The State of the Nation Address

[ruffryder]

Why?
Who says because you have achieved the american dream we get to rob you blind?

Why can't they be taxed at the exact same rate as everyone else?
They will still pay WAY more than you or me (well, at least me).

I believe that the argument goes like this... FYI, the "Those that do not make that much money are to be taken as an average american family...

The amount of money spent for the necessities as a percentage of income is much greater for those that do not make much money as compared to those that do. Essentially you are taxing those with less income, more for basic necessities then those that have lots of money.

Another thing to consider, is that those that do not have much money, don't have much to gain in an increasing economy. The investments are minimal that increases in capital gains are mainly seen by those higher up at the top.

I guess the main thing that I am trying to say, and what scares me, is the increasing percentage of wealth gained by the top percentage of workers. Carry that out for another 100 years and will we see the top 1% owning more then half of America?.... In an age were money = power is a rule, that can lead to interesting results.

An interesting link to look at. Check it out.

Who rules america..

 

[Ollie]

Your own arguement explains why we need to STOP taxing the american dream to death.
You say they spend more than we do. They consume more than we do. The stuff they buy is more expensive than what we buy.

NEWS FLASH

We are the ones that build the stuff they buy.
We build their mansions.
We sell them their cars (although we may not build them in this country).
They pay so we can make a living.

We need to STOP punishing eveyone with new taxes.
And another thing.
Who determines the definition of "Rich"?
Who says I am middle class?
I consider myself pretty well off.
Who is to say that 10 years from now the King From Kenya is going to decide that since he has bankrupted the country, anyone making more than 30k is now "rich" and has to pay 48% of thier income.

You say wealth = power.
Then they need to make it illigal for anyone making more than what they consider "rich" from holding any office or having any contact with those in office. Kind of kicks Sorros out in the cold doesn't it.
Oh, and the current speculation is that Sorros is primarily responcible for over 300 million of the 680 million used to buy the white house. That is why King kenya won't release the donors list.

 

[Wheeline]

Again the point is the deductions seem to never be taken into account when doing the Johnny makes 30k and pays this percentage while Janny makes 300k and pays this percentage. Making that comparison using those numbers, and the taxe rates from the IRS is not accurate as the duductions for the person making the 300k can be quite large.

It's obvious by this post that you do not understand accounting or our current tax system. If Janny makes 300k then tax is paid on 300k. If Janny sells 300k worth of cars but spent 200k doing it then tax is paid on 100k because that is the INCOME.

 

[ruffryder]

It's obvious by this post that you do not understand accounting or our current tax system.

Then what the heck is a deduction? You take your gross income subtract deductions and that is your taxable income, or tax liability is.

Who does your taxes? lol

 

[swampwater]

OMG he's bringing back Seargent Shriver and the peace corp, what a waste that was. I hope ruffy joins, it might do him good to discover the rest of the world. Swampy




Originally Posted by Wolfrun
Sorry Ruffy but Volunteers Are almost always wealthy, retired people who have time and money to spend their time this way. Under BO's plan this class will be no more or at least greatly curtailed.
Ruffy
Or they are poor students or young people trying to make a difference. Something tells me you don't volunteer much... or do in secotrs that have few young people. I know quite a few people that volunteer... and try and do quite a bit myself. Most are just regular people.
__________________
Fordman is my number 1 fan...
mountain-powder-slut is my number 2... seems fitting..

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[tactic]

You can think that if you want. I just wish people would accept the importance that history plays in the future of the country. For example many people that are my age(22) are clueless that we were at war with Iraq in the early 90's. These same people want us to duck and run from Iraq right now. I just don't see how people can make a logical decision when they don't know what happened in the past. I'm not saying he doesn't but I just thought he should look into the history of events to make a decision on what we should do now.

Bad US foreign policy has played a part in this Iraq fiasco. We used to provide arms to Saddam.

My point is we should finish the job in Iraq so we aren't doing this crap again in 30 years when the second coming of Saddam comes into power.

During times of civil war a Republican form of government most often loses out to totalitarian governments, dictatorships, monarchies, etc. With our troops there we have the chance to keep peace and setup a solid, mostly peaceful Republic state much like ours. From that point the people of the Middle East will see through the lies that the radicals try to brainwash them with and they will see the beauty of Democracy and it will no doubt spread in the middle east.

Maybe I'll get some pictures of my medals from when I was a freshman in high school and got 1st place in a US government, US history and general politics competition, all three being separate events.

What was that you were saying?

Thanks shortstop. You don't need to prove yourself to me.....some intelligent dialogue is re-freshing once in awhile. I understand the snide "internet remarks" come easy and are tempting, but I am glad you finally presented some solid ideas.
Did my undergrad in history actually......but that was almost 20 years ago.....I'm a little rusty!

 

[ruffryder]

I hope ruffy joins, it might do him good to discover the rest of the world. Swampy

Where did that comment come from? Oh yah...

 

[mad1818]

So Palin gets slammed for saying you can see Russia from Alaska.
Why isn't Obama getting slammed for saying the automobile was invented in America?

 

[hilinerider]

should have watched mad money last night,


kramer came right out and called obama a communist, he patterned obama's business ethics with lenin



oh and now they are goin to tax fuel even more

 

[Van Epps]

Ruffy, what do you think about the statement below:

"To each according to their need, from each according to their ability".

 

[ruffryder]

Ruffy, what do you think about the statement below:

"To each according to their need, from each according to their ability".

You have that backwards don't you? The statement reminds me of the Bible and Church... Though I stole that off of wiki....

I think it is an ideology that is present in every persons belief structure, though the means off attaining it, and the control of achieving it seem to be of debate.

It has some interesting history about it and facts, and more background as to the context that the statement was based in.

I agree with the statement, ideally. I view that the problem with society is that the monetary value placed upon the labor has nothing to do with the societal benefit of that labor to society. Like our military. They get paid crap, yet sacrifice the most, for all of America. That doesn't make any sense to me. The economic model that is capitalism does not take this into account, or rather its impact on wages is reduced and is more a function of supply and demand. One of the points of the phrase is that people would work not for a wage, but because that is what they like to do / want to do.

How is that answer? Dang, now I need to make up .5 hours of work on Saturday.... crap...

Good old Newsmax has this to say about it....

One thing to keep in mind, is that the phrase doesn't have anything to do with money... It is talking about goods and services. We are the ones the screw up the ratio between them....

 

[ruffryder]

Van Epps...

What do you think about the statement?

 

[swampwater]

I'm sorry I should have known that was from before you were even a sperm. Do some studying of history it might excite you. Swampy

Where did that comment come from? Oh yah...

 

[ruffryder]

I'm sorry I should have known that was from before you were even a sperm. Do some studying of history it might excite you. Swampy

I meant about me going out and seeing the world... Easy on the flashbacks oldtimer...

 

[xrated]

Ruffy, what do you think about the statement below:

"To each according to their need, from each according to their ability".

Not ruffy but I'm gonna chime in.

That's commie talk....BUT speaking from the Bible(only works if you are a believer) we should give to each as their needs dictate. If you have no coat and I have two, I should give you mine. For the simple reason that we are both children of God. Now as I said, this is based on being a believer.

Ohh and think on this fellas, it's like a guy I ride with says(who has gone broke in several ventures) IF YOUR HAVING FUN, WELL THEN YOU CAN'T BE THAT POOR. I like that way of looking at things, so I am one wealthy SOB!!!

 

[01_MC500]

Neither did Obama.... catch the point yet? And we did, but it was so much fun the first time, might as well go for another....

i don't like you compairing my savior to some black guy that got elected president. you should be a little careful my freind.

 

[swampwater]

Who you calling an oldtimer, your only as old as you feel and I can still throw that old T-cat around pretty good. With that said you could learn alot from us seasoned warriors. Swampy

I meant about me going out and seeing the world... Easy on the flashbacks oldtimer...

 

[Wade]

I see I am late in responding as Wade did it quicker....... and better! BTW Wade, what is AMT tax? (great post)

AMT Alternative Minimum Tax. Think of it this way. You pay interest on your house. You get to deduct the interest. If you make around 250K, you can only deduct a percentage of that deduction. So, maybe you can deduct 80% of your interest. You loose the rest of the deduction.

The idea, contrary to what Ruffy said, is that if you make a bunch of money, you gradually get to the point where you can't get by without paying at least 28% federal income tax. The formulas are very weird. You have to fill out the entire form, just to figure out if you owe anything. The funny part is individuals making 100K sometimes get blind sided by this tax, and end up having to cough up a $1000.

http://www.smartmoney.com/personal-finance/taxes/the-alternative-minimum-tax-9540/

 

[Wade]

I believe that the argument goes like this... FYI, the "Those that do not make that much money are to be taken as an average american family...

The amount of money spent for the necessities as a percentage of income is much greater for those that do not make much money as compared to those that do. Essentially you are taxing those with less income, more for basic necessities then those that have lots of money.

Another thing to consider, is that those that do not have much money, don't have much to gain in an increasing economy. The investments are minimal that increases in capital gains are mainly seen by those higher up at the top.

I guess the main thing that I am trying to say, and what scares me, is the increasing percentage of wealth gained by the top percentage of workers. Carry that out for another 100 years and will we see the top 1% owning more then half of America?.... In an age were money = power is a rule, that can lead to interesting results.

An interesting link to look at. Check it out.

Who rules america..

You do agree that having a family is a personal decision (well for most people). Why should I be raped to help out someone with their personal decision? And, don't give me that line about how their kid is going to help me out some day. Only half of those kids will ever pay any tax, on average. And, the way things are going, I don't think depending on them is a great retirement plan.

The only people making too much are CEOs, and upper management of companies they didn't create. A highly trained person deserves to be compensated according to supply and demand for that job. If money is important to you, then pick your career carefully.

 

[Van Epps]

Ruffy, Yes I do have it backwards! I politically disagree with that statement, very strongly.

As you are aware, that is a quote from Karl Marx, one of the Founding Fathers, if you will, of Communism. I believe this is a honorable principle, from the biblical perspective.

I believe that any Government that bases itself, and its policies, on this principle is doomed to fail, thus destroying the country it is to be leading. I believe that BO is doing his best to lead our country down this road, with amazing success due to ignorance, fear mongering and a lack of checks and balances (specifically balance)