Snow Check group buy?

[Ndanger]

Incorrect, I do not feel that paying more (or the most) necessarily results in higher quality service. Personally, I feel it's a balance and sometimes a tough one to find. If I find a seller that provides excellent, reliable service, however, he is not always the sharpest pencil, I can accept that. Basing logic on statements such as;


Snip> Item 1
I can only assume that is not how you operate. That definetly sounds like you would "deal with the devil" to save a few bucks, no? This infers to me, that you will buy wherever and with whomever will sell a product for the lowest price.


Snip> Item 2
Again, basing this on my fairly extensive car dealership knowledge, there are no volume bonuses with dealers that I'm aware of (I've worked at a car dealer for most of my working life). Whether it's service volume, sales volume, CSI, whatever....doesn't matter. Your bonus is selling more stuff. Unless something is different for sled dealers.

Item 1/ A 2012 Pro Rmk 155 snow check is 10800 and change at invoice 11800 at retail and many dealers sell it for 11 ish out the door (otd). The best pricing I have found is about 9595.00 (2yr warr) including shipping and setup (otd)

Adding 5% tax for a total with tax of 10,100.00 For myself I will be paying 10,200 pre tax for the very same sled because of the reputation of the company I will be working with. I consider the price and value to be consistent with my risk reward tolerance.

Item 2/ You mention that you are in the automotive business, I am curious if you are familiar with (hold backs) (performance incentives) (quota incentives) and the dynamics of a manufacture's incentives when trying to gain market share?

 

[deepdiver]

Ndanger does show that he is well versed in business principles. Now if you can only get a 100.00 dollar discount on a group buy that isnt worth the time or gas.

I just called three different dealers and spoke with their Sales managers and one General Manager..they all agreed that they would welcome a group buy, especially 10 or more customers that were not already in their customer base. That brings in capatal that they would not have had normally and brings in additional revenue in service and other sles down the road.

As far as a dealer not giving a customer that bought a unit elsewhere the same respect they give a returning customer. Well...I have found the exact opposite. I bought my sleds on the east side of this state then moved. Every dealer I have went into..even one with a bad reputation has went above and beyone to take care of my needs. I seldom miss a weekend. They want my business..they want a new customer..to do anything different would be a business model for failure.

Now if there is a group that buys for example 100 ATV's for farming every year I would hope that they get a better deal on the sales pricing than I would get on a 4 sled purchase...they should.

If a dealer typically makes 1500.00 profit on a sled....would rather turn away a group buy of ten sleds at a 500.00 discount, that makes the dealer 1000 dollars profit (that is 10,000 total profit) plus any service or repeat sales they pick up later. It would only be sound business to do a group buy. Let me think..Zero dollars or 10K..even if they all never came back..Hmmmmm this is not tough guys!

As far as 100 dollars goes..that nothing..I can get better than that on a one sled purchase just about anywhere I go. And a free cover to boot and 10% off further accessories. Do I need to negotiate group sales for you guys?? I already ahve some dealers in place that will do this in Washington. Thye think it is a good idea as it will onlky help them as well.

There are alot here on Snowest and we should get a group discount..This needs further thought as to what the volume should be to get a certain percentage. Crapola(I cant spell that correctly or the snowest police will give me ####) Most New car dealers already have group discounts in place...I work for a Fortune 100 comapny and we have huge discounts for the big players. When it comes to service on a multi million dollar piece of equipment they get a discount on that pricing as well.. When it comes to service delivery...that is where they type of contract spells out the response time. The one sale customer may have the same service expectations and delivery as the biggest guy out ther..their difference will only be in the cost.

My wireless keyboard has low battery warning and doing strange stuff..tired of fixing and editing..sorry.

 

[Ndanger]

As a quick note, I started this thread with "eyes wide open" expecting a range of perspectives to a non conventional approach to purchase of a new sled.

I hope that the banter and cadence of the topic has not ruffled any feathers the comments were meant in good spirit. I did receive a 'PM' from a member with a very articulate summary.

He hit the nail on the head, a dealer will make a huge portion of his revenue on parts accessories and service, when a new customer comes in with a sled that he did not sell, an opportunity is presented to build a relationship with a potential new client and the new client's friends, relatives acquaintances when he speaks will of the establishment.

Treating the warranty repair fairly will generate good will and his business will grow and succeed. In contrast, taking a small town attitude and being punitive will only destroy the relationship and the exponential damage of a unhappy customer to the good will and word of mouth, which is the single most important factor to expanding and building a business.

With the exception of the concept that all advertising is good advertising even if it is bad, it worked for Butofuko (sp) when his mistress shot the wife but I think I could pass with that type of notoriety. I am sure he is wealthy, all gratis of his bad behavior. (smile)

 

[Jaynelson]

Item 1/ A 2012 Pro Rmk 155 snow check is 10800 and change at invoice 11800 at retail and many dealers sell it for 11 ish out the door (otd). The best pricing I have found is about 9595.00 (2yr warr) including shipping and setup (otd)

Adding 5% tax for a total with tax of 10,100.00 For myself I will be paying 10,200 pre tax for the very same sled because of the reputation of the company I will be working with. I consider the price and value to be consistent with my risk reward tolerance.

Item 2/ You mention that you are in the automotive business, I am curious if you are familiar with (hold backs) (performance incentives) (quota incentives) and the dynamics of a manufacture's incentives when trying to gain market share?

I know what you're saying; with the advent of the internet, everyone thinks that "invoice price" is the be all end all. Which, as per your example, we obviously know that is not always the case. It can vary with things like holdback and performance incentives, but more likely with monthly programs (both advertised and/or non-advertised).

Some manufacturers, such as the one I work for, have never had hold back of any type. The only performance/volume incentives are paid directly to the employees or managers and are not a) part of the negotiated price or b) used to decrease the dealer net of the actual vehicle. If you started using these to give up additional money because you have already given up all profit and all program money, you are headed down a dangerous road. But again, the dealer net on the car doesn't change no matter how many he buys. That doesn't mean the consumer can't get a fleet deal, or a 2 cars at a time deal, or a 1 car at dead cost deal. That will obviously vary with your area, dealer, what vehicle, and how much he is will to give up or take a loss, etc, etc. And again, the amounts and/or availability varies by vehicle manufacturer and likely by industry, as we're talking sleds.

If a sled dealer is willing to sell you a sled giving up all dealer profit, all holdback (if applicable), all program money (if applicable), and make a ~2% profit margin for all the pain in the ***, more power to you. Personally, I would think the guy is on glue, but that is his perogative.

 

[Jaynelson]

Treating the warranty repair fairly will generate good will and his business will grow and succeed. In contrast, taking a small town attitude and being punitive will only destroy the relationship and the exponential damage of a unhappy customer to the good will and word of mouth, which is the single most important factor to expanding and building a business.

I am a small town guy through and through, however, I still believe that warranty is warranty and service/parts revenue is as good from one customer as another. We are very near the US border, and with our strong CDN dollar for the past few years, buying vehicles in the US has been a big topic. We service and warranty anything from our brand that was bought across the line. If a guy has it in his head to buy something down there, I can play salesman bob till I'm blue in the face and not change a damn thing. I can give up every dime we make on the vehicle, and sometimes it's still less down there. So i we can't make money on the sale, all we can do is the service and build a relationship for next time. We have won some new customers from this; folks who bought across the line initially, but bought their next vehicle through us.....but we still didn't give them the car for cost

Now if it came down to 1 time slot for X repair before the weekend, and it was good customer who bought through us vs. buddy who bought across the line, well the solution is obvious. BUT that would be an extremely rare an extenuating circumstance; one we would avoid if at all possible.

 

[Jaynelson]

I hope that the banter and cadence of the topic has not ruffled any feathers the comments were meant in good spirit. I did receive a 'PM' from a member with a very articulate summary.

I agree....I'm often biased to play some version of "devils advocate" in a fleeting attempt to defend my retail brethern, however, I simply enjoy a good discussion

 

[Ndanger]

I agree....I'm often biased to play some version of "devils advocate" in a fleeting attempt to defend my retail brethern, however, I simply enjoy a good discussion

Understood, any business plan needs to be able to stand up to the "Worst case scenario"

I always enjoy the challenge overcoming objections which is probably the most important reason to do a biz plan outline, it forces a person to look at a project from all directions and only after passing the acid test can it succeed.

 

[deepdiver]

After much investagation, I dont think a buyers group would be feasable due the the Polaris requirement of forcing dealers to pony up the next year based on what they sold this year.

Big corporate farms may buy 200 ATV's a year and get a big discount. Obviously 4% profit on 200 is better than 5% on 5. The difference is that the farm ATV's are not toys and those groups buy a similar amount every year.

With Sleds..they are toys and I dont think you would find a dealer that would do a deal on 100 knowing what ramifications it would cause the following year..it could kill him so to speak. It is too risky due to the Polaris requirements.

It would need to be done with Polaris giving the waiver to the dealer on the following year. We all know how well polaris works with the consumer so I think this may be all a big pipe dream.

On paper most would be surprised that a dealer would turn away business...yet if it would kill him the next year he must consider that as well.

Now if there was a dealer that was going to retire and close shop the following year..that would work..maybe

Thanks to the different dealers that I spoke to that shed some light on this making it more understandable.

Like anything it was a good idea to toss around.

 

[beamslayer]

OK now we got that all aired out hows the group buy going Ndanger.??Whats the out-the-door deal?.Maybe more peeps will be interested.
If we could sell our cafe/bar than I would be standing in line.
Good luck

 

[trestlecreek]

OK, Ive seen people on here say as long as the local dealer is within $500 they would shop local. I agree. But what if you were in the market for 4 sleds, and the difference is $1300 each...

 

[Jaynelson]

OK, Ive seen people on here say as long as the local dealer is within $500 they would shop local. I agree. But what if you were in the market for 4 sleds, and the difference is $1300 each...

Get a total price on paper, ask your preffered dealer if he can meet, beat, come close, whatever. If he can't then....well, 5g's is a lot of money just to be a nice guy.

 

[Ndanger]

OK now we got that all aired out hows the group buy going Ndanger.??Whats the out-the-door deal?.Maybe more peeps will be interested.
If we could sell our cafe/bar than I would be standing in line.
Good luck

Here are the cliff notes on my odyssey to fine a totally awesome deal on new Polaris Pro's...

Best price award goes to Wisconsin by a huge margin at 9943 minus 450 cash for a total of 9500 and change plus 5% sales tax, total is 10,100.00 (2y warr instead of 4yr or 600 accessory promo).

The direction that I will be moving is to do a deal in Idaho at a target price of 10,300 (2y warr instead of 4yr or 600 accessory promo) and possibly rolling in a 100.00 incentive to bring it to 10,200 otd for a sled that retails for 11799.00 (these prices are pre tax). The dealership that I am working with has a very professional operation and facility.

So that is the name of that tune...

 

[trestlecreek]

Let us know on those prices ndanger. Getting close to checking.

 

[Ndanger]

Let us know on those prices ndanger. Getting close to checking.

I am going to have a meeting on Saturday to nail down price, I will PM you with some details.