BCA told us a few days ago they plan on having it to us by December 15th. Price will be $499.99. They said the Tracker 2 will also be released that date.
BCA Float 30 Avalanche Airbag Details
- Thread starter SnowBigDeal
- Start date
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enis750
Well-known member
correction - NO FLOAT #)'s in stock yet
hoping by X-Mas to have them and unsure of exact price - approx. 7-800 CDN
They also have the Snopulse's in for $1199
They expect them to be SOLD out by 1st week of Nov. (as they only have about 8 in right now)
I just saw this thread. I pre-ordered mine from Rick at Snobunje. I spent sometime with this pack and the BCA Rep at the Puyallup show. Plenty of room for all my stuff (you know us women, we have to take our stuff); felt good on the back, it deployed very nicely; he showed me how to fold up the pack which is pretty easy; he also showed me how to refill it and put a new o-ring in. He said we would be able to get this done at any scuba or paintball place. He never once mentioned to me about sending in the canister. I am not in the least interested in something I need to send in everytime I deploy it. I plan on deploying it at least once every few months to make sure everything is working properly and to keep me in practice with it. All of my survival equipment should be second nature to me; almost like driving my car. I should not have to think, just react.
I really do not think you can go wrong with the BCA Float 30 pack. It just cannot get to me soon enough.
EDIT:
I just went out and checked out your website and the About Us. You guys are awesome. I bought my beacons from you back in 2001. You guys gave excellent customer service and were priced better than anyone. You are truely committed to this sport and to offering quality safety equipment at the lowest possible price. I cannot remember the gentlemen I dealt with, but I remember his words "It is not about making money, we do that from our other business, it is about making sure that everyone is safe on the hill" His commitment to my safety sold me. I will definitely be checking out your online sales from now on before anyone else. Thank you for still being in business and for putting the customer first. You are truely one of those top-rated businesses.
I really do not think you can go wrong with the BCA Float 30 pack. It just cannot get to me soon enough.
EDIT:
I just went out and checked out your website and the About Us. You guys are awesome. I bought my beacons from you back in 2001. You guys gave excellent customer service and were priced better than anyone. You are truely committed to this sport and to offering quality safety equipment at the lowest possible price. I cannot remember the gentlemen I dealt with, but I remember his words "It is not about making money, we do that from our other business, it is about making sure that everyone is safe on the hill" His commitment to my safety sold me. I will definitely be checking out your online sales from now on before anyone else. Thank you for still being in business and for putting the customer first. You are truely one of those top-rated businesses.
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BCA Float 30 refills
Thanks for the good words about BCA. For the first year of the Float 30, we prefer to have empty canisters returned to retailers for exchange for full ones. This is so we can keep tabs on the o-ring and the cylinder/head, making sure that the o-ring is not compromised and is replaced when refilling. Some retailers will be trained as refill stations early so this will be simple for the customer. You would have been chatting with Dwayne at Puyallup and he is quite happy to show how to replace the o-ring. We know that some customers will want to take care of refills themselves right from the start, but this will require attention to the o-ring and a refill adaptor.
Thanks for the good words about BCA. For the first year of the Float 30, we prefer to have empty canisters returned to retailers for exchange for full ones. This is so we can keep tabs on the o-ring and the cylinder/head, making sure that the o-ring is not compromised and is replaced when refilling. Some retailers will be trained as refill stations early so this will be simple for the customer. You would have been chatting with Dwayne at Puyallup and he is quite happy to show how to replace the o-ring. We know that some customers will want to take care of refills themselves right from the start, but this will require attention to the o-ring and a refill adaptor.
I
I have 2 packs on order form snowbigdeal but was wondering about all this concern about the o-rings is it a pinching or abrade problem that we have to watch out for. I've bought some o-rings before, would just saying replace the o-ring every time its filled help in the conxern of the o-ring. Any person could pick up a handful for 5 bucks remembering that o-ring DO have a shelf life.
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You mention making certain that the o-ring gets replaced and training retailers to be refill. Personally, I have a very difficult time putting my life in the hands of others. This is one thing I want to make certain is done right. I realize that if I am just deploying the pack to demostrate it, I do not have replace the o-ring everytime, but I can guarantee you that I will make beyond certain that there is a new o-ring on a new fill, before I take it on the hill and if it gets deployed it will always have a new o-ring before it goes on the hill. As the customer/rider/person who's life depends on this, I would prefer to refill this myself, make certain the o-ring is correctly in place, and make certain that it is packed correctly. I am extremely detail oriented. I packed my own chute when I jumped and I am more than capable of taking care of this. I also am not going to wait 2 weeks to ride if this is deployed. I want to be able to go back to my trailer, pull out the connection and a new o-ring, fill it up, put the o-ring in and put it back in the pack and head back to the hill the same day.
The reason I ordered the pack was because of the price and also because I could refill the canister and did not need to send it in. I realize the importance of the o-ring and getting it filled correctly. BCA needs to come to a clear decision on this ASAP and let retailers and reps know exactly what the deal will be on this so that they can clear up any misconceptions that have already occurred.
Please let me know the final answer.
The reason I ordered the pack was because of the price and also because I could refill the canister and did not need to send it in. I realize the importance of the o-ring and getting it filled correctly. BCA needs to come to a clear decision on this ASAP and let retailers and reps know exactly what the deal will be on this so that they can clear up any misconceptions that have already occurred.
Please let me know the final answer.
I got to put my hands on the pack @ Puyallup. I liked it. I understand it was just a prototype, so that's going to mean there will be some subtle changes to the production models. But, I liked how it felt on my back, and I am OK with how the bag deploys. I had some suggestions that were intended as constructive feedback, and they appeared to be taken as such. Most notably, have the deploy handle able to be set to either side. This would not be difficult to do when designing, since the shoulder straps are hollow for a drinking tube anyway. Some folks have a definite preference what side their handle is on. Personally, I could care less about a water bladder, but that's me.
Now, to the more important stuff:
I put the BCA and the Snowpulse product in the same category in this aspect: you can deploy and refill the unit.
Why this is important: I work in an emergency profession, and it influences my attitude. Anyone who does this, trains, trains and trains some more. In an emergency, you DO NOT rise to the occasion, you shrink to your level of training. (this is NOT HOLLYWOOD) Therefore, I'm not going to purchase a piece of safety equipment such as this, and just put it on and go play. If you think for a minute I'm not going to stand in my garage, on my sled, in all my gear (helmet, coat, all normal riding layers, gloves, goggles, and full pack) and pull that handle at least 15 times before I plan to trust my life to it, you're nuts. That's why firemen practice putting on their masks, why cops draw and shoot at targets, why soldiers field-strip and clean their weapons, and SCUBA divers practice regulator failures. I've never been in an avalanche, I don't ever want to be in one, and I don't ever want to have to rely on that backpack. But if I do, I want to know I can find that cord, and pull it with my eyes closed, standing on my head, and whistling dixie. I strongly suggest anyone who buys one of these does just that.
I want to thank BCA for putting the effort out to get a product to market that is at the $500 price point. THANKS!!!!!!
While I'm OK with trusting someone else to fill the little tank in there, I want to make sure the person making the connection is trained in what to look for as far as a proper seal.
If BCA wants to inspect the o-rings after every deployment as part of a on-going quality control and durability study, fine by me. I'll BUY 25 o-rings, and label each one after each deployment, and mail them back to BCA with the serial # of my pack. I'm actually 100% OK with that. I'm glad to help them bring the best product to market they can. And if it's recommended the o-rings are a one-time-use-only part, I'm OK with that too.
One of the reasons I like the BCA product, is because they focused on making the refill so easy, we as riders are less likely to 'wait' to pull to cord, "cuz it's gonna cost me $100 to recharge it"
Since the bottle is filled with dried, compressed atmospheric air, as long as it is filled to the proper pressure, and the seals are intact, it's fine. If you're going to fill it someplace else, I'd recommend a SCUBA shop for fills, as those folks are used to that process being a bit more critical than if your paintball gun won't shoot.
While all that ramble is just my opinion, I tried to share why I have that opinion, and persuade others to practice with their new piece of safety gear!
Have fun, and be safe! Come home laughing with the ones you love.
PE
Now, to the more important stuff:
I put the BCA and the Snowpulse product in the same category in this aspect: you can deploy and refill the unit.
Why this is important: I work in an emergency profession, and it influences my attitude. Anyone who does this, trains, trains and trains some more. In an emergency, you DO NOT rise to the occasion, you shrink to your level of training. (this is NOT HOLLYWOOD) Therefore, I'm not going to purchase a piece of safety equipment such as this, and just put it on and go play. If you think for a minute I'm not going to stand in my garage, on my sled, in all my gear (helmet, coat, all normal riding layers, gloves, goggles, and full pack) and pull that handle at least 15 times before I plan to trust my life to it, you're nuts. That's why firemen practice putting on their masks, why cops draw and shoot at targets, why soldiers field-strip and clean their weapons, and SCUBA divers practice regulator failures. I've never been in an avalanche, I don't ever want to be in one, and I don't ever want to have to rely on that backpack. But if I do, I want to know I can find that cord, and pull it with my eyes closed, standing on my head, and whistling dixie. I strongly suggest anyone who buys one of these does just that.
I want to thank BCA for putting the effort out to get a product to market that is at the $500 price point. THANKS!!!!!!
While I'm OK with trusting someone else to fill the little tank in there, I want to make sure the person making the connection is trained in what to look for as far as a proper seal.
If BCA wants to inspect the o-rings after every deployment as part of a on-going quality control and durability study, fine by me. I'll BUY 25 o-rings, and label each one after each deployment, and mail them back to BCA with the serial # of my pack. I'm actually 100% OK with that. I'm glad to help them bring the best product to market they can. And if it's recommended the o-rings are a one-time-use-only part, I'm OK with that too.
One of the reasons I like the BCA product, is because they focused on making the refill so easy, we as riders are less likely to 'wait' to pull to cord, "cuz it's gonna cost me $100 to recharge it"
Since the bottle is filled with dried, compressed atmospheric air, as long as it is filled to the proper pressure, and the seals are intact, it's fine. If you're going to fill it someplace else, I'd recommend a SCUBA shop for fills, as those folks are used to that process being a bit more critical than if your paintball gun won't shoot.
While all that ramble is just my opinion, I tried to share why I have that opinion, and persuade others to practice with their new piece of safety gear!
Have fun, and be safe! Come home laughing with the ones you love.
PE
O-rings
By the way, the fella @ the booth mentioned BCA went out of their way to make sure those o-rings are a standard size. They are very small, but standard, so one could get them for a low cost and pretty easily.
By the way, the fella @ the booth mentioned BCA went out of their way to make sure those o-rings are a standard size. They are very small, but standard, so one could get them for a low cost and pretty easily.
Float 30 Q & A
Answer to your questions above..... The o-ring is not a 'problem' or 'issue'...it is a wear item when the bottle is deployed. When you have compressed air going past an o-ring at 3000psi, you might have wear or damage to the o-ring. We want to have the o-ring replaced each refill so there are no issues with the tank retaining air pressure. BCA strongly recommends that refills be done with o-ring replacements each time....for the first year, to ensure this happens, we will have extra filled cylinders available at retailers to swap out with any empty cylinders or to sell to customers who want extra filled canisters.
Answer to your questions above..... The o-ring is not a 'problem' or 'issue'...it is a wear item when the bottle is deployed. When you have compressed air going past an o-ring at 3000psi, you might have wear or damage to the o-ring. We want to have the o-ring replaced each refill so there are no issues with the tank retaining air pressure. BCA strongly recommends that refills be done with o-ring replacements each time....for the first year, to ensure this happens, we will have extra filled cylinders available at retailers to swap out with any empty cylinders or to sell to customers who want extra filled canisters.
Since there is limited production, I can guarantee that we will have no retailers in Helena, Montana. We barely have one scuba shop. That is why this was so appealing to me. I ordered this directly from Snobunje, so I might as well mail the canister to BCA. I was considering ordering a second pack for my husband too, but now I am wondering if I should just wait until next year to get mine.
I do own XTC Racing, but my liability insurance is not going to cover me refilling canisters for others and I do not want that responsibility. I take responsibility for myself and my family, but taking responsibility for others in that way is not something I want for myself or my business.
As PolarExpress stated, if you want the o-rings sent in, I am more than happy to do that. But I agree 110% with him on the garage riding. He is so correct what happens in an emergency, we shrink to our level of training. I won't be whistling Dixie, more like screaming bloody murder, but I will basically be blind and on my head, feet, and back, something like a large cold dryer tossing my body around; and I need to know where that cord is and be comfy pulling it.
I also agree with PolarExpress's idea of being able to chose the side the rip cord is on. My training says the right side, but I may very well deploy this as I am trying to out run it and that would mean the left side as my right hand will be on the throttle. Thus I need to train myself to do this.
I hope BCA will reconsider thier position on this. I will replace the o-ring, each and everytime as I am sure everyone else will too. Safety first. Another option would be to send it out with 2 canisters for the $499. price.
Can I ask why we were told at Puyallup that we would NOT have to send it in and that we could easily get it refilled at a scuba or paintball shop?
I do own XTC Racing, but my liability insurance is not going to cover me refilling canisters for others and I do not want that responsibility. I take responsibility for myself and my family, but taking responsibility for others in that way is not something I want for myself or my business.
As PolarExpress stated, if you want the o-rings sent in, I am more than happy to do that. But I agree 110% with him on the garage riding. He is so correct what happens in an emergency, we shrink to our level of training. I won't be whistling Dixie, more like screaming bloody murder, but I will basically be blind and on my head, feet, and back, something like a large cold dryer tossing my body around; and I need to know where that cord is and be comfy pulling it.
I also agree with PolarExpress's idea of being able to chose the side the rip cord is on. My training says the right side, but I may very well deploy this as I am trying to out run it and that would mean the left side as my right hand will be on the throttle. Thus I need to train myself to do this.
I hope BCA will reconsider thier position on this. I will replace the o-ring, each and everytime as I am sure everyone else will too. Safety first. Another option would be to send it out with 2 canisters for the $499. price.
Can I ask why we were told at Puyallup that we would NOT have to send it in and that we could easily get it refilled at a scuba or paintball shop?
Our apologies for any misunderstanding, but we repeatedly tell interested customers at the shows that the intent is to have the canisters refilled at scuba & paintball shops, BUT for the first year, we will have exchange program in place and also a few trained retailers who can do refills. We would show people the o-ring when we would do replacements for refilling.
BCA,
If the exchange program is the only way you have it for the first year, how are any of us supposed to train on your product?
If the exchange program is the only way you have it for the first year, how are any of us supposed to train on your product?
As an ABS owner, I feel it's unnecessary to actually PULL the trigger to train with the handle. I feel extremely comfortable that when the day comes my time making sure I reach to the right place & yank like hell will be well spent. I've only actually pulled the trigger once, but I know I won't miss it.
For me, I would like to practice. I cannot even begin to tell you how much training went into learning how to jump out of an aircraft. I do not even remember how many times I pulled that rip cord, but when the time came, I had my training to back me up and it mattered.
Just like last year on Memorial weekend as I lost my sidehill in the slushy powder and went for quite the rodeo ride into the trees. I was thinking you should jump now, time to bail, GET THE ..... OFF THE SLED, but I hesitated only for that split second. It cost me. I cracked my clavical. Thank God for my Tek-vest, without it, Nesbo would have had to call life flight, provided they even found me in the trees. Next time, I won't hesitate, even though I did make it about 40 ft into the trees, over top of several, but that 14 incher was just too much.
I just know that as I am being tumbled about God's fury (laundry dryer), that I can get that handle, that I won't hesitate, that my training (instincts) will kick in and get me out alive.
I do have to admit, this thread has been great for facing some of the fears that I have chose not to face in the past. Putting that pack on was like admitting that I ride in dangerous territory and it is time to face the reality of my choices and be better (hopefully fully) prepared.
We do have 2 BCA retailers here, but I am not so sure I would trust them to fill it for me. I cannot even leave my sled at the dealership without an anxiety attack. She is my baby.
Just like last year on Memorial weekend as I lost my sidehill in the slushy powder and went for quite the rodeo ride into the trees. I was thinking you should jump now, time to bail, GET THE ..... OFF THE SLED, but I hesitated only for that split second. It cost me. I cracked my clavical. Thank God for my Tek-vest, without it, Nesbo would have had to call life flight, provided they even found me in the trees. Next time, I won't hesitate, even though I did make it about 40 ft into the trees, over top of several, but that 14 incher was just too much.
I just know that as I am being tumbled about God's fury (laundry dryer), that I can get that handle, that I won't hesitate, that my training (instincts) will kick in and get me out alive.
I do have to admit, this thread has been great for facing some of the fears that I have chose not to face in the past. Putting that pack on was like admitting that I ride in dangerous territory and it is time to face the reality of my choices and be better (hopefully fully) prepared.
We do have 2 BCA retailers here, but I am not so sure I would trust them to fill it for me. I cannot even leave my sled at the dealership without an anxiety attack. She is my baby.
Backcoutryislife:
I respect your decision not to practice with your life-safety equipment. It's a free country. You can make your own choice, but I'm going to challenge your decision, so that others that may not have your ability can read why I think it's so important to train and practice.
At the risk of re-directing this thread (not trying too), have you been a soldier, a cop, a fireman? Ever learn to SCUBA dive? If you did, when you were taking your class, did the instructor just tell you how to find your regulator if your mask and regulator are ever removed from your face (happens frequently, when your dive buddy's fin is too close to your head), or did they make you demonstrate that you can do it, first in the shallow end of a heated pool, then the deep end, then in shallow open water BEFORE taking you into deeper open water?
I'm a fireman. When I went through our academy, they put us in 'the smoke room', full of real smoke from real fire, with NO MASK OR AIR, and had us learn to filter breathe when we couldn't see our hand in front of our face. It sucked! But, we learned what it would be like and not to panic.
Cops practice life and death scenarios. They practice marksmanship, most departments I know of issue 2 boxes (100 rounds) each MONTH to their officers, and expect them to use them for practice. And they must demonstrate ongoing proficiency to retain their credentials.
I'll re-write it: when panic strikes, we shrink to the level to which we have consistently trained to. Does rising to the occasion happen in real life? Yes, in fact it does, but that is the exception, not the rule. And I would not want to bet my life on it, when practicing is simple, easy, and cheap.
I mean you no disrespect by challenging your approach in the open forum, please know that. I chose to do this, simply to help others understand my reasoning for why I think it's so important.
PE
I respect your decision not to practice with your life-safety equipment. It's a free country. You can make your own choice, but I'm going to challenge your decision, so that others that may not have your ability can read why I think it's so important to train and practice.
At the risk of re-directing this thread (not trying too), have you been a soldier, a cop, a fireman? Ever learn to SCUBA dive? If you did, when you were taking your class, did the instructor just tell you how to find your regulator if your mask and regulator are ever removed from your face (happens frequently, when your dive buddy's fin is too close to your head), or did they make you demonstrate that you can do it, first in the shallow end of a heated pool, then the deep end, then in shallow open water BEFORE taking you into deeper open water?
I'm a fireman. When I went through our academy, they put us in 'the smoke room', full of real smoke from real fire, with NO MASK OR AIR, and had us learn to filter breathe when we couldn't see our hand in front of our face. It sucked! But, we learned what it would be like and not to panic.
Cops practice life and death scenarios. They practice marksmanship, most departments I know of issue 2 boxes (100 rounds) each MONTH to their officers, and expect them to use them for practice. And they must demonstrate ongoing proficiency to retain their credentials.
I'll re-write it: when panic strikes, we shrink to the level to which we have consistently trained to. Does rising to the occasion happen in real life? Yes, in fact it does, but that is the exception, not the rule. And I would not want to bet my life on it, when practicing is simple, easy, and cheap.
I mean you no disrespect by challenging your approach in the open forum, please know that. I chose to do this, simply to help others understand my reasoning for why I think it's so important.
PE
Definetely can see the O-Ring concern if you are pushing 3000 PSI thru it. With that much pressure you will need a 90 Shore A hardness and roughly around 0.006" to 0.007" diametral max clearance. That is a realtively tight machining tolerance.
This brings me into my next point, please advise your customers not to go down to the local hardware (or auto parts) store and get their replacment O-Rings (most of these o-rings will be Buna-N with a 60 shore A hardness, which will blow out at 600 PSI with that diametral clearance). If you have those exact specs on the Shore hardness of the compound, likewise what kind of material (Buna-N, Viton, Silicone, etc) a sub par o-ring could bring very bad results.
Please sell packs of O-Rings is what I am trying to say.
Also, do you plan on selling extra canisters? I have ordered a BCA pack from SnowBigDeal back in early September (can't wait for them to come in). Being located in MN, and taking 3 to 4 trips out west per year (usually a week at a time), I would hate to have to wait for UPS to send my canister back for refilling, then back to me so I can ride again. That could ruin a trip. I would really like to have a spare canister (and of course extra o-rings) for the pack, so I can keep riding.
This brings me into my next point, please advise your customers not to go down to the local hardware (or auto parts) store and get their replacment O-Rings (most of these o-rings will be Buna-N with a 60 shore A hardness, which will blow out at 600 PSI with that diametral clearance). If you have those exact specs on the Shore hardness of the compound, likewise what kind of material (Buna-N, Viton, Silicone, etc) a sub par o-ring could bring very bad results.
Please sell packs of O-Rings is what I am trying to say.
Also, do you plan on selling extra canisters? I have ordered a BCA pack from SnowBigDeal back in early September (can't wait for them to come in). Being located in MN, and taking 3 to 4 trips out west per year (usually a week at a time), I would hate to have to wait for UPS to send my canister back for refilling, then back to me so I can ride again. That could ruin a trip. I would really like to have a spare canister (and of course extra o-rings) for the pack, so I can keep riding.
I strongly suggested to my wife today that this be the one and only present i want for Christmas.
I think she listened, and I know my dad's been a big advocate of me getting one of these since I became a father myself. Gotta be around to help raise my little girl and this is one thing that will help me get home safe.
Props to BCA for bringing a product to market at a realistic price point. I rock all their gear and have for years because it WORKS.
I think she listened, and I know my dad's been a big advocate of me getting one of these since I became a father myself. Gotta be around to help raise my little girl and this is one thing that will help me get home safe.
Props to BCA for bringing a product to market at a realistic price point. I rock all their gear and have for years because it WORKS.
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