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Flu Vacinations

Flu vaccination or not?

  • Yes Get the vaccination

    Votes: 22 26.8%
  • No, skip the vaccination

    Votes: 60 73.2%

  • Total voters
    82
Depends. What do you do for a living? What is your exposure risk? Any other health concerns? Any infants or small children in your house? If you have a baby or a small child, I'd say get it, because you've lessened the chance of exposing them to something.

For what it's worth, my wife is a physician. She counsels all of her patients to get it (unless they have other medical conditions which would create unnecessary risk). I used to get one maybe 50% of the time. There were years I got it and still got sick, and years that I didn't get it and never got sick, so obvioulsy it ain't foolproof.

Having said that, now that I have a two-year old, I do get one every year, just to minimize his chances of getting sick. It's the old and the young who die from this stuff.

We have a winner. If you have little kids or less then perfect health kids get it. If you work with lots of people get it.

I work in a hospital and I get it. Not so much for me, but because of all the sick people I deal with. I don't want to be bringing that crap home to my family.
 
I was told to get it...so I stood in line, sniffed twice and it was done. I have no idea what I was given. :)
 
I was told to get it...so I stood in line, sniffed twice and it was done. I have no idea what I was given. :)


I was going to bring up that point, all the frenzy around this vaccine seems to be generated with the injection of killed virus. I havn't seen anything negative involving the weakend live virus given orally by sniffing a mist thru your nose.

anyone?

This seems much more desirable to an injection.



Superjag-

The fear around this vaccination comes from the massive amounts of information and misinformation circulating around. The general public (who doesn't research anything) is getting it from their friends and co-workers that this vaccine is bad and will make you wet the bed and drool on yourself until you finally die. I think the basic problem is they simply do not trust the government, to make matters worse some government has made it manditory for certian people which just fuels the anti-trust conspiracy theory crowd.

Another problem is a general mis-trust of the media, the media is suppost to tell us the truth, do the investigations for us on our behalf but they do not. And theren lies the problem. No amount of truthful information will change this, mistrust trumps all truth.
 
I was going to bring up that point, all the frenzy around this vaccine seems to be generated with the injection of killed virus. I havn't seen anything negative involving the weakend live virus given orally by sniffing a mist thru your nose.

anyone?

This seems much more desirable to an injection.

Ok, with regard to the "regular" flu vaccine (not H1N1), my understanding from talking to a friend who is an infectious diseases physician, is that currently the available data indicates that the injection has been proven to be more effective in adults than the nasal spray. (For kids, the spray has been proven just about as effective as the injection.) I did some looking online, and that seems to be the majority view. However, with regard to the H1N1 vaccine, my understanding is that a large percentage of the first available doses will be in spray form (so they can be used easily with kids), and they will be giving those to adults as well, especially "high exposure risk" adults like Xrated and my wife. I guess the rationale is something is certainly better than nothing.



Superjag-

The fear around this vaccination comes from the massive amounts of information and misinformation circulating around. The general public (who doesn't research anything) is getting it from their friends and co-workers that this vaccine is bad and will make you wet the bed and drool on yourself until you finally die. I think the basic problem is they simply do not trust the government, to make matters worse some government has made it manditory for certian people which just fuels the anti-trust conspiracy theory crowd.

Another problem is a general mis-trust of the media, the media is suppost to tell us the truth, do the investigations for us on our behalf but they do not. And theren lies the problem. No amount of truthful information will change this, mistrust trumps all truth.

And therein lies my frustration. I'm not saying that people should blindly accept what they are told, or that in certain instances the potential risks do not outweigh the benefits. In fact quite the opposite. Like I said in my earlier post, people should gather their own information and draw their own conclusions. But when you have a situation like this one, where the vast majority of physicians and researchers agree that any risks associated with the vaccine are severely outweighed by the expected benefits, it seems like a no-brainer to me. Especially if you have children. It's like my earlier reference to autism and childhood vaccines. There was all of this rumor and fear-mongering, when the data clearly failed to establish a causal relationship between the vaccines and autism. Now add to that the fact that we KNOW the risks associated with things like diphtheria and polio, and it makes it very hard for me to understand why people would roll the dice, especially when it comes to their children's lives.

But who the h*ll knows what RMK7 took. Probably some female growth hormones or something. :D

H2Snow, I'm still waiting. Shouldn't be that hard to prove me wrong, given all of your "research".
 
Probably. Administered by a Navy Corpsman, and those guys need all the advantage they can get against us Marines. lol :D

My bro-in-law flies Growlers for the Navy. He'll get a kick out of that when I tell him. I am a bit surprised that the Navy guys gave you the mist rather than trying to stick you in the a.., aw never mind.
 
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Probably. Administered by a Navy Corpsman, and those guys need all the advantage they can get against us Marines. lol :D
i heard this one the other night about marines and navy.

the marines ARE a section of the navy..........................the MENS section

:D:D:D:D:D
 
i heard this one the other night about marines and navy.

the marines ARE a section of the navy..........................the MENS section

:D:D:D:D:D

That is freaking hilarious. I cannot wait to use that on my bro-in-law.
 
Checked out the "max" board at the awesome gym on base here in FL...most pullups is 62, done by a Navy Petty Officer. #2 was a Marine with 60.

Anyone who can do 62 dead-hang pullups non-stop is a freakin stud, blue side or green.
 
"It’s The Vaccines Stupid!"
Part I: Evidence Linking Autism Rise in Children to Vaccinations:
http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=15074

WHO, CDC and FDA knew all about mercury dangers in 2000, minutes of meeting reveal:
http://www.theflucase.com/index.php...-reveal&catid=1:latest-news&Itemid=64&lang=en

Will the normal flu shot contain "bird flu"? Belgium documents spark speculation :
http://www.theflucase.com/index.php...&catid=41:highlighted-news&Itemid=105&lang=en


You people who got either one of the shots are flat out stupid. There is more then enough evidence and research out there to know that it's unsafe.
Why would you trust one of the shots but not the N1H1 shot?????
They come from the same damn place, ordered by our government / Big Brother.
This is my own opinion and it's still sorta a free country so you can take that juicy shot if you think injecting chemicals into your body will help you. :confused:

If im totally f'ed up and totally wrong on this then still, atleast i took precautions naturally without injecting some companys vaccine into me that is all about making money. Just like big pharma.


Do NOT Let Your Child Get Flu Vaccine -- 9 Reasons Why

Posted by: Dr. Mercola
October 06 2009 | 219,761 views

This year it is more important that you protect your children and loved ones from the flu vaccines than influenza itself. This article on Lew Rockwell discusses how:

The swine flu is simply another flu. It is not unusually deadly.

This is the first time both seasonal and pandemic flu vaccines will be administered. Both seasonal flu and swine flu vaccines will require two inoculations. This is because single inoculations have failed to produce sufficient antibodies. This is an admission that prior flu vaccines were virtually useless. Can you trust them this time?

Adjuvants are added to vaccines to boost production of antibodies but may trigger autoimmune reactions. Some adjuvants are mercury (thimerosal), aluminum and squalene. Why would you sign a consent form for your children to be injected with mercury, which is even more brain-toxic than lead?

This is the first year mock vaccines have been used to gain FDA approval. The vaccines that have been tested are not the same vaccines your children will be given.

Over-vaccination is a common practice now in America. American children are subjected to 29 vaccines by the age of two. Meanwhile, veterinarians have backed off of repeat vaccination in dogs because of observed side effects.

Modern medicine has no explanation for autism, despite its continued rise in prevalence. Yet autism is not reported among Amish children who go unvaccinated.

Researchers are warning that over-use of the flu vaccine and anti-flu drugs like Tamiflu and Relenza can apply genetic pressure on flu viruses and then they are more likely to mutate into a more deadly strain.

Most seasonal influenza A (H1N1) virus strains tested from the United States and other countries are now resistant to Tamiflu (oseltamivir). Tamiflu has become a nearly worthless drug against seasonal flu.

Public health officials are irresponsible in their omission of any ways to strengthen immunity against the flu. No options outside of problematic vaccines and anti-flu drugs are offered, despite the fact there is strong evidence that vitamins C and D activate the immune system and the trace mineral selenium prevents the worst form of the disease.

http://www.theflucase.com/index.php...mercola&catid=1:latest-news&Itemid=64&lang=en
 
Stop being stupid sheeple

How many websites do you want me to throw up here??? There are hundreds of them. Show me where a website says it is best to beat the flu with a vaccine then with the following???

Boosting Immunity

Get plenty of sleep. Potent immune enhancing compounds are released during sleep and many immune system functions are greatly increased by an adequate night’s rest. Studies have demonstrated that people who are consistently deprived of sleep have impaired immune function. If you require an alarm clock or some other external stimulus to wake, you’re not getting an adequate night’s rest. During the winter months your body requires more sleep, so it’s perfectly normal to sleep longer on winter nights.

Drink more water; avoid soft drinks. Many people are chronically dehydrated and this impairs the immune system. Soft drinks and caffeinated beverages do not count toward “drinking more water” and, in fact, subtract from it (as they generally act as diuretics). Consider using Emer’gen-C or Ola Loa (in moderation) in lieu of soft drinks (see section on vitamin C below).

Selenium. Selenium is a nutrient which plays an important role in the immune system. One way selenium performs this function is by “recharging” vitamins C and E, and coenzyme Q-10. Vegetables grown in selenium rich soils are a good source, but vegetables raised in selenium deficient soils are not. (Most of China has selenium deficient soils, which may explain why so much influenza originates in China.) Brazil nuts have the most selenium of any food, but pre-cracked nuts usually have dramatically lower amounts than those in the shells (because of the soils in which they are raised). Brewer’s yeast, eggs, turkey, mushrooms, tuna and other seafood are often good sources, but the amount can vary dramatically, depending on various factors. If you buy selenium supplements, look for the organic amino acid form “selenomethionine” (L-selenomethionine is the naturally occurring form) as this is more bioavailable than the inorganic form “selenite.” 200 mcg/daily is recommended by some authorities.

Probiotic. A probiotic will fortify your intestinal flora, which are essential for proper digestion and nutrient absorption. This is key to good health and a strong immune system. Studies have shown that patients who begin a course of probiotics with fiber a few days prior to surgery are less likely to pick up a post-operative infection during their hospital stays. This demonstrates a strong connection between intestinal flora and immune function. The fiber – which provides the friendly bacteria both food and sanctuary – can be as simple as an apple or banana. Primal Defense is a fine probiotic product. Other ways of fortifying your intestinal flora include eating unpasteurized* fermented or cultured foods, such as yogurt (without added sugars), sauerkraut, miso, (real) cheese, natto, apple cider, apple cider vinegar, etc. Unfortunately our society is enamored with pasteurization, so finding beneficial unpasteurized live foods can be difficult. For this reason, a probiotic regime is recommended for optimal health.

* Pasteurization is not necessary if proper sanitation procedures are employed in food handling and processing. Too often pasteurization is used to cover up poor sanitation practices. Pasteurization always results in a nutritionally inferior food product. Avoid it whenever you can.
Drink chlorine-free water. Healthy intestinal flora is key to good digestion and nutrient absorption. Chlorinated water kills beneficial intestinal flora. Don’t drink it. Use a filter, if necessary, to remove chlorine (and its byproducts) from your drinking water.

Elderberry extract. Elderberry, a relative of the blueberry, has been found to have powerful anti-viral properties. Elderberry extract may be used to treat a cold or flu, or taken as a prophylactic to fortify the immune system. Sambucol is a popular brand, however it is mostly glucose syrup. My feeling is that the Apitherapy Honey Organic Elderberry Extract with Propolis product by Honey Gardens is superior. It contains raw honey and propolis (both of which are immune boosting) without added sugar.

Red Wine. It has been found that those who drink a glass of red wine daily are about 20% less likely to contract the flu. It is believed that this may be related to the vitamins and antioxidants, like resveratrol, present in red wine (but largely absent in white or blush wines). Although alcohol tends to depress the immune system, drinking a glass or two of red wine when sick with a cold or flu is probably not detrimental and may prove beneficial. Other studies have shown a daily glass of red wine is beneficial to the heart, and lowers the odds of developing Alzheimer’s disease and other types of age-related dementia (probably due to the resveratrol). Excessive alcohol use, however, is definitely detrimental to health.

Eat raw, freshly-crushed garlic. Garlic has powerful anti-viral, antibiotic and anti-fungal properties and boosts the immune system in general. It also tends to kill parasites in the intestines.

Deodorized garlic tablets are ineffective in this regard because it is the “smelly” compounds in garlic which give garlic its anti-viral and anti-bacterial effect. Also, it is likely that no single compound in garlic confers all its therapeutic effects. It is likely to be a synergy of compounds. Any refinement, such as deodorizing, is likely to remove beneficial compounds. One example of the synergy of compounds contained in garlic are alliin and an enzyme called allinase. In whole garlic, these two constituents are segregated, but when a garlic clove is “damaged” (e.g. crushed) the two mix together to quickly produce allicin: A pungent, potent antibacterial sulphur compound which is not present in whole garlic! Heat destroys allicin, and so does age (it is most potent when consumed within the first hour). One final note: “Allicin potential” of deodorized garlic supplements is a marketing gimmick to convince you the product has value as an anti-viral; it does not. Don’t be fooled and don’t waste your money on this sham.

Exercise. Regular exercise is important to support general health and immune function. It stimulates beneficial biochemical processes, promotes healthy circulation of the blood, and drives the lymphatic system. Lymph flow, essential in removing toxins from the body, is absolutely dependent on physical movement because the lymphatic system lacks a pump (like the heart). Therapeutic massage can also be helpful in facilitating lymph movement.

Note: Extreme exercise can actually weaken the immune system and increase susceptibility to infection. Quercetin can help mitigate this effect.

Echinacea has a reputation as an immune system booster, and research seems to validate this. If nothing else, it makes a delicious tea.

Vitamin C. See discussion in section below.

Vitamin D. See discussion in section below.

Quercetin, in addition to its powerful antioxidant characteristics, has been found to have immune boosting capabilities, particularly when under stress, and especially when taken with Vitamin C. It is also an anti-viral. Quercetin is a phytochemical found in the skins of apples (red apples have the most, although any variety is a good source), and in sun-exposed† red or dark grapes, red wine (especially when made from made from sun-exposed grapes), sun-dried raisins, red or yellow onions, broccoli, berries (particularly blueberries, cranberries, lingonberries, bilberries, and Eurasian black currants), citrus fruits, cherries, pears, green tea, grapefruit seeds, ginkgo biloba, buckwheat, hawthorn, Chinese scullcap, and black tea. Smaller amounts are found in leafy green vegetables and beans. Bromelain and papain are reported to increase absorption of quercetin.

† Quercetin accumulates in grape skins to protect against damage from ultra violet light. There are high concentrations of quercetin in sun exposed grape skins and in red wines made from sun exposed grapes.

Notes: Quercetin may help to prevent Alzheimer’s disease. In some wines, particularly Sangiovese, quercetin may settle as a precipitate at the bottom of the bottle. Avoid taking the drug cisplatin along with quercetin as there is theoretical risk of genotoxicity in normal tissues.

Avoid Cortisone. It depresses the immune system; that is how it works. Cortisone stops pain, inflammation, itching, swelling, etc. by blocking and suppressing the normal response of your immune system. It doesn’t matter if you use it topically, orally, or by injection.

Note: For acute inflammation, turmeric can be as effective as either cortisone or the drug phenylbutazone (both of which are associated with toxicity to humans).

Avoid sugary foods. Sugar can decrease the activity of the immune system for up to five hours. If you have a sweet tooth, discover stevia or xylitol. Stevia is economical, but somewhat tricky to use in cooking. Xylitol can actually stimulate the immune system.

Stevia is a natural herb which is between 100-300 times sweeter than sugar. Unlike aspartame (NutraSweet) or sucralose (Splenda), stevia is actually safe and even has many beneficial properties. Aside from containing no calories, it can actually help stabilize blood-sugar levels (thus it is both safe and beneficial to diabetics), can help fight gum disease, and has many other benefits too numerous to mention here. Stevia is temperature stable, so unlike most artificial sugar substitutes, it can be used in baking. Ironically, the US’s FDA has banned stevia as “an unsafe food additive” while sanctioning its use as a “food supplement.” So according to the FDA, it’s “unsafe” in small amounts (as a sweetener), but safe in larger doses (as a supplement). Most observers feel this is a wholly political move to protect both the sugar and artificial sweetener industries. Unfortunately, this means you won’t find commercially prepared foods containing stevia in the United States, although you will find them in many other countries throughout the world. You might find stevia in some teas in the US, however, if it’s included for “medicinal purposes.” For more information on this remarkable herb, visit: http://www.stevia.net/.

Xylitol, technically a sugar-alcohol, is neither a sugar nor alcohol in the conventional sense. It too is a safe “sugar substitute” (use 1:1), but is low on the glycemic index (7) so it can be safely used by diabetics. It is actually good for your teeth (it will help harden tooth enamel and discourages bacteria which can harm your teeth) and can help boost your immune system. Even more interesting is the fact it can be used in a nasal spray wash which can be used to fight colds and flu (see below). It occurs naturally in many fruits & vegetables and is even produced by the human body. Commercial sources are usually birch trees and corn cobs. It tends to be rather pricey when used as a sugar substitute. It cannot be used in yeast breads as the xylitol inhibits yeast growth, nor in hard candies because it won’t crystalize like sugar. Other than that, it is a complete sugar substitute with half the calories. [Note: In large quantities, it can lead to loose bowels; the effect diminishes with regular use.]

Honey. Although honey contains various sugars, it is also packed with vitamins and nutrients which can enhance the immune system. Raw honey is best. Avoid pasteurized honey. Pasteurization is unnecessary as honey does not spoil (even after 5000 years in an Egyptian pyramid), and the heat destroys some of the nutrients. Raw honey is also useful as a dressing for burns (as it prevents infection and promotes healing).

Turmeric is an anti-inflammatory and an immune stimulant. Taken internally, it may tend to thin the blood. When applied topically to a bleeding wound, it will help to clot the wound, prevent infection, and promote healing.

Warning about flu vaccination: Five successive flu vaccinations increases your risk of contracting Alzheimer’s disease by a factor of 10, likely due to the mercury (thimerosal) and aluminum in the vaccine. Alzheimer’s is a fatal disease, and one of the worst possible ways to die. Only 0.01% of the US population (1 in 10,000) will die from complications related to the flu each year. And 90% of those deaths will be senior citizens (a group with an already high mortality rate). You are more likely to die in an automobile accident in your life (1%), than from the flu. Given the dubious effectiveness of the flu vaccine from year to year, and the treatable nature of the flu, is this a sensible trade-off?

Vaccinations are neither risk-free nor as safe as the public generally believes. Virtually all vaccines contain toxic preservatives, carcinogens, and other harmful non-vaccine compounds, such as mercury (considered a toxin at any level), aluminum, formalin (formaldehyde), ethylene glycol (antifreeze), phenol (carbolic acid), etc. After all, the viruses must be killed (or weakened), and the serum preserved while in storage. Long-term effects and accumulative toxicity must be part of any rational consideration of vaccines, especially for a vaccine which is administered yearly.

http://quanta-gaia.org/health/coldsAndFlu.html
 
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I'm with Skinner, headed on a cruise the end of Oct. Gonna get both the regular and the H1N1. It'll be the first time for me getting any shot like that.


Well you two just go ahead and have a merry f' in christmas then!


I guess this poll lies and is a conspiracy theory to.

Yes Get the vaccination 8 19.05%
No, skip the vaccination 34 80.95%
 
Oh boy, another conspiracy theorist. All the foil hats are coming out today.
But I'll play your game too.
Post me one link from a REPUTABLE medical authority which recommends not getting the vaccine.
How about I start? The Center For Disease Control, generally considered the preeminent authority on the subject, at least in this country, reccomends that anyone who wants to reduce the risk of getting the flu should get a shot.
See here: http://www.cdc.gov/FLU/protect/keyfacts.htm
As does the World Health Organization.
See here:http://www.who.int/csr/disease/influenza/vaccinerecommendations/en/
So does Johns Hopkins. See here: http://www.parents.com/baby/health/vaccinations/the-flu-vaccine/?page=2

But you clearly know more than all of them. Where did you get your MD/PhD again?

So, while you may be able to find isolated sources to try and back up your claims. I will say it again for the 3rd time: THE VAST CONSENSUS OF MEDICAL EXPERTS TAKE THE POSITION THAT THE RISKS OF THE VACCINE ARE FAR OUTWEIGHED BY THE BENEFITS.

Oh and Yamahamod, as I already stated, the autism-vaccine link is not considered valid by most mainstream physicians. Been pretty well debunked already.
See here: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22542677/ns/health-mental_health/
 
CDC - Trust them? LOL
Lawmakers sever ties between CDC and Big Pharma
http://www.lawyersandsettlements.com/articles/00285/CDC_Big_Pharma.html#

Vaccination Quotes by 100's of Doctors.
They all are working toward the conspiracy therories! Right.
Who are the one's making the billions here?

http://vaclib.org/basic/quotes.htm :eek:

"Autism may be a disorder linked to the disruption of the G-alpha protein, affecting retinoid receptors in the brain. A study of sixty autistic children suggests that autism may be caused by inserting a G-alpha protein defect, the pertussis toxin found in the D.P.T. vaccine, into genetically at-risk children." --Mary N. Megson, M.D.

"This report describes six mothers who received live virus vaccines and one who received a Hepatitis B vaccine during pregnancy after having received an MMR booster five months prior to conception. All the children who resulted from these pregnancies have had developmental problems, six out seven (85%) were diagnosed with autism, and the seventh seems to exhibit symptoms often associated with autistic spectrum disorders." --F. EdwardYazbak, MD

"Every day new parents are ringing us. They all have the same tragic story. Healthy baby, child, teenager, usually a boy, given the DPT (diphtheria, pertussis and tetanus) or DT (diphtheria and tetanus), MMR or MMR booster followed by a sudden fall or slow, but steady decline into autism or other spectrums disorder."--The Hope Project (Ireland)

"There is no evidence whatsoever of the ability of vaccines to prevent any diseases. To the contrary, there is a great wealth of evidence that they cause serious side effects." -- Dr. Viera Scheibner

"My data proves that the studies used to support immunisation are so flawed that it is impossible to say if immunisation provides a net benefit to anyone or to society in general. This question can only be determined by proper studies which have never been performed. The flaw of previous studies is that there was no long term follow up and chronic toxicity was not looked at. The American Society of Microbiology has promoted my research...and thus acknowledges the need for proper studies." --John B.Classen, M.D., M.B.A.

"The medical authorities keep lying. Vaccination has been a disaster on the immune system. It actually causes a lot of illnesses. We are changing our genetic code through vaccination." --Guylaine Lanctot M.D. Canadian author of the best-seller 'Medical Mafia'.

Jonas Salk, inventor of the IPV, testified before a Senate subcommittee that nearly all polio outbreaks since 1961 were caused by the **** polio vaccine.

"Crib death" was so infrequent in the pre-vaccination era that it was not even mentioned in the statistics, but it started to climb in the 1950s with the spread of mass vaccination against diseases of childhood. --Harris L.Coulter, PhD.

"These data show that DPT vaccination may be a generally unrecognised major cause of sudden infant and early childhood death, and that the risks of immunisation may outweigh its potential benefits. A need for re-evaluation and possible modification of current vaccination procedures is indicated by this study." --William C. Torch, M.D., Director of Child Neurology, Department of Paediatrics, University of Nevada School of Medicine

"You cannot be in the presence of a profoundly vaccine damaged child and not know that child could be your own. And you cannot try to comfort a mother who has just buried a baby who has died from a vaccine or a disease and not know that you could be the one standing over the grave. When it happens to your child, the risks are 100 percent." -Anonymous

"Vaccination is not necessary, not useful, does not protect. There are twice as many casualties from vaccination as from AIDS." --Dr. Gerhard Buchwald, West Germany, specialist of internal diseases and participant in about 150 trials of vaccination victims.

Dr. Michael Odent has written a letter in the JAMA (1994) where his figures show a five times higher rate of asthma in pertussis immunised children compared to non-immunised children. He is also quoted in the International Vaccination Newsletter (Sept. 1994): "Immunised children have more ear infections and spend more days in hospital."

"The public is surely entitled to convincing proof, beyond all reasonable doubt, that artificial immunisation is in fact a safe and effective procedure, in no way injurious to health, and that the threat of the corresponding natural diseases remain sufficiently clear and urgent to warrant mass inoculation of everyone, even against their will if necessary. Unfortunately, such proof has never been given." --Richard Moskowitz, M.D., Journal of the American Institute of Homeopathy, March 1983 (76:7)

"Vaccination is expensive and represents a cost of one billion dollars annually. It therefore benefits the industry; most notably, the multinational manufacturers. One sells the vaccines. The other then provides the arsenal of medications to respond to the numerous complications that follow. Their profits increase while our expenses go through the roof. To the point where we have simply had it up to here and are ready to accept the unacceptable, such as socialised medicine in the United States, for example." --Dr Lanctot MD

"Two or three years ago there was a rash of positive HIV and hepatitis patients in Baltimore among people who would otherwise not be expected to have a positive test. When studied all of these people had received the influenza vaccine four to six weeks prior and this was rapidly covered up by the press." -- Dr. Eva Snead, Feb 2000

Nine die in flu tragedy as epidemic hits nursing home (Daily Express 1/1/1999) Nine pensioners died within days of each other after a suspected flu epidemic swept the nursing home where they lived. An investigation has been launched after it emerged all the victims suffered severe chest infections despite having the flu vaccinations.

If vaccines are so effective in preventing disease why have epidemics occurred around the world following mass vaccination programs? In the Philippines for example, "after ten years of compulsory inoculation against smallpox (25 million shots) over 170,000 got smallpox and 75,000 deaths were recorded between 1911 and 1920" (from the Townsend Letter for Doctors article "Are Vaccines Generally Detrimental to the Human Defence System," Feb/Mar 1994).

"Sudden Infant Death Syndrome has been reported following administration of DPT. The significance is unclear. 85% of SIDS cases occur in the period 1 through 6 months of age, with the peak incidence at age 2 to 4 months." --From the accompanying insert to Connaught Labs DPT shot.

"There has been a frightening increase in cases of autism that has not been explained. There are a number of anecdotal reports from parents that symptoms of autism have appeared close to the time of the (MMR) vaccine." Jane Orient, M.D., executive director of the Association of American Physicians and Surgeons and clinical lecturer in medicine at the University of Arizona College of Medicine, and a professor of clinical medicine at the Oregon Institute of Science and Medicine.

Even the WHO (World Health Organisation) has admitted, disease and mortality rates in Third World countries have no direct correlation with immunisation procedures or medical treatment, but they are closely related to the standard of hygiene and diet. A 1973 issue of Scientific American revealed the same finding : that "over 90% of all contagious disease was eliminated by vastly improved water systems, sanitation, living conditions and transportation of food." Mass vaccinations did not appear on the scene until a century after the decline in infectious diseases started (1850-1940), but inoculations were, and still are given full credit. --Susan DeSimone

"Up to 90% of the total decline in the death rate of children between 1860-1965 because of whooping cough, scarlet fever, diphtheria, and measles occurred before the introduction of immunisations and antibiotics." ---Dr. Archie Kalokerinos, M.D.


Like I said go get the shot then. I hope it feels good. I will pick door # 2.
Why risk it.

Autism cases still on rise after vaccine change-MSNBC, Vaccine change? I'm sure. MSNBS-bought & paid for.

Everybody want's to get rich.
http://www.snopes.com/politics/medical/tamiflu.asp
 
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I agree everyone should research and make their own decision however I do not take my advice from snowesters but 90,000 MDs, Physicians and surgeons, nutritionists,phds and naturalpathic physicians who compose the world wide alternative naturalpathic and holistic medical community. Also you will note the emails were from pretty reputable organizations" but only after two letters were leaked to the Daily Mail. The letters were addressed to 600 senior British neurologists. One was from the UK’s Health Protection Agency and the other from the Association of British Neurologists." And no I don't necessarily consider the CDC and WHO the experts in the field of health. I looked at your sites and they did notdissagree with the G-B Syndrome only whether the numbers showed a problem or whether it could be definately caused by the vaccine, yet the government felt so and quit giving the injections, also there was no reference to the adjuvant squalene. I will include further info below.Swampy:rolleyes:

Wow. There is some really, really, bad information in this thread. First, the reference to the 1976 vaccine is not particularly relevant, as the consensus within the research community is that the the vaccine was never conclusively linked to G-B syndrome. More importantly, world-wide studies on the modern flu vaccine consistently estimate that the increase in G-B syndrome to be one or two people for every million vaccinated.
Want data? Here you go:
http://www.cdc.gov/FLU/about/qa/gbs.htm
http://www.bio-medicine.org/medicine-news/Rare-Neurological-Disorder-Linked-to-Flu-shot-15799-1/
http://www.reuters.com/article/newsOne/idUSTRE58F3A720090916

But don't believe me. Do your own homework. Draw your own conclusions.

Yeah, but why would you take medical advice from the CDC, or the World Health Organization, or some other reputable medical organization, when you have all these "knowledgable" Snowesters who clearly are so much more qualified? :rolleyes:




Now you are just making my point for me. Let me guess, you don't immunize your kids due to the "risk" of autism either?

Some more info. Swampy:eek:

Serious reasons to skip the H1N1 vaccine, Part II

This summer, Americans across the country lined up in droves to become the first human guinea pigs to receive the H1N1 flu vaccine. I don't believe for a second that the vaccine will effectively protect you or anyone else against H1N1. On the contrary, I'm more concerned about how much harm the vaccine may cause when millions more men, women, and children get it this fall.

As you'll remember from last week's Guide to Good Health, the last time the government hastily pushed through an untested vaccine, disaster ensued. Five hundred people came down with a paralyzing condition called Guillain-Barre Syndrome and 25 people died.

Government officials swear a repeat of 1976 will not happen. But they also admit they don't really know for sure.

In fact, according to Dr. Anthony Fauci, director of the U.S. National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, “No clinical trial in the world is going to be large enough to be able to detect an event that occurs one in every 100,000 people. The only way to pick that up is after the fact, when a lot of people get vaccinated and good surveillance picks it up."

In other words, we won't know if the stuff is really bad until we give it to a million people.

Well, thanks Dr. Fauci. Good to know you've thought this one through a month before injecting millions of toddlers, pregnant women, and immuno-compromised adults.

Plus, there's something else that's got me worried...
Secret Ingredients


I'll make no bones about it: the 2009 swine vaccine is bad news, especially if it contains an ingredient called an adjuvant. An adjuvant is added to a vaccine to make it stretch. It basically supercharges the vaccine to create a stronger immunological response. So instead of each person getting one full dose of the H1N1 virus, each person might only get ¼ of a dose along with an adjuvant supercharger.

This is the government's secret ace in the hole. If Uncle Sam thinks he's running low on the vaccine, he can just add an adjuvant and make the supplies stretch much further.

But an adjuvant can cause your immune system to go haywire. Case in point: the anthrax vaccine given to Gulf War soldiers. An adjuvant called squalene was added to that vaccine to make it stretch further. But many blame squalene for causing the so-called Gulf War Syndrome (GWS).

Now, don't get me wrong. Squalene isn't always toxic. In fact, it's a natural substance found in most plants and animals. Your body uses it to help synthesize cholesterol as well as vitamin D. You'll also find squalene in personal care products as well as nutritional supplements. In those instances, squalene is not a health hazard. However, when commercial squalene is injected into the bloodstream (as with a vaccine), it appears to disrupt the body's immune system. The body identifies it as a threat and creates antibodies to attack it.

In fact, when scientists from Tulane University tested blood samples from vets suffering from GWS, they found that 100 percent of them contained abnormal antibodies to squalene. This backs up the theory held by many in the medical community that squalene triggered GWS in these vets.

Now, here's the thing...symptoms of the Gulf War Syndrome were subtle to start: headaches, fatigue, and generalized aches and pains. And they didn't show up immediately. It took a while for the men and women to start feeling bad. (Side note: this is what worries me about the H1N1 vaccine as well. Reactions to medicines or vaccines can take years to appear, making it difficult to connect the dots. But we've only been working with the H1N1 vaccine for mere months, not years. How do we know how the H1N1 vaccine will act in the body years from now?)

As a result, it took a while for military docs to figure out that GWS was linked to a bad reaction to the anthrax vaccine. Instead, everyone in the government initially got away with labeling the vets' immunological problems as post-traumatic stress.

So what's Gulf War Syndrome got to do with the H1N1 vaccine? Well, squalene is exactly the same adjuvant at least two drug companies have been playing around with adding to the H1N1 vaccine. In fact, they've already been paid millions of dollars by Uncle Sam to develop stores of the vaccine containing the adjuvant.
Keeping their options open


The Department of Health and Human Services is holding its cards close regarding the use of adjuvants in the H1N1 vaccine. Officials won't say for certain whether or not they plan on using them. But I can tell you one thing, they're keeping their options open.

Here's how I know...

On June 15th, Department of Health and Human Services chief Kathleen Sibelius basically issued a carte blanche to Big Pharma when it comes to the H1N1 vaccine. She's invoked the PREP Act of 2006 (Public Readiness and Emergency Readiness Act). This law gives the five drug manufactures complete immunity against lawsuits for their vaccines, even if the vaccine contains an adjuvant.

According to the HHC website, immunity has been granted to the manufacturers “in all stages of 2009 H1N1 influenza vaccine development, testing, manufacture, distribution, prescribing, administration, and use.”

In other words, no matter how bad things get, even if the vaccine contains a known hazardous ingredient, the drugmakers can't get in trouble!
Money, money, money


All along, I've suspected this whole swine flu pandemic isn't about saving lives. To date, the swine flu has been linked to a little over 500 deaths in this country. Heck, the regular seasonal flu is six times more deadly than H1N1.

So what's all the fuss about? Money, of course!

The five drug companies handed H1N1 vaccine contracts are set to make a boatload off their largely untested products. In fact, the Department of Health and Human Services has already spent $2 billion dollars to purchase 195 million doses of the vaccine and adjuvant.

In addition Congress passed and President Obama recently signed a supplemental appropriation bill for $7.5 billion to cover the additional costs of preparing for H1N1. That figure doesn't even include the money spent on clinical trials or marketing of the vaccine.

All told, we could spend up to $10 billion dollars on a vaccine for something that may cause fewer deaths this year than accidental falls at home.
Protecting yourself sensibly this fall


Here's the bottom line about the H1N1 vaccine: You don't need it.

Instead, be smart. Wash your hands. Get lots of rest. Eat healthy. And take 2000 to 4000 IUs of vitamin D-3 during the winter months. That's the best way to fight off any virus, even the absurdly over-hyped money-sucking H1N1 virus!

Until next time,

Allan Spreen, M.D.
NorthStar Nutritionals
 
it would seem superjag ..buddy ole pal that my good friends Swampy and yamahamod have tried in vein to school you and thats they way it goes ...some will........some won't soo what next
 
You continue to make my point(s) for me. I never said that you won't find anybody who doesn't recommend the vaccine. I think we can all agree that they are out there. What I have said from the beginning (and for the last time) is that the vast majority of medical professionals are in agreement that agree that any risks associated with the vaccine are severely outweighed by the expected benefits.

Swampy, you reference "90,000 MDs, Physicians and surgeons, nutritionists,phds and naturalpathic physicians who compose the world wide alternative naturalpathic and holistic medical community". That number represents less than 10% of the practicing physicians IN THIS COUNTRY ALONE. (AMA states that there are approximately 950,000 practicing physiians in the US). Add in the physicians in the rest of the world, and now you are down to a fraction of your original percentage. Oh, and your other "source" is a website dedicated to proving vaccines unnecessary. I'm sure they are objective.

MSNBC bought and paid for? What the h*ll does that even mean? Can you provide me with some evidence of your claim, or is this just more vague conspiracy-theory nonsense.

I'll tell you what. Let's go about this a different way. Lets randomly pick a given number of doctors. They can be your doctor, my doctor, and some random doctors. I think we should focus primarily on pediatricians, but we can include a whole spectrum of areas of practice if you want. We'll call them (or their offices). I'll set up the conference calls from my office so one of you can be in on the conversation. You pick the person who represents your "side".

I'll put up my $100 to your $100 that we get a ratio of at least 10 to 1 in favor of the vaccine.

Who's in?
 
Man alive! I am not going to get into all the debate and banter going back and forth, but I will say me and my family WILL NOT be getting flu shots. That is our decision and has been for years.
 
It seems we have one of these here

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