i got a 2009 crossfire 600, will my barrings in there be ok because i have the act reverse?
2009-2011 Diamond Drive Bearing Failure
- Thread starter RickM
- Start date
There are several people I know personally that are running with no seals. No problems so far. One of them is a Turbo HCR that gets ridden hard every weekend. Dont believe it just because some fancy shop said so. Theres lots of people on here that dont make a dime off anyone that likely know just as much about this kind of stuff than any shop.
One of BDX's posts in this thread is completely wrong. It may be just worded poorly, but its still wrong. Be carefull.
One of BDX's posts in this thread is completely wrong. It may be just worded poorly, but its still wrong. Be carefull.
WOW that's a BOLD statement...... BDX took care of me when i visited them last winter. Remember BDX designed the 1st Diamond Drive and Cat
China and had them cheapen it up and now its all F***ed up, Now it makes BDX look bad.
I've basically been saying the same thing in this thread over and over and over. Not once have I said BDX was the problem. I have however, said that what they are saying to do to fix the problem is incorrect. If it wasn't written in one of my posts here, I have said it elsewhere.
Specifically: When they said to remove x amount form either end of the track shaft. Thats incorrect. Obviously. Maybe they meant from the end that couples with the ring gear, or the shoulder that seats against the brake side bearings. But that is not what they said. IMO, one should take an equal amount off the end that couples to the ring gear and the shoulder that mates with the brake side bearings. That should theoretically keep the drivers centered in the chassis. Or... Take some off the shoulder of the ring gear where the track shaft mates up, then take some off the shoulder where the brake side bearings mate up. Or take some off one end of the track shaft (the end that mates to the ring gear obviously) then push the drivers over to compensate.
The goal should be to load the giant bearing deep in the bottom of the case. This bearing can take much more load that any of the other bearings in the case. You can do that by taking material off the above mentioned items or shimming the case and or brake housing away from the chassis.
Also to sell the wider bearing and not acknowledge that it may or may not fit seems like either a poor understanding of whats going on with the cases and chassis.
And since it seems some people think a big name shop must be the expert, why are the big name shops that offer a "solution" to this problem not talking about the angular misalignment many people are seeing evidenced by the track mark on the planetary gear "thingy". Some may be seeing this because their bearing failed and this allowed the transfer gear to misalign, but I've seen it on cases that still have good bearings. "Ah, heck bubba, just throw a bigger bearing in there, that'll fixr up good" Sorry for that, I'm just a hair frustrated lately.
I'm not trying to bash BDX, I'm just trying to say that you, and many other people on this board (and some that don't even surf the internet) have done FAR, FAR, more than BDX to try and properly solve this problem and help other people do the same. I personally have spent hundreds of hours inspecting and repairing this problem on my sleds and other peoples sleds, then putting the info on this forum for everyone to benefit from. The pictorial posts you have shared have been priceless for probably hundreds forum members, if not thousands of people around the web. When was the last time a vendor do that? I think we should give credit where credit is due.
Cat is the problem, not BDX. Cat changed the case, or let someone tell them to change the case, or whatever happens in big corporate business. Who knows. It happens. All the manufacturers do it once in a while. But we do know they (cat) are the ones making sloppy chassis that have angular and width tolerances that a high school kid with a few minutes of instruction on fabrication could easily best.
Nobody is perfect. Especially me. If I'm wrong, please show me.
Specifically: When they said to remove x amount form either end of the track shaft. Thats incorrect. Obviously. Maybe they meant from the end that couples with the ring gear, or the shoulder that seats against the brake side bearings. But that is not what they said. IMO, one should take an equal amount off the end that couples to the ring gear and the shoulder that mates with the brake side bearings. That should theoretically keep the drivers centered in the chassis. Or... Take some off the shoulder of the ring gear where the track shaft mates up, then take some off the shoulder where the brake side bearings mate up. Or take some off one end of the track shaft (the end that mates to the ring gear obviously) then push the drivers over to compensate.
The goal should be to load the giant bearing deep in the bottom of the case. This bearing can take much more load that any of the other bearings in the case. You can do that by taking material off the above mentioned items or shimming the case and or brake housing away from the chassis.
Also to sell the wider bearing and not acknowledge that it may or may not fit seems like either a poor understanding of whats going on with the cases and chassis.
And since it seems some people think a big name shop must be the expert, why are the big name shops that offer a "solution" to this problem not talking about the angular misalignment many people are seeing evidenced by the track mark on the planetary gear "thingy". Some may be seeing this because their bearing failed and this allowed the transfer gear to misalign, but I've seen it on cases that still have good bearings. "Ah, heck bubba, just throw a bigger bearing in there, that'll fixr up good" Sorry for that, I'm just a hair frustrated lately.
I'm not trying to bash BDX, I'm just trying to say that you, and many other people on this board (and some that don't even surf the internet) have done FAR, FAR, more than BDX to try and properly solve this problem and help other people do the same. I personally have spent hundreds of hours inspecting and repairing this problem on my sleds and other peoples sleds, then putting the info on this forum for everyone to benefit from. The pictorial posts you have shared have been priceless for probably hundreds forum members, if not thousands of people around the web. When was the last time a vendor do that? I think we should give credit where credit is due.
Cat is the problem, not BDX. Cat changed the case, or let someone tell them to change the case, or whatever happens in big corporate business. Who knows. It happens. All the manufacturers do it once in a while. But we do know they (cat) are the ones making sloppy chassis that have angular and width tolerances that a high school kid with a few minutes of instruction on fabrication could easily best.
Nobody is perfect. Especially me. If I'm wrong, please show me.
9
907riders.com
Well-known member
Torn down my DD tonight after reading pages upon page of people having bad bearings with low miles and what do a find... A perfect bearing showing no wear or fatigue..
I must be the lucky one!!! Anyways for ****s and giggles I'm installing the double row bearing tomorrow..
I must be the lucky one!!! Anyways for ****s and giggles I'm installing the double row bearing tomorrow..
A
_AJ_
Well-known member
Sounds like you caught it in time
Just wondering if you actually picked out the seals on that bearing and gave it a good visual. Reason I ask, is mine looked and felt fine too until I opened er' up for a closer look.
Cheers,
AJ
9
907riders.com
Well-known member
I'll pull it apart tonight and post the results.
9
907riders.com
Well-known member
Ok seals out and there is no cage damage as shown in earlier posts.
Just to be particular, everyone should know that you can't always see defects in a bearing that is in its beginning stages of failure. The only way to detect this is with highly tuned and very expensive equipment. If there is any doubt, replace it. If your so inclined, replace it on a regular basis. I have decided on a once yearly replacement schedule just to be safe.
Ray, Is BDX going to be exhibiting at the snow show in SLC this upcoming weekend? I would enjoy visiting with you guys about this issue
S
Sno Junkie
Active member
Holy Cow this post is long.
So, from what i have read...the 5203 will fit the '09 and it requires a 4203 for the '10. ??
My wife has a '09 and we have a couple of '10's in the group.
So, from what i have read...the 5203 will fit the '09 and it requires a 4203 for the '10. ??
My wife has a '09 and we have a couple of '10's in the group.
C
Crusty82
Member
I replaced the 6203/spacer with the 5203 the other day. It was on my 2010m8 snopro.
I didn`t need to machine anything in the DD. It was a perfect fit.
It was 0,5mm clearence with the cover and seal on. Without the seal i was 0,3mm short of space. (the seal is 0,8mm thick).
On the other hand, I had to take of 2mm from the trackshaft to be able to put the cover on when the DD was mounted in the sled.
I didn`t need to machine anything in the DD. It was a perfect fit.
It was 0,5mm clearence with the cover and seal on. Without the seal i was 0,3mm short of space. (the seal is 0,8mm thick).
On the other hand, I had to take of 2mm from the trackshaft to be able to put the cover on when the DD was mounted in the sled.
It would be nice if someone would make a sticky that summarizes, with pics, the procedure for each year of sled in question. I have a 2010 M8 and from what I've read the 5203 bearing is the way to go & I believe only one of the 6203's is the culprit and the other bearings should be fine?
Also, it sounds like most people with the 2010 M8 need to machine some amount of trackshaft so the DD cover fits properly. I believe there is a safe range for amount of material to machine off but I'm not sure. It sounds like 1-2mm pretty much works for most people so would it be safe to just remove 2mm and not worry about an exact measurement??
Thanks.
Also, it sounds like most people with the 2010 M8 need to machine some amount of trackshaft so the DD cover fits properly. I believe there is a safe range for amount of material to machine off but I'm not sure. It sounds like 1-2mm pretty much works for most people so would it be safe to just remove 2mm and not worry about an exact measurement??
Thanks.
Are the 4203 bearings sealed both sides? Anyone else used these with proven success?
On the 7203 bearing - doesn't it have to be installed with a certain side facing out? If so, which side faces which direction? I also noticed on SKF that some 7203s are made to run as individuals and others are made to run in pairs, just FYI.
I believe I also saw an SKF premium 7203 rated for super high rpm, but not sure if it is sealed.
Anyone know what rpm these bearings run at in the DD?
N
newtrout
Well-known member
The '2RS' designation on a bearing means rubber seals on both sides.
I have about 700 miles on the 4203 bearing. It is still in perfect condition, and my stock bearing was shot at ~500 miles. I should mention that I packed my 4203 with grease, like you would a wheel bearing on a MX bike. I pulled the seals, packed it with quality synthetic grease, and reinstalled the seals.
The bearing rep I spoke with said he would not recommend packing a bearing with grease because it could cause the bearings to slide rather than roll and it could cause the seals to become dislodged and there is always the risk of damaging the seal.
Prior to hearing that I was planning to do the same but now I'm probably not going to pack it.
The OEM bearing Peer 6203 RLD does not have a (2) in the number so I believe it depends upon the manufacturer as to what indicates 2 seals.
Prior to hearing that I was planning to do the same but now I'm probably not going to pack it.
The OEM bearing Peer 6203 RLD does not have a (2) in the number so I believe it depends upon the manufacturer as to what indicates 2 seals.
M
mhanson
Active member
there is an easier way than machining the trackshaft if it is too long. Put shims behind the brake caliper ( i used washers on the bolts) and that will shift the whole shaft over that much. (My track was running closer to the DD side than the brake side anyways).
This is an easy fix and doesn't require any special machining, especially if you are in a pinch like i was the night before a big trip.
This is an easy fix and doesn't require any special machining, especially if you are in a pinch like i was the night before a big trip.
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