Interesting thoughts on glue failures.

[Devilmanak]

So I find this interesting. I wonder if some of the freak Polaris glue/part failures could be due to something other than the initial build?
I have parted out 3 new Pros as of now, 2x 2013 and I am in the middle of a 2014. I got this one in the crate, when I cut the shrink wrap off, it was soaked inside. Not just condensation, SOAKED. And the shrink wrap has holes in the bottom for drainage. I just now pulled the front overstructure off, was going to put it in a box and tipped it upside down in the process, about a half cup of water poured out of the carbon fiber tubes! Which means that there is no drainage out the bottom, and water can get into them from the top. Freeze/thaw cycle that much water in a smallish tube like that and what would happen? Maybe nothing, but what if the tubes were FULL of water? Again, this sled was brand new, I wonder if it would fill the tubes to the top after use? Something to mull over/argue about.
Chris

 

[Sunvang]

Would there get more water in, than the amount that evaporates during riding?

 

[metallicat]

that would make some sense..... if it is not sealed completely, and water can somehow leak in over time even, there might not be enough air flow in there to let it evaporate quickly and freeze. hhmmmm.... maybe that's why some would break and some wouldn't? Some are sealed up better than others?

 

[wjl]

Good observation.
When I pulled my a arms about a month ago the lowers were filled with water. (about a 1/2 cup each tube all rust colored) The sled had been sitting since may, inside on a stand. I would have thought it would evaporate with as dry summer here in Utah.
In the a arms there is no place for it to drain and it can enter via the holes by the mounting points.
Water eating away at the tubes inside out, could it also soften the glue being the is were the cast part and the tube meet, freeze and re freeze
Something to think about, water can do some bad things.

 

[Super Dave3]

I am curious why you would be parting out a 2014?

 

[wjl]

http://www.snowest.com/forum/showthread.php?t=354228

Because parts are needed.

 

[Devilmanak]

Wow, I wondered about the arms when I saw the water in the tubes, I don't remember a lot of the glue in the structures failing, but the arms sure did.

 

[Devilmanak]

One of the 13s I bought last year I had to have the shocks warrantied, there was so much corrosion on the shafts. I think that was due to a ripped cover and road salt during transport though. This 14 didn't have any holes/rips in the shrink.

 

[AndrettiDog]

It's an interesting argument. Some simply say that it's silly to use glue to hold stuff together. Planes, trains and automobiles use it very successfully so I don't buy that argument. I do think that Polaris tests their setups just as much as the next sled manufacturer. In fact I hear more stories of people running into Polaris testing than the others. Maybe something as simple as how they ship their products or how they wrap them up could lead to failures. It's not a consistent problem all across the board (no glue issues here to this point).

 

[gmustangt]

The question is a technical one.

What is the data on lords resistance to moisture/water? MH?

 

[gman086]

The question is a technical one.

What is the data on lords resistance to moisture/water? MH?

Water resistance does not come into play here at all, the chemical crosslinking is not affected by moisture, I can assure you (adhesives is my background). The question, and possibly valid, relates to PHYSICS and the expansion of water volume when freezing.

Have FUN!

G MAN

 

[wjl]

I did not have a failure but was puzzled with the moisture has no way to escape.
As you said the expansion and contraction is the a problem but what water dumped out was all rusty colored. This is eating the inside out. It would take a long time to fail this way but it can not help.
I would have never known unless I would have removed the lower ams and set them mounting points down.
How many sleds have there arms filled with water and do not know, just like the CF tubes.

 

[Dirty Steve]

I had shock warranteed on my SBA due to moisture in the crate. I noticed at the dealer when the sled was being set up that the left front shock rubber bumper was positioned in the middle of the shaft. After the first ride it had slid down where it should be as expected and there was a nasty rust spot on the shaft where the bumper had been sitting. Definitely makes sense that it could be freezing and thawing in the arm that is breaking the bond.

Could you drill a small diameter weep hole at the underside of the socket? I haveheard of guys putting in a rivet to help rretain the tube in case of a glue failure, this would be a much smaller hole. Or perhaps filling in the end where the water could enter with silicone would do the trick?

I think if I buy Pro after this season, I am just going to plan on putting on some aftermarket a-arms right off the bat and either sell the stockers or keep them as spares.

 

[Devilmanak]

Interesting, interesting....those shocks I had warrantied had the same thing, rust and shaft chrome flaking under the bumper. Also the brass fitting where they are charged was all corroded.
So take the lightest sled out there, fill all the tubes with water, what do they weigh?

 

[dude]

now now Chris the tread was staying on topic till you brought up sled weight

I like the idea of drilling a small hole to let any water drain out plus a little silicone to keep it from getting in...

 

[Devilmanak]

LOL. If you drill one hole just to plug another you aren't solving anything, especially as much time as yours spends upside down.

 

[mountainhorse]

No issues with submersion... But... If there is capillary or filliform corrsion... water can cause the tube itself to rust and possibly "creep" under the adhesive and release.

 

[Devilmanak]

Personally I think Polaris just had some bad employees/procedures with new technology. (To them.) I can remember 94 Chevy truck doors falling off in Alaska when the glue released at 60 below zero, lol.
Now why some sleds are full of water is a good question, unless they were sitting outside in the rain before being shrinked. Shrunked. Shrunken. Shrankeded.

 

[dude]

LOL. If you drill one hole just to plug another you aren't solving anything, especially as much time as yours spends upside down.

Not sure how to take that comment Christopher Good point on maybe not solving anything by drilling one hole then plugging the other hole LOL

 

[Devilmanak]

Actually, you are right. YOU are the one always upside down OVER your sled. Can't tell you how many times I saw you frontflipping last year. 163 in the driveway.