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Gone Sleddin
Active member
anyone running these kits at lower elevations? is there any changes that need to be made going from 1200ft to 8000ft?
Boondocker Turbo Pro install pics MLC #2
- Thread starter SNOW JW
- Start date
i agree with this post completly. I have a ton of r&d on the stock injectors and you can not flow that much fuel out of these. i have tried a 2-1 , and 4-1rising rate fpr and they will not fuel anything over 6 psi at 7000 feet.
i have some custom ported injectors that are working very very good. we have a hand full of kits out and they seem to be working very good with this set up. The ecu is the problem. if you data log each pull you will see where the problems are and where you need to add fuel. Our fueling problem was at 1 bar. didn't matter what rpm or throttle position but at 1 bar the sled would go lean and run out of fuel. until the fuel caught back up then it was rock and roll!!
So Have you rode a Turbo Performace kit? i would like to know if you have so i can get some good feed back.
I also want to say that all of our r&d has been done on our dollar and not any one elses. So please don't throw out comments that blanket everyone. some people are working there tails off and are taking alot of pride in the work.
i do agree alot of guys should put more time in the kit. But it just seems like first to market gets the worm and that is not how it should be.
i do agree alot of guys should put more time in the kit. But it just seems like first to market gets the worm and that is not how it should be.
Yes maybe. We need it explained to us how Boondocker is supplying enough fuel for that kind of boost. Not saying it isn't true but there has been a compelling argument against it brought forth. I am one guy planning on getting the 3d mapping for my turbo pro and cranking up the boost to 10 at 2000 ft so it would be good to know.
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Arcteryx
Well-known member
x2^^^ I'm curious to this as well. Hearing lots of reports that the BD kit is running great now and pulling bigger boost numbers, so that makes me curious about the 3 previous posts??? How is BD doing it then?
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theshadowrider
Well-known member
Are you guys are trying to tell us that they can't do something they ARE doing. I can assure you they are getting over 6 pounds of boost!i agree with this post completly. I have a ton of r&d on the stock injectors and you can not flow that much fuel out of these. i have tried a 2-1 , and 4-1rising rate fpr and they will not fuel anything over 6 psi at 7000 feet.
i have some custom ported injectors that are working very very good. we have a hand full of kits out and they seem to be working very good with this set up. The ecu is the problem. if you data log each pull you will see where the problems are and where you need to add fuel. Our fueling problem was at 1 bar. didn't matter what rpm or throttle position but at 1 bar the sled would go lean and run out of fuel. until the fuel caught back up then it was rock and roll!!
So Have you rode a Turbo Performace kit? i would like to know if you have so i can get some good feed back.
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INKEDRIDER
ACCOUNT CLOSED
I was talking about Boondocker but also stating that in general no one should ever do that to there customers.
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INKEDRIDER
ACCOUNT CLOSED
At 170 degree charge temps there going to have to run over 6psi just to get 4 psi I would like to encourage you guys that its not all about the number its what you are actually running efficiently, I have seen 7psi walk away from 10psi. Boondocker upside down and is scrambling to give you guys something else like the 3d, come on guys whats next! they were wrong about releasing there kits and they should give you guys your money back.
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Silber
Well-known member
4psi of boost at 4500 is all we could get on stock injectors.
Your turbo kit should come with a unit like this. http://www.snowestonline.com/forum/showthread.php?t=254367
But most builders will go the cheap route, and pocket your money instead.
Your turbo kit should come with a unit like this. http://www.snowestonline.com/forum/showthread.php?t=254367
But most builders will go the cheap route, and pocket your money instead.
Maybe but the bd stuff is running good so far. I can tell by the clutching compared to my 700 dragon rg turbo that the power is there at 6 lbs. Really all the kits have the third injector anyhow so why would they not use it if they had to.
It would be nice if BD would chime in and set us all straight.
It would be nice if BD would chime in and set us all straight.
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Tweedleditt
New member
Boondockers is closed today, in honor of William Young, who passed last weekend, savedbygrace will make a post later, thx D
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savedbygrace
Well-known member
Precise fuel control is a must to overcome the above stated low boost thresholds, and the Boondocker control box is the only one able to achieve this precise control as of right now. Now read what I have to say very carefully. The way that the rest of the control boxes out there are controlling the stock injectors is the problem. I’m sure that even the slowest to catch on will get there eventually, but as for right now the Boondocker 3D control box is the only turbo Polaris Pro Control Box that drives the stock injectors properly. This enables Boondocker users to efficiently drive the stock injectors to their maximum capacity. I know that this statement is somewhat vague, but in the present company, I trust that Boondocker customers will understand, why we are reluctant to give away the secrets to why the Boondocker control box is the only control box currently working properly on the Pro.
Snow4… as a Dobeck engineer your tone of frustration is understandable, maybe you should consider spending a little more time making you box work than trying to argue that the Boondocker doesn’t. Enough said.
Inked… we have four Boondocker turbo Pros running at Bear Lake this weekend. I understand that you might be there too. After you have seen them run, and if you want to continue this conversation come find me at the race, I will be more than pleased to conclude this face to face.
As a side note air boxes rigidly mounted to the engine (i.e. through billet throttle body boots) tend to crack.
Junior
Snow4… as a Dobeck engineer your tone of frustration is understandable, maybe you should consider spending a little more time making you box work than trying to argue that the Boondocker doesn’t. Enough said.
Inked… we have four Boondocker turbo Pros running at Bear Lake this weekend. I understand that you might be there too. After you have seen them run, and if you want to continue this conversation come find me at the race, I will be more than pleased to conclude this face to face.
As a side note air boxes rigidly mounted to the engine (i.e. through billet throttle body boots) tend to crack.
Junior
I can only state what we at turbo performance have run into and seen with our own eyes. We are taking a different route then the duals. But i know for a fact stock injectors will not flow 8 psi. and the math equations will back it up.
How many of you guys have datalogged your performance? take a snap shot of it. On and off throttle and elevation changes then you will see really what is going on.
sensors that we are running on our sled to R&d are charge tube temp sensor, boost sensor, tps sensor, afr, egt, rpm, injector duty cycle sensor, 2 fuel pressure guages one on the front side of rail and one on back side, boost guage in the oil tank, Baro sensor, air desity taped to the bars, pressure guage in the pipe. All are being data logged.
How many of you guys have datalogged your performance? take a snap shot of it. On and off throttle and elevation changes then you will see really what is going on.
sensors that we are running on our sled to R&d are charge tube temp sensor, boost sensor, tps sensor, afr, egt, rpm, injector duty cycle sensor, 2 fuel pressure guages one on the front side of rail and one on back side, boost guage in the oil tank, Baro sensor, air desity taped to the bars, pressure guage in the pipe. All are being data logged.
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savedbygrace
Well-known member
Oh Boy… Not sure what else to say… Buy you guys books, send you to school, and all you do is eat the pages…
Brycter,
Maybe you should come to the races too.
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Kestrel2126
Well-known member
Junior, are you going to be offering a throttle body boot reinforcement plate, similar to what was available for the IQ. I see what you are saying about a rigid mount, however Polaris' cheap TB boots delaminate so easily, I feel like I need to do something. Alternatively, if Boyesen ever release their reed cage (all aluminum w/small rubber hose connections), any reason they wouldn't work with the kit?
80% - 90% duty cycle is the same it doesn't matter what box it is. The only difference is fuel pressure pounding the injector. you cannot flow 100% or 110% out of an injector. that is what i am fighting here.
you can argue this all day but that is the truth. it doesn't matter how you send the signal or where you get your signal from.
Well maybe i didn't go to the same schoool as some.
So teach me. Maybe i have been wrong for 18 years. I am humble enough to be taught. 
get your charge temps jacked up high enough and you dont need a whole lot of fuel as theres not a lot of air going through it.
boost # vs boost # aren't the same amount of airflow, its also heavily dependant on airflow VOLUME and temperature. YOU could run 10# with smoking hot air thats barely moving and yes, the injectors can feed it.. now take a much denser cold charge air with a better flowing system and your going to be moving a lot more lb/hr of air, so your going to max your injectors out a lot sooner to keep your afr readings proper.
air and fuel make power, so if you have x amount of fuel, i dont care what Boost # your hitting, there is only so much air being used with it if your afr is where its supposed to be. this isnt hard stuff. you can only make so much power on certain amounts of fuel, which is determine by the injectors ability to flow. Im also betting the calculations on the injector flows are ideal, which, lets face it, nothing flows at ideal levels.
I dont really have a bone to pick with anyone as I dont have a turbo pro, nor do i intend to ever have one, theres just a lot of simple stuff here that seems to be ignored or not mentioned at all.
boost # vs boost # aren't the same amount of airflow, its also heavily dependant on airflow VOLUME and temperature. YOU could run 10# with smoking hot air thats barely moving and yes, the injectors can feed it.. now take a much denser cold charge air with a better flowing system and your going to be moving a lot more lb/hr of air, so your going to max your injectors out a lot sooner to keep your afr readings proper.
air and fuel make power, so if you have x amount of fuel, i dont care what Boost # your hitting, there is only so much air being used with it if your afr is where its supposed to be. this isnt hard stuff. you can only make so much power on certain amounts of fuel, which is determine by the injectors ability to flow. Im also betting the calculations on the injector flows are ideal, which, lets face it, nothing flows at ideal levels.
I dont really have a bone to pick with anyone as I dont have a turbo pro, nor do i intend to ever have one, theres just a lot of simple stuff here that seems to be ignored or not mentioned at all.
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theshadowrider
Well-known member
Brycter. What can be done by you, and what they "are doing" are to different things. You are coming across like you think they are making this stuff up, which I know is not your intent, but they are running a enough fuel to get more than 6 pounds of boost. I am no engineer, and I am sure they are not interested in giving away their trade secrets, but maybe it has to do with the injector pulse/timing. (This is just a guess!) Maybe they are tuning their injectors more effectively to inject the fuel at the precise time. Instead of getting more flow, they are injecting the fuel more precise, allowing adequate fuel at the precise stroke of the engine optimizing the available fuel and not wasting "flow" at the wrong time. This is why they need the "3d" tuning because if it is not precisely tuned, then they get det and it goes lean as you have experienced. Just a thought.
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Brycter. What can be done by you, and what they "are doing" are to different things. You are coming across like you think they are making this stuff up, which I know is not your intent, QUOTE]
you are correct this is not my intentent here and i am in no way arguing that boondocker is not working hard. Sure i really don't think they should come on snowest and give out trade secrets. i try not to and don't exspect anyone else.
i undertstand everything ski-dooin it has said. We have all been around long enough to know the simple math and the workings of the motor and turbo's
please keep teaching me
