What's so good about 4-Stroke Mountain Sleds??

[C-man]

I'm glad to see the progress of 4 stroke sleds, look at the dirtbike market and what it has done with 4 strokes. I rode 250 2 strokes for years until Honda released the CRF 450 4 stroke in 02, I am still ridin a CRF today and the bike is awesome. There is a huge demand out there for the benefits of a 4 stroke motor and we will all benefit once the weight is down and the power is up. Eventually they will be good enough that a turbo will not be needed, and it may not be far off.

I completely agree with this one, had many friends stuck on their 2 stroke dirtbikes and now they all have 4 strokes only because they out preform the 2 strokes STOCK.

the 4 stroke sleds stock havent come close yet weight wise but only time will tell and we all know 4 strokes is the future but not right now imo(unless you turbo$$)

they need more time and i could see in a couple years that most of you guys hatin on 4 strokes will be riding one soon.

untill then ill stay on my stock sled that rocks! and its a 2 stroke

 

[longhairfreak]

If this is true, then why would they not at least show the 4 strokes they can. I guess this is what UFO's and a 2 stroke turbo smackin down on a fourstroke turbo have in common...Everyone has heard the rumor, but no one can confirm it. BIS should be interesting this year watching the 2 smokers trying to keep up. Who is stepping up? Anyone? Anyone?

Is it possible for a 2 stroke non turbo to give a yammi turbo a go?

 

[C-man]

Is it possible for a 2 stroke non turbo to give a yammi turbo a go?

k how about we talk non turbo 2 stroke vs non turbo 4 strokes

 

[NM]

Is it possible for a 2 stroke non turbo to give a yammi turbo a go?

In a drag race? Yes. In a freestyle climbing event like BIS? No. This is only of course if the snow is deep. If the snow is set up at all, then the 2 strokes might have a chance.

 

[CoyoteGirl]

BIS should be interesting this year watching the 2 smokers trying to keep up.

Weren't there a few big bore turbos trying to make it up Monster last year? Something like 2/3 of the way and turn out???

Nothing against those sleds at all!!!!!!!! But it's the 2/3 part that makes the 4 strokes "all that"! They do "all the way baby"!!!

This was what I witnessed anyhow.

Could be different this year????????

 

[Evolution Powersports]

I own both an Apex short track and an 09 M8 LE. Here is my take on the matter: For power delivery, trouble free run abilty, just being able to start a 4 stroker and let it idle all day if I want, the four stroker rules.

However, I would not trade my M8 for a mountain Apex or Nytro. In the mountains, for the type of riding I like to do which is mainly boondocking , technical climbs and exploring, weight and manuverabilty are king. The Apex has an almost 150 lb weight penalty as compared to the M8 for virtually the same hp.

When Yamaha or Cat or Polaris finally comes up with a four stroker in the sub 500 lb range and about 160-170 hp that handles like the current M8, I will jump the two stroke ship in a heartbeat.

As far as turbos go, my mod days are over. I do not have the time or money these days. God bless the guys that do. If I had 25k to buy a sled, it would surely be a lightened tapex or the Cat turbo retrofit into the M chassis.

 

[woodies]

We are at the point now where a 2 stroke turbo will lay the smackdown on a 4 stroke turbo. Having said that who would want a 4 stroke turbo?

not me i hate it! get up room only smells of farts! no 2 smoke! that sucks.

 

[steveo10]

friends stocker nytro is nice but when the snow gets deep i hide cause my back cant take it.

i cant remorgage the house again for a turbo. or can i?

 

[Throttle Junkie]

From what I have seen the turbo 2-strokes cannot even hold a candle to the turbo 4-strokes. I am anxious to see how the doo does....

 

[RX1MountainMan]

Looks like the Yamaha's will have some direct competition in the mountains next year from Ski-Doo. There are pics of a 154" 4-stroker on the ski-doo forum.

My first question is this, how big could the market for 4-stroke mountain sleds possibly be?? In my opinion, the 4-stroke mountain sleds, at least the yamaha's and I am guessing the ski-doo as well, are not even mountain sleds until the owner puts at least another $6000-$10,000 into it. Turbo, new tunnel, skis, new rear suspension, track, etc. The number of snowmobilers that are able and willing to do that is relatively small. I have seen a stock Apex run in the mountains and it was pathetic, it couldn't climb and couldn't boondock, so now what you basically have is a long tracked trail sled.

My next question is for the people on here that own a 4-stroke turbo. How much fun is it to ride your sled with a bunch guys that don't own a turbo?? IMO, most of the fun I have riding comes from the competition aspect, and there really isn't any when comparing say an XP to a Nytro turbo. So now to have a lot of fun on one of these, you need a couple of your buddies to be able to afford a $20,000 snowmobile as well. The market seems to be getting smaller..

Next, I feel like the turbo 4's are pretty one dimensional snowmobiles, great for climbing the biggest hills you have the guts to attempt, and that's about it. I rode a turbo Nytro a couple weeks ago and it was a blast once I got it pointed straight up the hill, but trying to turn that thing to go uphill was quite the ordeal. If given the choice between the Turbo Nytro and any 800 class 2-stroke, I'd take the 2-stroke any day.

So, what is the big attraction to the 4-strokes? I just can't see it.

Mine climbs and boondocks with the rest of them....including Ski-Don'ts...must the be the rider I guess. The big deal, for the two I have is 4 & 5,000 miles on the original drivetrain including belt and plug...what's really cool is making it back to the truck under your own power!!!

 

[prox18]

did a nytro last year and its a blast just point and hang the f$%^ on but will not ride it too much till the spring snow (or cascade concrete) shows up,built a D8 this year and cant wait to compare them once things soften up.like em both but the yammi has its place and for me its not in the trees with 2feet of fluff. So far the twisted D is a great sled for boonie runnin and just playing in the meadows I doubt it will hold to close in the spring when HP and traction are the top 2 points though

 

[spring snow hero]

It really does not much matter...2 or 4, if the sleds keep evolving like they have in the last 10 years.....soon they will all have trailer hitches to haul the nuts it will take to pull the pin on one. I love hp, but 400+ and 500 pounds is crazy.....and they keep gettin faster and lighter.....yikes!

 

[rmk 700]

Looks like the Yamaha's will have some direct competition in the mountains next year from Ski-Doo. There are pics of a 154" 4-stroker on the ski-doo forum.

My first question is this, how big could the market for 4-stroke mountain sleds possibly be?? In my opinion, the 4-stroke mountain sleds, at least the yamaha's and I am guessing the ski-doo as well, are not even mountain sleds until the owner puts at least another $6000-$10,000 into it. Turbo, new tunnel, skis, new rear suspension, track, etc. The number of snowmobilers that are able and willing to do that is relatively small. I have seen a stock Apex run in the mountains and it was pathetic, it couldn't climb and couldn't boondock, so now what you basically have is a long tracked trail sled.

My next question is for the people on here that own a 4-stroke turbo. How much fun is it to ride your sled with a bunch guys that don't own a turbo?? IMO, most of the fun I have riding comes from the competition aspect, and there really isn't any when comparing say an XP to a Nytro turbo. So now to have a lot of fun on one of these, you need a couple of your buddies to be able to afford a $20,000 snowmobile as well. The market seems to be getting smaller..

Next, I feel like the turbo 4's are pretty one dimensional snowmobiles, great for climbing the biggest hills you have the guts to attempt, and that's about it. I rode a turbo Nytro a couple weeks ago and it was a blast once I got it pointed straight up the hill, but trying to turn that thing to go uphill was quite the ordeal. If given the choice between the Turbo Nytro and any 800 class 2-stroke, I'd take the 2-stroke any day.

So, what is the big attraction to the 4-strokes? I just can't see it.

post the link

 

[JPM]

2 strokes are competative

If this is true, then why would they not at least show the 4 strokes they can. I guess this is what UFO's and a 2 stroke turbo smackin down on a fourstroke turbo have in common...Everyone has heard the rumor, but no one can confirm it. BIS should be interesting this year watching the 2 smokers trying to keep up. Who is stepping up? Anyone? Anyone?

Seem to remember a thread about fairview shootout last year where the highest 4 stroke turbo was fourth with 2 stroke turbos in second and third and a tripple 2 stroke on nitrous in first. Also tripple on nitrous was first in the fernie snow drags last year so i guess that is confirmation that it happens

 

[MEAT]

I love these threads it just makes me laugh. I go anywhere my 2 stroke buddies go and as far as climbing goes maybe those 4-5 rides a year where there is 4-5 ft of pow it will get highmarked. Sooner or later though you get a base with a foot of powder and my Apex goes just as high as anyone else. I guess if all your concerned about is highmarking then maybe a stock 4 stroke isnt the way to go. For me I like to ride a couple times a week and my sled answers the call everytime. I couldn't be happier with it, well maybe boost wouldnt be so bad LOL

 

[MTdream]

Ignorance is bliss...

 

[drinkwyo]

Ignorance is bliss...

amen

 

[verticallydefiant]

Direct copetition??

The sad fact of the matter is, in a way you're correct yet, you are so wrong! If Polaris would pull their heads out, they have a more than capable Turbo 4-stroke and an awesome "RAW" chasis to put it into; they just can't seem to put 2 and 2 together.

I ride a stretched out mostly stock '08 FST Switchback, I absolutely friggin love that sled. The more time I spend on it, the more I love it!

Yes, it is heavy but no, that doesn't seem to bother it in the least... My bro rides a 700 Dragon and whether it be drag racing, trail or powder; or hill climbing the serious fact is, the Dragon is so sorely out classed by that "heavy" FST it's almost sad. My bro is a doctor and not mutch of a mechanic therefore I'm his mechanic, he has been so dissapointed he's had me re-clutch, tune, new belt everything trying to get the Dragon so it would keep up, it aint going to happen...

In the coldest weather I just turn the key and go, I still have push button reverse, the heated hand grips actually get warm, i can tip it over and no flooding, there are so many pro's to owning a new 4-stroke with the only downfall I see as being there weight. That too can be solved!

Best thing about the FST, it's from the factory that way!! No need to spend tons of cash on it to make it work, add a long track and make your buddies eat crow.

This sled will be in Am snow against a stock Nytro, be watching for it; stock vs stock, should be interesting...

 

[chris79]

I have both a stock XP and Tnytro I used to love the ski-doo because they were in my opinion a very competitive sled for Climbing and boondocking. The 4-strokes came out started making huge power and for an additional 10%-15% of the coast of the big power sled you could lighten up and make it handle great. BRP felt a loose in sales to the yamaha market and they are trying to get there customers back. I guess I don't know how big the market is, and I bet the BRP guys asked the same question when yamaha first came out with the 4-stroke. I think it is obviously bigger then BRP thought and probably bigger then you think and that is why BRP is coming out with the new line.


In my group the year I started ridding a Turbo the other two guys I ride with also got into the turbo market the same year...they are on an TM8 and Tski-doo...its really fun when the 4-stroke takes the 2-stroke.



This is your opinion, and was mine at one time too.



Power and Speed.

RJM oh this is good stuff. You dirty dog hiding in the deep powder section running down the tm8. I get a kick out of this sh*t. whats this about passing the tm8 stuff i remember a different story. ha ha. seriously guys rjm is running a propane nytro and it is just broke in he was running 16 psi in revy and not quite pulling his clutching which is set up for 18+psi and that sled is impressive. I love my tm8 and I run about 12psi and for a little 800 it will give that nytro a run at 16psi. That being said will it run with the big boost 4 strokers not a chance. I use to have a bad opinion about the four strokes as well, but after spending a hour on the propane I will tell you add the turbo to the nytro and complaints about them feeling heavy and all that jazz are disproved. like I said I love my m8 but I would have no trouble running a t nytro. So I guess the answer is have them both in the trailer. Sh*t its only money right.ha ha Oh ya rjm we will settle this over a few wobblies and a hill or two in cooke on thursday. Turn that knob and have fun.

chris

 

[robertyoke]

oh i remember when a guy said his 454 chevy would out pull & out drag my little 5.9l cummins............and now what do we pull our trailers with?......DIESEL!

in '98 I bought a '98 wr400 and the guys i ride with said "i will never ride a 4 stroke" .....yea right!