I hope eating crow is enjoyable typo
Chain case life Gen 5
- Thread starter snow-doo
- Start date
Just saw this in case anyone is doing a swap
Ski Doo Drive Axle 2021-2022 MXZ Freeride Summit 850 600 E-Tec Turbo 504154023 | eBay
Fits 2021 Ski-Doo Summit 850 Turbo 165".
www.ebay.com
Hey, question for yall who have got the chain case recall done ....
I bought the TKI "Sleeve Fix" for this sled last year but never put it on because even last season we heard rumblings there was gonna be a recall....
SO my question is, if I get the chain case recall done on my '23 Shredder do I gain anything at all from installing the TKI drive shaft sleeve as well or do I own a $200 paper weight now?
I bought the TKI "Sleeve Fix" for this sled last year but never put it on because even last season we heard rumblings there was gonna be a recall....
SO my question is, if I get the chain case recall done on my '23 Shredder do I gain anything at all from installing the TKI drive shaft sleeve as well or do I own a $200 paper weight now?
Time will tell. Lets see if there are any issues after the correct chain and sprockets are on these sleds. I got a 2024 and Im waiting for a verdict.
Install it 100%
Any time there's mis alignment there is a loss. It may not break as easy but the tighter you can get that connection the longer it's going to last and the more efficient it'll transfer the power to the ground.
I'd still go the route I went. Tki drive with a gen4 shaft and avids. It was a good rotating mass loss before a solid gear
I'd still go the route I went. Tki drive with a gen4 shaft and avids. It was a good rotating mass loss before a solid gear
Well. People do mix quality issues with design issues.
I have seen broken chains, sprockets, drivers and shafts before Doo came out with 2-piece design.
On G5 I have seen broken chains & sprockets with TKI retainer. I have seen broken chain & sprockets with solid shaft. If the design was the issues why do we still see failures?
I have not seen a one broken HYVO chain or sprocket since 2020 they have been used on the original 850 Turbo.
I have not seen issues with G5 n.a. and it uses same 2-piece design.
N.A. still uses same chain & sprockets (Rexnord std. silent chain) from 2017.
BUT anything can break. BW HYVO parts are strong. There will be post of broken HYVO at some point here on or on some social media group and the sh*tshow will arise. Nothing a human has made is forever. But proper maintenance is the key. Change your chain case oil after first 500km. Check your chain tension on 70km, 250km and then 500km. Do not over tighten. If you don't know how check it from YouTube.
How come if they claim that "wobble" causes sprocket or chain failures?
When these problems did arrive, everybody was so fast to jump on conclusions that it must be the 2-piece drive shaft. Nobody did any research what's going on and could there be any other reasons for this.
the tki fix is just to eliminate any wobble. the chain and sprocket failures on the turbos have failed because doo put in n/a rated parts in a turbo sled or a combo of wobble and inferior parts.
Driver the biggest problem on the g5 turbo is they put a China chain suited for a 100 hp sled in a sled that makes closer to 190 , combined with a loose fitting 2 piece spline . Is the tki a must maybe not but it can’t hurt in any way .
maybe just the hyvo will last but I would put the tki if it was me .
maybe just the hyvo will last but I would put the tki if it was me .
because it's simple logic. there was no issue with the chaincase prior to the '23 sleds so what changed? inferior components and the two piece drive shaft.
C
caper11
Well-known member
I personally inspected my two piece drive shaft, before I installed a one piece. There is too much spline slop for the forces the shaft will see while relying on a oring to keep the splines tight.
Now if a technician or a mechanically inclined individual took the time and checked the alignment of the top and bottom sprockets with a string line, my bet there would be a misalignment.
I know lots of guys that ran turbos on older G4’s with the chain that came on the sled.
In my like of work, its very common to run into counterfeit brand name parts, especially brand name bearings.
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You are proving my point.
I know for a fact that for old Rexnord n.a. chain failure rate is higher here in Northern Europe than in North America. Why is that? Its simple. Here riding altitude is lower, max around 1000m on best powder season. Most people here ride 0-500m most season which means sea level. That means that we have more power in n.a., almost 165hp all season. Stress for the chain is higher.
I have this one friend who used to break 2-3 of these chains per season. Ride extremely aggressive, backflips etc. Some did install bottom "slipping" gear from snow cross sleds to reduce stress for the chain.
Lets say you are now running this same 850 n.a. on 8000ft (2,5km) and you have 55hp less according to ski-doo. Those rexnord components will do fine as there's a lot less stress than riding sea level. Low failure rate.
When ski-doo introduced 850 turbo in 2020, they had recognized that the old chain wasn't up to task with more torque and power. So we got BW Hyvo parts which was really strong combination. 165hp on 8000ft no problem, very low failure rate across the globe.
Okay so now back to 2023. Ski-doo introduces Turbo R. 180hp and more torque than ever until 8000ft. But there's a parts shortage and supply chain issues. During the summer they are forced to install old n.a. chain and sprockets to get the units moving on time. In North America there will be old rexnord parts and in Europe we get slightly better rexnord aurora parts as here failure rate has always been higher. Originally it was supposed to be BW hyvo parts on Turbo R.
So to add what changed for 2023?
- More power and torque than ever higher altitudes than ever
- Highly downgraded chain & sprockets compared to previous turbo
- Split drive shaft
And now to remember, most riders don't know anything what's running inside the hood. It was easy to jump on conclusion that its the new shaft. And I understand that. I believe that for this season failure rate will drop back to normal. There's always some. That's it how it works. Two years from now nobody even remembers these issues. Just like belt life issues back in 2017-2019, its been worked out.
I have seen pictures of the shafts that have not been seated properly, resulting boring in the tip of the split shaft to fail. This is an installation issue. Make sure that your shaft is always seated properly. If you look into the tunnel and you can see the rubber seal (black O-ring) the shaft isn't deep enough inside the chain case mount.
interesting post and you make a good case, you could be right but your post doesn't prove that the driveshaft isn't a problem. i spoke with tom at tki early last season and he had already seen over 50 failures and this was right when the first chatter about it was seen on the forums. i also spoke with a mechanic/doo aftermarket products manufacturer at the same time and he was surprised at the amount of slop in the coupling. that doesn't prove it's the driveshaft at fault of course but it's from two men whose opinion i respect. so i figured with as cheap and easy it is to install the TKI kit, why not plus i put in the BW hyvo components too. we towed a friend's sled off the mountain once and i'd prefer to not do that again as it took all day, almost screwed up another sled and a buddy came close to getting hurt in the process. we were way back in the boonies.
so it's back to my original point-two things were changed and until one can be conclusively eliminated, no one (at least us non-brp engineer types) can't say if it's definitively one or the other or both that's the problem.
This new track last year hooks like we have never had in the past either so a combination on things.
Yeah I get that. If it brings piece of mind go for it no problem.
But the reason I want to bring another perspective, there are lots of newbies reading these forums. And all they read is buy torsion spring delete, buy post forward kit, buy clutch kit, buy spindles, buy fix kit, buy belt drive... otherwise your sled is useless lol.
I have seen people lose the interest in riding because too much of cost and hassle. Its about enjoying the sport not who builds the most expensive sled. And do all of these modifications help you to be a better rider? Most cases they don't. Maybe some more advanced riders get some benefits. I always say that nothing beats seat time. Invest your money on gas and proper maintenance. Sled prices today are out of hand anyways.
I really like watch Muskoka because he rides his sled nearly stock. You can see that stock sleds are really capable these days.
i heart ya. if you look at alot of my posts, i say the same thing regarding the usefulness of many aftermarket products. things like belt drives, cans, big wheel kits, etc have a marginal if any performance increase and are pricey. the only thing i endorse as a very worthwhile mod is a clutch kit. the smoothness, lower engagement, and increase in performance is not subjective.
