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Interesting thoughts on glue failures.

No issues with submersion... But... If there is capillary or filliform corrsion... water can cause the tube itself to rust and possibly "creep" under the adhesive and release.

I see this all the time in pwc. Corrosion displaces the gasket and either creates a leak on when freezing, pushes the gasket out, breaking it. I'm 100% certain this will happen to the arms. In line for my new timbersled front end....
 
I talked to my local dealer today, they were shocked to hear about this, both the owner and the service manager. They are going to look into it. Nobody can figure out where the water would come from. Who in their right mind would either wash a sled or let it sit in the rain before shrink wrapping it?
Just for the guys who haven't seen one, Polaris has metal crates that they re-use every year, and they install the sled in them covered in that white shrink wrap. Only this stuff has a zipper all around it, and the lower half is actually bolted under the ski fixture bracket. It looks to me like they take the bottom half of the shrink, lay it on the crate, then put the sled on top, bolt the skis in, then put the top half on, zip it up, then hit it with a heat gun and shrink wrap it. I could be wrong, but it looks that way to me. And the lower half has drainage holes in it for water to escape.
 
Someone should do some research, both this arm issue and what I was talking about today with the service manager. Polaris arms need to be either sealed completely or vented. Skidoo arms need to have a "crush zone" put into them so they fold before damaging modules. Either holes drilled, a cut made, grind a spot thinner, ???
 
So more interesting stuff. The lower arms are a different part number this year, and 2013 part number supercedes to the 2014 number.
I think I have mentioned this before, but it does not take much heat to break the glue bond on a QD backer. 10 seconds with a cheapy propane torch, a little prying with a screwdriver, and it popped right off, leaving some glue on backer and some on the tunnel.
Anyone know at what temp this glue is supposed to release/fail?
 
Oh, they also went nuts with the glue and dielectric grease this year. Globs of glue everywhere and the grease is on EVERYTHING that is electrical or in the general area of anything electrical, lol. Even a glob dripped on the hood under the gauge. Seems like they are taking more time during assembly, so that is a good thing.
 
Very interesting observation. If there is water in places it shouldn't be and it freezes, well, ice can move/break anything. It would easily break aluminum or carbon fibre tubing. You might be on to something here.
 
If I can find time, I will dunk a 2014 arm under water and see if it bubbles. I bet they sealed them better this year and that is the difference in part numbers. The price also skyrocketed on them, $320 retail. :face-icon-small-con
 
Interesting stuff...I think the answer may be "all of the above"

- Full of water + freezing + expansion in some cases
- Manufacturing issues in others
- Corrosion "undermining" the bond in others

They are all very plausible. If the water intrusion is a main contributor, I would think that may be an easy fix via drilling vent/drain hole(s)??
 
There's vids out there from the line - testing a-arms after bonding, wrapping the sled for ship (and how it was described is about how they do it).

I doubt the arm bond release is a pure assembly defect, given their post-assembly tests, experience with the glue over the years, and proto testing. Could be poorly designed tests, but an environmental cause from all the situations that only the unpaid R&D team can provide is a more likely candidate. One thing is for sure - the arm glue is releasing for too many folks.

My 11 had zero di-electric grease - I'll take too much every day. The 11's looked like they were wired by one eyed prison inmates, with the harness engineered by a Rosseau high school shop class dropout. They've got nothing on BRP in that regard.
 
I think the 14 s are built pretty cleanly for sure. I have to find a bucket big enough for an arm, the curiousity is driving me nuts, lol.
Drrrr, bathtub.
Brb. :)
 
Exactly what I thought, the arms are watertight now.
The carbon overstructure is far from it. The tops of the tubes have a metal insert/cap in them that both caps the tubes and provides bushings for the upper attachment bolts, so the carbon doesn't crush. I don't know if those are supposed to be glued in or not, these aren't. And they leak. There are holes in the tubes down low to provide drainage, one side they are open, the other side they have the zip tie inserts in them, but still allow water out.
 
Ok. Mystery solved. Mile High Powersports in McCall loaned me a 2013 arm for comparison.
1) Looking at it at the shop, it looked like a definite lack of glue on the 13.
2) The 2014 is watertight, the 2013 leaks.
3) The 2014 has NO glue holes in the aluminum, the 2013 does. (Yet the 2014is glued better.)
4) The parts, aluminum end, bushings, etc. appear to be identical between the two, OTHER than the lack of glue insertion holes on the 2014 part.
Both arms:

004.jpg
 
SO: Where does the 2013 arm leak/take on water? First guy (or girl) to guess correctly gets 10% off anything in my Ebay store, and the satisfaction of knowing that they are mad smart. :)
 
SO: Where does the 2013 arm leak/take on water? First guy (or girl) to guess correctly gets 10% off anything in my Ebay store, and the satisfaction of knowing that they are mad smart. :)

There's holes by welds on my 13.
 
Ding ding. Sorta vague, but yah. Nothing to do with glue. Big gap in the weld, both legs, both leaking about the same amount, based on bathtub bubbles.

009.jpg 011.jpg
 
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