The original set up was that the wheels speed is matched by the conveyor. That would work if the wheels were powered, and the plane would not move. However, the jets produce thrust with no regard to the wheels. I think the question is flawed, it is impossible for the conveyor to match wheel speed because the plane WILL move forward, thus it's not possible for wheels and conveyor to match speed.This is the same as the scenario where an "unstoppable force" meets an "unmovable wall". It is not possible under any circumstance.
AirPlane on a Teardmill and Mythbusters
- Thread starter 6Mile
- Start date
This is the part people are not getting.
OK.....
Could a seaplane take-off going upstream?
yes
Another similation.....
Take a skateboard.
Pull it across the floor with a string & a fish scale.
Now put the skateboard on a treadmill & pull it forward with the same scale set-up.
You will find very little difference in the scale readings.
Why?
Because the skateboard is not propelled by the wheels,
just like an airplane
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I agree, but the treadmill connot match the wheel speed of the skateboard. The skateboard will move, but it is not possible for the treadmill to keep up. There is no way for the parameters of the question to be met.
Dam straight! This wouldn't be any fun if it made sense or if people didn't take it so seriosly.
IMSICK,But yet you feel the need to be an active contributor to the new thread..... In case you haven't noticed I went either way on this since Canadian highschools do not have an aeronautical engineering course..... But with that being said, break it down into it's parts.....
If you want it broke down in parts go to the following link and look at my post with the Free Body Diagram. It is not aeronautical engineering, but just an analysis of Newton's Laws. The Free Body Diagram explains the physics of the whole conveyor and airplane system:
http://www.snowest.com/fusetalk/mes...320689&STARTPAGE=14&FTVAR_FORUMVIEWTMP=Linear
Like I said, this has all been discussed before, and forgive me if I don't have the same enthusiasm as before. As I remember, we voted to have the avitar of RLG as the offical mascot of all Airplane-Conveyor threads
If you want it broke down in parts go to the following link and look at my post with the Free Body Diagram. It is not aeronautical engineering, but just an analysis of Newton's Laws. The Free Body Diagram explains the physics of the whole conveyor and airplane system:
http://www.snowest.com/fusetalk/mes...320689&STARTPAGE=14&FTVAR_FORUMVIEWTMP=Linear
Like I said, this has all been discussed before, and forgive me if I don't have the same enthusiasm as before. As I remember, we voted to have the avitar of RLG as the offical mascot of all Airplane-Conveyor threads
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You are correct in your post. This is a paradox that had to be clarified.
If the conveyor matches the velocity of the airplane, everthing works out fine. If the plane is moving forward at 100 mph, the conveyor will be moving in reverese at 100 mph and the wheels will be spinning at 200 mph.
If the conveyor matches the rotational speed of the tires, we create a paradox. As soon as the airplane starts moving forward, the conveyor will sense the speed of the tires and try to match it. Which in turn, causes the wheels to speed up, which in turn causes the conveyor to speed up. And we end up with the speed of the conveyor ultimately going to infinity.
Not true, the wheels would only be rotating at twice the takeoff speed.
Awww damn, I got sucked in again.
The question is loaded! Not enough info. But think of it this way, you put a skateboarder on a treadmill and turn it on, if he holds onto to handles, he isn't going anywhere, if he lets go, he will slowly lose speed until he falls off the back, but if he has a rocket on his back and touches it off, he is going to go forward, no matter what the wheel speed is!
PARADOX! That's the word I couldn't come up with, thank you. So if the coveyor matches airplane velocity the plane takes off. If rotational speed is matched, infinity is reached and the universe as we know it comes to an end.If I get sucked into this thread again that might be a blessing!
Not true, the wheels would only be rotating at twice the takeoff speed.
Awww damn, I got sucked in again.
You are correct if the conveyor matches the speed of the airplane as a whole. The distinction that I was trying to make is that "speed" can be defined in two different manners and we need to clarify which one we need to use.
1) Speed of the airplane in respect to the ground or another stationary object. If we use this definition of speed for programming the conveyor, you are correct and everything works wonderfully.
2) The rotational speed of the tires (the reading of the spedometer connected to the tires, if you will). This does not necessarily match the speed of the airplane. If the conveyor is programmed to match this definition of speed, you get the paradox.
The requirement says that the conveyor must match wheel speed, it doesn't require that the plane's speed match conveyor speed. Thus, no paradox.
After some serious thought...
..I've changed my mind.. The plane can,& WILL take off. The engines, prop or otherwise, ARE going to produce thrust forward.. Regardless of wheelspin. Even if the treadmill spins faster than the plane itself is actually rolling, it still is being influenced by the thrust of the power supply!! If the plane reaches a ground speed of 200mph. matched by the belt's 200mph in the opposite direction, the plane is still traveling 200mph!! The belt has absolutely no infuence on the plane's velocity that is brought about by the engines.
..I've changed my mind.. The plane can,& WILL take off. The engines, prop or otherwise, ARE going to produce thrust forward.. Regardless of wheelspin. Even if the treadmill spins faster than the plane itself is actually rolling, it still is being influenced by the thrust of the power supply!! If the plane reaches a ground speed of 200mph. matched by the belt's 200mph in the opposite direction, the plane is still traveling 200mph!! The belt has absolutely no infuence on the plane's velocity that is brought about by the engines.
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RMK7SledHead
Well-known member
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sldgy
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If the conveyor belt was covered with ice and you could keep the dang thing going straight, it would fly. PLUS, the smell would dissipate quicker.
jesus christ on a crutch...welcome to the light!!! Glad you could make it!
..I knew it all along.. I was just stirrin' the pot
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