Weight Vs. Function?

[mb1]

I think that the weight issue was more of a big deal in the past when making power was harder and the sleds didn't handle as well as they do today.

Sure a heavier sled is going to be harder to dig out, but as stated above, you don't need to lift the thing over your head. (usually)

Riding style is the biggest factor IMO. If you're highmarking, you need big HP, light weight. More technical riding will require better setup, not so much HP.

 

[Steamboat-RN]

You guys crack me up. Why is it any harder to dig out a Yamaha then any other sled? Is the snow around a Yamaha heavier then it is around an XP? Here's some basic instructions on how to get a sled unstuck so you don't have to lift it up and out of the snow.

1. Dig around the sled and remove the snow.
2. Dig or walk a little path in front of sled.
3. Lift the tunnel up out of the trench (not the whole sled, just the tunnel and set it left or right on solid ground)
4. Start sled.
5. Give the sled gas slowly until the clutch engages and it starts to roll.
6. Hammer the thottle and ride.
5. If necessary you may need to have a buddy or two pull on the skis just to get you rolling. If you have to pull so hard you pop a nut go back to steps 1 and 2.

IF YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND THESE INSTRUCTION PLEASE FIND SOME EXPERIENCED RIDERS TO RIDE WITH AND ASK THEM TO TEACH YOU HOW TO DO IT SO YOU DON'T WASTE ALL YOUR ENERGY DEAD LIFTING SLEDS.

DO NOT TRY TO LIFT THE WHOLE SLED UP. SERIOUS INJURY MAY OCCUR. EVEN THE LIGHTEST SLEDS WEIGH ALMOST 400 PDS.

If we only got stuck on the flats this process works great. The ones I hate are tree wells or deep creeks. If I'm trenched on a steep climb, I'll take the lighter sled.
Try step #3 on flat dry ground with a yamaha and then a 2 stroke. Note the increased effort to raise the tunnel to your waist. Repeat a dozen times over the course of a day.
IF YOU DO NOT UNDERSTAND THE LAWS OF PHYSICS, PLEASE FIND A TEACHER TO REVIEW THE LAWS OF GRAVITY AND CONSERVATION OF ENERGY.

 

[tothebar]

for pullin hills i think once you've got your momentum (as long as you can keep it), weight is completley irrelevant. if you can ride a sled weight is not an issue!

 

[Climbmax]

Large Marge is in my stable........ride it everyday of the week before some cheap chainsawzzz
Safe sleddin

 

[DARKO]

all depends on where you ride ...we rode with some heavier yamms all done up ..at the end of the day the group was a lot smaller ....no yammis around the doo patch

Did they (Yami's)get sick of watching them highmark each other on the bunny hill or did they get sick of them changing the belts after every second pull ?

 

[Ken Climb]

Did they (Yami's)get sick of watching them highmark each other on the bunny hill or did they get sick of them changing the belts after every second pull ?

ha ha lol , yah the yami guys went to the real hills......except for the guy with the alpine kit, he wished for a fire ext.

 

[DARKO]

......except for the guy with the alpine kit, he wished for a fire ext.

bahahahahahahahahahahahaha !!!!!!!!!!

 

[Mudman]

Heavy vs. Light

I love reading threads like this, it shows how closed minded people get when they are Brand Loyal. I am no expert, but I have tried to keep and open mind and let actions speak. There is no lie, Yamaha's built right (Turbo, Suspension, Track, Seat, Handlebars) They feel as light when riding as any sled I have ever been on (Including REV XP). When they are stuck, you should only be lifting the back end (doesn't weigh any more than most, the extra weight is in the front). There is a lot to be said about the way a sled handles, a better handling sled can make you a better rider by making you more comfortable with your abilities (personally, I have a hard time with the REV XP).

One thing is for sure, when it comes to all out reliable horsepower, I have to say Yamaha's 4-strokes have it (this is coming from a 2-stroke turbo owner and rider). My 2-stroke turbo is probably one of the more reliable two stroke turbo's I have seen, but when all is said and done I will be building a yamaha turbo for one of my next projects.

Weight is a huge factor, but it does have to be within reason, I would rather a sled weigh 50 lbs more and ride excellent and be reliable, than be light and have small issues to solve continually (not to pick on the XP again, but belts are expensive when you go through them every ride). This aftermarket push in handling has made the new stock sleds what they are today, but there is always better out there. (I am not a XP hater, I love rotax motors, we just all need to learn from past mistakes)

 

[NM]

ha ha lol , yah the yami guys went to the real hills......except for the guy with the alpine kit, he wished for a fire ext.

Was that the dude who blew the motor in the Dealers Demo? I thought I heard he blew the motor in his Nytro as well. He is either a poor planner or has really bad luck.

 

[bigbird]

say an xp has 150hp and weighs 520lbs.wet. that is 3.46lbs./hp. the equivalent nytro if it weighs 620(100lbs.more) needs 180 hp. to have the same lbs./hp. so apples to apples weight/hp I would rather have the xp, but most guys run way more than 180hp on a nytro. I would much rather have the nytro with 240-280hp than any other sled.

 

[Spur]

Mudman-good post.

Your right, most guys slam everything except what they ride.

It's impossible to compare sleds. I am not a brand loyal guy, but every sled out there has it days. I have even seen days when a stock Apex would out climb a stock 1000 cat. Not many, but I have seen it. I have seen days when in the morning a stock 800 Dragon will out pull a stock M 800, but by 2:00 PM the 800 M is out pulling the Dragon. Same with the XP. Snow conditions, temperature, who knows.

In 2006 a couple guys in our group bought new Apexes. They wanted to get 500 miles on them before they got boost. We dropped into an area and played for most the day. We did a lot of side by side comparisons that day with M7, 800 Dragons, M 1000 and I kid you not the stock Apex could barely out mark the 600 Dragon. It was a little embarrassing for the Apex guys. They were not even close to staying with any of the other sleds. That night we had to make one real big pull to prevent us from back tracking to get out. When the sun went down it got cold fast. We worried about getting any of the sleds out before dark. When we got to the hill the only sleds that would pull the top were the Apexes. Don't ask me why. They had to build a track for the M 1000 to get out. We ended up pulling the 600 Dragon over with a rope. A week later we had a day when we had to build a cat track up a hill to get the Apexes out. You just never know.

 

[mb1]

say an xp has 150hp and weighs 520lbs.wet. that is 3.46lbs./hp. the equivalent nytro if it weighs 620(100lbs.more) needs 180 hp. to have the same lbs./hp. so apples to apples weight/hp I would rather have the xp, but most guys run way more than 180hp on a nytro. I would much rather have the nytro with 240-280hp than any other sled.

Good point BigBird.

and if you had a 200# rider on the sleds in the comparison the XP is 4.8#/hp, and the Nytro only has to make 171 hp to be equal.

 

[winter brew]

We have no snow and I'm bored so I'll give my .02.....There is nothing that will compete with a nicely setup boosted Yami...nothing even close. But does the Yami do so well because it is heavy or because it makes the most/best power?? It's the power. Put that power in a lighter sled and there is no question it will travel even better. Why do the Yami guys drop huge $$ on lightweight parts? Because they know that weight is a factor in how fast/high and how you feel after a long day of riding. I had a Apex, great sled but just too heavy for me to have fun for a ful days ride in the trees.
Sounds like the Yami guys might be a bit nervous with the DOO being 100 lbs lighter with similar potential???? But will they need to carry 100lbs in parts and belts to make it through the day??