Summit 850: Ratchet, Slap, Rocks and Carnage!!

[christopher]

That hit should not cause serious structural damage IMO
Many similar episodes over the years and NEVER more than an a arm.
Usually dust off and good to go.

I am simply not qualified to say.
With only 3 days on lightweight 2 stroke sled, I honestly don't know first hand what they Will and will Not stand up to.

On the yamahas, this would have been a NON-ISSUE.
But those sleds have 100+ POUNDS more metal on them, so its just NOT a fair comparison for me to make.

This is my first introduction to the world of lightweight 2 stroke sleds.
I am at a huge disadvantage in making a hard judgement here..

I should note, in case you never saw the original thread.
That "hit" completely shattered the left hand side panel, blew it to pieces AND punched a hole clean through his clutch cover.

 

[summ8rmk]

Christopher, this is not normal damage to "light weight 2-strokes"
I bet there are more damaged G4 bulkheads this year than 2011-2015 Pro's combined. The bulkhead on the Pro is the strongest part of the whole sled. With a hard hit to the skis/arms , You will bend the tunnel behind the bulkhead before you break the bulkhead.

GS6

 

[blk9038]

I am simply not qualified to say.
With only 3 days on lightweight 2 stroke sled, I honestly don't know first hand what they Will and will Not stand up to.

On the yamahas, this would have been a NON-ISSUE.
But those sleds have 100+ POUNDS more metal on them, so its just NOT a fair comparison for me to make.

This is my first introduction to the world of lightweight 2 stroke sleds.
I am at a huge disadvantage in making a hard judgement here..

I should note, in case you never saw the original thread.
That "hit" completely shattered the left hand side panel, blew it to pieces AND punched a hole clean through his clutch cover.

I also found on 2nd ride I barely grazed a tree with l/h side panel just at crease area (no picts tonite) and put about 1 inch mark on it, my 2013 xm has been thru being totaled one time and rolled over on a rockpile at end of last year and panels are still intact on it (but scratched up some lol) these panels on g4 are a bit thin I think probably as extra weight savings and sure there will be others commenting on this as season progresses, stay tuned.

 

[b-litt]

Our area is still early season riding in many places. It goes from bottomless powder to areas where you feel like you might as well be riding with no snow at all. It's just been too cold to get any kind of base. I've personally seen more damage on every brand of sled than any other year I can remember. I was out a couple weeks ago with five Axys Pros and my 850. Four of the Polaris sleds went back with bent a-arms. One had the Zbroz arms too. I was thrown over my bars twice and have no damage except some heavily dinged up grippers I threw on. I also have my sway bar off, Raptor shocks all around, and a skid plate. Not sure if any of those help much, but I know they can't hurt.

Last week I took a drop right onto a hidden bolder that sent me flying and the sled did a flip or two. It bent the chain case side running board 90 degrees parallel with the tunnel. The ski ripped threw the rubber bushing and was pointed straight down. The spindle has the yellow paint cracked off where it stretched I guess, but seems fine for now. The boards bent back for the most part. I will be getting aftermarket ones when available though. I had the hood off and pipe out last night and see no fractures or cracks anywhere.

I don't know why mine has withstood this abuse without any unreasonable failures, but I guess I consider myself lucky. With the way I ride and reading this thread I feel like my turn is coming, but I don't think we're all doomed. I'm very surprised the hit Christopher's son took did that damage. It's puzzling and I hope it gets worked out soon.

 

[Mountain_Man]

You have to land at least 25 feet past the bars to qualify as a hard hit. Fifty feet will even give you street cred. Extra points if you were launched so hard that your boots are still on the running boards after you crawl back to your sled. Unless a huge tree or other unmovable object stops you in under 25 feet, then you get the benefit of the doubt............Seriously, judging by the video it didn't look like that hard of a hit. It doesn't take too much to flip a sled over when it's already tipped up like that. If I had seen it in person I admit my opinion could be different.

 

[Sunvang]

Christopher, this is not normal damage to "light weight 2-strokes"
I bet there are more damaged G4 bulkheads this year than 2011-2015 Pro's combined. The bulkhead on the Pro is the strongest part of the whole sled. With a hard hit to the skis/arms , You will bend the tunnel behind the bulkhead before you break the bulkhead.

GS6

I have to agree with you. I have seen a arms been ripped off with only the bolts and bushings left on the bulkhead, and no damage to it.

To christopher.
I understand that you have been riding tougher 4-strokes the last years christopher, and have based your experience on that, but please don't base all 2-stroke sleds durability on your experience with the new gen4 sleds. The damage these sleds show is not a 2-stroke standard. So I would appreciate if you stopped referring to this as a "lightweight 2-stroke", but rather to what it is, a Ski doo Gen4.

I bought the Yamaha Nytro MTX when it was new in 2008. And even tough it was heavy compared to 2-strokes, the front frame was weak because of the design, and i ended up twisting it bad after a bad landing from a jump. Yamaha quickly came out with a upgraded reinforced one. But i still had to pay for the damage, even tough there clearly was a design flaw.
I will bet you that Ski Doo wil change their design or material for the bulkhead on the 2018 models, and that it is the 2017 buyers who have to take the loss.

Lightweight dont always mean fragile, and heavy dont always mean tough.

 

[Chadly]

No word on any of it right now.
I have the RARE pleasure of having the actual impact that broke the bulkhead on video, and BRP is reviewing it.

But like I said, honestly, I don't think it's their fault.
My son slammed into a hidden boulder.

he wasn't going very fast, but its pretty clear it was a HARD HIT.
Tossed the sled over and threw him off.

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Guys don't think that is a hard hit??? I guess it makes sense now that guys on here also think they are good riders ?

 

[Tahoepow]

My friend has a similar video of bending his XP (no bracing) doing the exact same thing. Turning to the left in a meadow. Took a ski hit, fell to the side and BAM... S & E module toast. There was no riding for days after either with a shock smashed into the a-arm.
Guys dipping shoulders and throwing pow turns in shallow low density snow are asking for damage. There is a lot of weight on one ski when you add the rider and machine powering through the snow.
The old saying "Better to be LUCKY than GOOD"

 

[dooguy]

clutch cover

Christopher,
on another note, maybe a dumb question, what is the hole in clutch cover for? I have a new to me xm with the skidoo cooling cover, Just wondering if this is something people are doing for more cooling or clutch adjustment

 

[revrider07]

My experience with the doo chais is it can take a hit as long as bars are straight but when turning structure damage it sure to happen. Was realy hopping the G4 would be different.

 

[turboless terry]

All the videos and pictures say it all to me. Can't imagine even asking for warranty.

 

[d1100t]

Bulk head damage

Christopher,
Does the sled with the cracked bulk head have any front left suspension damage?

 

[ntm_08]

Something is wrong if the bulkhead is as week or weaker then the a-arms! And on top of that, when the there is damage to to the bulkhead, both the front and back/engine module/bulkheads brakes. Its a bad design somewhere end of story.

 

[Mountain_Man]

Christopher,
on another note, maybe a dumb question, what is the hole in clutch cover for? I have a new to me xm with the skidoo cooling cover, Just wondering if this is something people are doing for more cooling or clutch adjustment

I think that hole got punched out by the clutch when the side panel got smashed into it which in turn pushed the clutch cover against the clutch.
I didn't look at those pictures before, I think the sled must have flopped over directly on the rock.

At first it just looked like the ski rode over a smaller rock and threw the rider off balance, but the ski and maybe spindle must have hit the rock pretty solidly.

 

[LoudHandle]

Christopher,
on another note, maybe a dumb question, what is the hole in clutch cover for? I have a new to me xm with the skidoo cooling cover, Just wondering if this is something people are doing for more cooling or clutch adjustment

IMO: The hole is from the clutch bolt. Sled is on it's side with both the side panel and clutch cover pressed into it. This can happen anytime the sled is on it's side with the engine running, it does not have to be damaged for this to take place.

 

[dooguy]

ok thanks, thought i might have missed some free cooling mod

 

[christopher]

Christopher, this is not normal damage to "light weight 2-strokes"
I bet there are more damaged G4 bulkheads this year than 2011-2015 Pro's combined. The bulkhead on the Pro is the strongest part of the whole sled. With a hard hit to the skis/arms , You will bend the tunnel behind the bulkhead before you break the bulkhead.

GS6

If that is the case, then why do you suppose my son broke his Bulkhead?

 

[christopher]

I'm very surprised the hit Christopher's son took did that damage. It's puzzling and I hope it gets worked out soon.

In all fairness, I must repeat that we KEPT ON RIDING for THREE more full days after that hit.

it is VERY LIKELY that it was the CUMULATIVE total of MANY other small hits after that one over the days that added up to that big crack we found.

 

[christopher]

I have to agree with you. I have seen a arms been ripped off with only the bolts and bushings left on the bulkhead, and no damage to it.

To christopher.
I understand that you have been riding tougher 4-strokes the last years christopher, and have based your experience on that, but please don't base all 2-stroke sleds durability on your experience with the new gen4 sleds. The damage these sleds show is not a 2-stroke standard. So I would appreciate if you stopped referring to this as a "lightweight 2-stroke", but rather to what it is, a Ski doo Gen4.

I bought the Yamaha Nytro MTX when it was new in 2008. And even tough it was heavy compared to 2-strokes, the front frame was weak because of the design, and i ended up twisting it bad after a bad landing from a jump. Yamaha quickly came out with a upgraded reinforced one. But i still had to pay for the damage, even tough there clearly was a design flaw.
I will bet you that Ski Doo wil change their design or material for the bulkhead on the 2018 models, and that it is the 2017 buyers who have to take the loss.

Lightweight dont always mean fragile, and heavy dont always mean tough.

FAIR ENOUGH.

By LIGHTWEIGHT I honestly mean ACTUAL POUNDAGE.
The Ski-Doo Gen4 is a LIGHT sled by comparison to what I have been riding since 2009.

I did not mean for that to come across in a disparaging manner.

 

[christopher]

Christopher,
on another note, maybe a dumb question, what is the hole in clutch cover for? I have a new to me xm with the skidoo cooling cover, Just wondering if this is something people are doing for more cooling or clutch adjustment

That is where the Clutch burned a hole through the side cover when the sled was tossed over and it landed on the hidden boulder.