My extremely biased all-brand review you're not gonna like

[mtnryder]

My hat is off to Jay and everyone who replied because no bashing and banging going on!! Hard to find a thread with this topic that doesn't bring out the worst brand loyal mean stuff. I think Poo, Ski Doo and Arctic Cat all make great sleds. Am going to look around for reviews on the Yammycats and Catyammys that are being tested.

 

[maxitout77]

Excellent review Jay. I have ridden all 3 sleds same day, numerous times(out east if that means anything to anyone) and agree with your assesments.

I will add the XM feels much more "tail happy" with the T-Motion. when you are carving hard or doing a circle, it really comes around fast. Also I found the sidehilling more unpredicable. It gets over nice and easy, but seems to wander a bit. Amazing how different it is than the XP. Night and day.

 

[eyefish123]

Great review Jay, nice that there is no bias towards brand and just the truth about what you found when your rode all three. Also nice of you to take one for all of us SnoWest readers and use your time to test sleds for us. If you need any help with future tests let me know.

 

[Bigrock33]

Thanks for the review Jay. Not a brand loyal person at all, rode more Yammi than any other sled over 30+ years. Currently have (2) 2012 Pro Rmk, ride with buddy with a 2013 XM all season. We continually swap sleds during a day, so have rode both in all different conditions. As much as I like the throttle response and power of the XM, I just can't like it much due to it's falling short of the Pro in carving, sidehilling and overall maneuverability. We are both close to the same weight and he feels his set up is spot on. He likes the Pro in almost every aspect over the XM except for the power where he feels the XM shines. I would tend to agree that his sled does have a bit more, especially at the bottom end. Both sleds are stock motors. We have drag raced against each other on each others sleds numerous times and the XM almost always gets the hole shot and then the Pro hangs right with the XM's rear bumper but can't pass it nor can the XM pull away. Clutching on the Pro has been spot on, so just think that the XM has a slight advantage at the start. My 2012 that has a Northstar kit will be even with him at the start and pull away by about 2 sled lengths regardless of which one of us is riding it. Pro feels "right" for me, XM feels "right" for him and that is all that really matters.

 

[geo]

Consensus is difficult when passion is involved. Your honest review Jay, makes it hard to put up a loyalist review 'cause all who've been out there and on em know it just ain't so. They're all better than what was available in 2012. That's good for us.

I'm a passionate sledder but not a loyalist. After a season on the Pro I'm pretty passionate about it but could ride any one of the three if it was needed. I usually fix things before they happen so issues and warranty are usually no consern for me.
I rode both the others alot this year because my area is a Cat and Doo area mostly (10 to 1) due to the dealers I think. So, I was the odd man out and just about everytime out with or meeting up with buds, I was asked to swap for a bit.
When stopped and chatting, we always discussed issues and dealer, we always exchanged accolades of each others sleds, and the thing that was said every time and made me chuckle was " Pretty snappy. I thought these things were down on power. What'ch ya do?" lol.
" Yup 130 ponies but pretty neat eh.`

I have the same order Jay but from a "not 50 anymore" guys perspective and on 155 ish tracks and important things to me point of view.

#1- Poo Pro. The chassis and motor has never shown me a limitation. It's always been me. Easiest sled every built to get unstuck. Easier than a 92 Phazer LT lol.
Least maintenance I've ever had to do on a sled. (not a single ride review).

#2 Cat. Oh so close. Still needs some tweaks for off throttle handling. Still trenches the most. Still needs a different factory in China for the outsourced parts. Still the hardest to get unstuck cause the front goes the deepest. But out in the open it shines.

#3 Doo. Oh so close. Still need to walk around the most on the boards or the chassis shows my limitations more quickly. Pretty easy to get unstuck! Feels bigger than the other two. Nicest sit down sled I've ever rode.

 

[Solby]

I have been around and ridden all 3 this year on different rides and different conditions, this is my simple take:

Sidehilling:
1 Pro
2 M8
3 XM

Power:
1 XM
2 M8 (close 2nd, maybe needs clutching)
3 Pro (deceptive but keeps up with other 2)

Fun Factor:
1 Pro
2 M8 & XM Tie

Point and shoot:
1 XM
2 M8
3 Pro

Trees:
1 Pro
2 M8
3 XM

Weight:
1 Pro
2 M8 & XM

Reliability:
1 XM
2 Pro & M8

I think it really comes down to where you ride and your terrain and what you enjoy doing. They are all great sleds, ride what fits you best!

 

[Jaynelson]

Great review Jay, nice that there is no bias towards brand and just the truth about what you found when your rode all three. Also nice of you to take one for all of us SnoWest readers and use your time to test sleds for us. If you need any help with future tests let me know.

Yes it was a long torturous day of riding borrowed sleds in new snow and sun LOL. It worked out really well that me and 2 friends could get all 3 demos for the same day, right at snow-check time. Both of the Nelson dealers are A-1.

When stopped and chatting, we always discussed issues and dealer, we always exchanged accolades of each others sleds, and the thing that was said every time and made me chuckle was " Pretty snappy. I thought these things were down on power. What'ch ya do?" lol.

Geo - my 2011 has been like that from day 1 for anyone who's ever borrowed it, and the 2013 is even more-so. The only place that sled has ever been underpowered was on the internet.

 

[bobback]

#2 Cat. Oh so close. Still needs some tweaks for off throttle handling. Still trenches the most. Still needs a different factory in China for the outsourced parts. Still the hardest to get unstuck cause the front goes the deepest. But out in the open it shines.

Why is it these Cats somewhat trench? I have an 11, and never noticed it until I rode a 12 and 13 Pro this year.

Just seems like the back of the Cat is slightly trenching, needs to get up on the snow. And I did the geo/mod but didn't notice any difference.

 

[geo]

Which geomod?

I discussed some of my feelings in a thread titled "2014 Skid Mount Locations" in the PC forum. If you read it and have some more questions PM me and I'll see if I can help.

I will say here though, one of Poo`s claim to fame as a stable and floating deep snow machine (besides being skinny and light out of the box lol), is their selection of drivers for the track.
Until someone else reintroduces the involute driver Poo will always have the advantage in the deep and will always climb up and out the quickest with the least trenching.

 

[icerider600]

Thanks Jay!! I have yet to ride the new Cat so I cant say anything about that, but my buddies new XM was better than my old XP by far, but the 2 main things I noticed was the XM motor was a screamer! But all it wanted to do was trench and it wouldnt stay on top of the snow? Same hill same place with my Pro, the motor doesnt seem to have as much power, but it stayed on top of the snow and climbed the hill way faster? Not just me saying this, my buddy and I swapped sleds and ran up the hill one after the other. Winterbrew said it also,maybe it wasnt setup for me either? Great thread Jay!!!

 

[cyoung]

Good to be having a discussion about how close they are

The only thing I might add to this is the setup really matters on the XM. No matter how hard you worked on the XP, it still generally sucked for agility. However, on the XM, the difference between a 154 and a 163 track is significant. Oddly, the 154 seems to climb better (probably due to faster track acceleration) and the 163 is more agile in the trees in deeper powder. The other significant difference comes from how tight the track limiter is and how high the handlebar mount is. For agility the best setup I've found on the XM is a 163 with a lower (than stock) handlebar mount and the track limiter all the way out. I weigh 200 lbs in full dress. In this configuration, I really can't tell the difference between the Pro and the XM other than where the balance point lies - and the fact the XM is definitely fatter between the legs when forward. When set up correctly for rider weight, there is absolutely no reason when side hilling in powder to need more than a little throttle as the mid-range torque of the etec and the non-ported track will keep you just chugging right along. All that said, the Pro is still easier to lay over when the snow is more challenging... When I win the lottery I want one of each. Probably better not ride the Cat then huh?

 

[Jaynelson]

^ Great notes....I would have liked to have all 163's for comparison, but beggers can't be choosers. There was a discussion over in the Doo section where some other guys did some comparison and noted the XM responded very well to disconnecting the sway bar, and that it helped some of the tendencies I was whining about. Would be worth following up on if you wanted an XM.

 

[RMK935VA]

Good review! I have not been on the Doo or the Cat so I can't say anything about it other than the comparison between the 11 and 13 Polaris. I had an 11 and I now have a 13. They do handle differently. I think it must be the different A-Arm geometry. As far as the motor, it is vastly superior to my 11. It has incredible throttle response with no bog/burble. I love the sled. I am going to put a Camoplast 162" by 3" track on it for next season. Several very good riders have told me that it is the single best modification that you can do to the Pro and it has the added benefit of not voiding my warranty. I have yet to try one out but I trust the guys who have told me how well it works. The required smaller drivers and anti-stab kit worry me a little. Does anyone have experience with this setup? If so, please PM me with your observations. Thanks.

 

[Dop]

Choose yourself

Nice replies guys, I agree nice to see a real topic without all the bashing. So food for though. I have rode buddies 13 Pro a number of times and He has ridden my Xm. When I first got on my Xm (163) it was all over the place couldn't keep it under me, it's nothing like my XP turbo.

Took Three full rides before it all started coming together, everything was so touchy if you put just 5 lbs of extra pressure on the rail to lean it turned. For me the xm now does what i want and I kid the guys I think it she does it's effortless side hilling, the timber and the boulder fields are a blast. With Three foot of pow tho wished I had my turbo.
Buddy didn't like the narrow handlebars and says its squirrelly as all get out. For me it take a lot more effort to pull the Pro up on edge and the balance point is smaller on the Pro. I was impressed with the power the pro gets to the track. However I think skidoo has finally got the clutching right after all these years the XM 163 is the only sled the clutching feels spot on. Excluding the 12 as I never got a leg over one.
The XM is a Love it the first three minutes and Hate it for the next three days then it all comes full circle.

Now for the Bad New for all us brand Specific Riders. They are making Great Stockers from the factory Mountian sleds that work without having to spend thousands to get a sled where we want.

Hope I didn't offend anyone Good Day

 

[Teth-Air]

Good review! I have not been on the Doo or the Cat so I can't say anything about it other than the comparison between the 11 and 13 Polaris. I had an 11 and I now have a 13. They do handle differently. I think it must be the different A-Arm geometry. As far as the motor, it is vastly superior to my 11. It has incredible throttle response with no bog/burble. I love the sled. I am going to put a Camoplast 162" by 3" track on it for next season. Several very good riders have told me that it is the single best modification that you can do to the Pro and it has the added benefit of not voiding my warranty. I have yet to try one out but I trust the guys who have told me how well it works. The required smaller drivers and anti-stab kit worry me a little. Does anyone have experience with this setup? If so, please PM me with your observations. Thanks.

The change in gearing with the smaller drivers is probably an excellent thing for the Pro as the are geared so high in stock form. Personally I don't agree with too much traction for a Pro chassis as these sleds must be ridden like a motorbike and track spin is required to initiate banking in the snow. Too much traction will just propel you forward when you want to spin and throw it on 1 ski.

 

[sled_guy]

I haven't been able to ride a Doo since the Rev first came out. Last year, with the XM, that changed, I could finally ride it without it trying to kill me.

So the 14s were of interest to me when I got to ride them. Well, for 2014 the top end offerings haven't changed from 2013. Cat has a different seat and put the HCR cooler on the M so it lost some weight, but otherwise, no real change and the 3 sleds.

I found that the XM is better to ride in deeper fluff then in less fluff. Yeah, probably true with all of them. But the XM still wants to fall off the hill when there is only about 1' of powder. If you find a hill with 2'-3' then it doesn't have that tendency.

All in all, 2014 is a ho-hum year. If you can find a screaming deal on a left over 2013 buy it and save yourself some big money.

sled_guy

 

[jhurkot]

The change in gearing with the smaller drivers is probably an excellent thing for the Pro as the are geared so high in stock form. Personally I don't agree with too much traction for a Pro chassis as these sleds must be ridden like a motorbike and track spin is required to initiate banking in the snow. Too much traction will just propel you forward when you want to spin and throw it on 1 ski.

Smaller drivers will make the gearing even higher.

 

[turboless terry]

Smaller drivers gear you down.

 

[Merlin]

Had a great time riding demo's from the 3 big brands on Sunday. Just an average (but mountain specific) rider's POV.

Thank you for the review!

It's a refreshing change to read something other than the usual brand tilted verbal diarrhea.....................

Although I'm completely happy with my Polaris product if someone walked up & offered me a free XM or PC it'd be "Thank you, thank you very much!".............

 

[smwizzz]

Uh huh....

Yes it was a long torturous day of riding borrowed sleds in new snow and sun LOL. It worked out really well that me and 2 friends could get all 3 demos for the same day, right at snow-check time. Both of the Nelson dealers are A-1.


I feel the stress and pain it caused you lol. I have yet to try the new cat. Hopefully this weekend. We should actually be in Nelson on tuesday for a few days if you want to join us for a tough day of putting sleds through their paces. It will be tough but I am doing a test to see how many km it takes to wear out my sleds. We could try and get through a couple days..... It will be hard and no one should have to suffer so but we must do what we must do!!!

Seriously... join us for a ride!!! Probly stay at the motel kitty corner to Main Jet. Look for us.