...

what...

oil should I run?
sparkplug?
what weights?
helix angle?
gearing?
jetting?:face-icon-small-ton
when is my motor done?
if I come down can I borrow some tools?
the internet said I should....
are you busy?
it will only take a minute
I'm on the way...can you stay open for 5 more minutes (or an hour)...LOL
plus many many more............................

Not sure why I got into this biz AFTER the abuse "I" inflicted on you...cant thank you enough for "learning me" (circa 1988 to 1992) a few things about these snowmachines...BJ:face-icon-small-coo

Big John.........That is sum funny chit !!! ( Farmer :face-icon-small-hap:face-icon-small-win ) LOL!! That was GREAT !!!

John, I am pretty sure you would still be where you are to today ( Doing what you do ) and as good a tuner as you are if we never met, But Thank You !! For the kind words !!

Dan
 
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