can't say I didn't see this coming.....
http://www.theprovince.com/news/Call+backcountry+snowmobile/1560067/story.html
http://www.theprovince.com/news/Call+backcountry+snowmobile/1560067/story.html
awesome publicity....not
- Thread starter jonnyk
- Start date
Yeah, not good. It's amazing how some one running a commercial venture on crown land seems to think that he has a greater right to use the resource than the general public. This arrogance comes from his European background where everything is regulated within a nats eyebrow. He can go f!#k himself in my books.
In the same regards, people need to take more responsibility for themselves and their safetly in the backcountry. Heli operations shouldn't be having to do unpaid rescue operations to save people that shouldn't have been out there in the first place.
In the same regards, people need to take more responsibility for themselves and their safetly in the backcountry. Heli operations shouldn't be having to do unpaid rescue operations to save people that shouldn't have been out there in the first place.
I thought if you had to be rescued in the Back Country in BC, you or your family in the event of Death were given the Bill for the rescue?????
Sled 800, I do not know about the Arrogance thing at all. Obviously he is peeved about having to do the rescues or body recoveries and feels the need for way better regulations???? He runs a business that has been their for years, and I doubt most of his area or much at all is poached by Sledders.
As for people taking way more responsibility ,,,,,,, You are bang on. I sled on average 35 plus days a year, I have 20 years back Country skiing experience as well with a Level 3 Avalanche course. Now by no means am I an expert, but I sure am cautious and as aware as I possibly can be when i am out their. Point being is that this year was a very bad year for conditions, and I have seen more absolute idiots out this year than I can remember. I can name at least a dozen times where I have seen sledders in spots that were outright dangerous and they were high marking and making merry, when they were really lucky not to have been burried. ( I actually saw 2 sledders cause slides that they got out of, with one partial burry).
More and more people seem to be sledding each year, and yes their are a lot of responsible people out their who know their stuff. But it seems that their are way more that do not these days. So often this spring I have come to a Bowl area and seen people climbing the South facing slopes at 1PM with a bright sunny 14 degree plus day. I , with friends have watched from afar at guys getting stuck and 3-4 buddies high marking above the initial guy stuck and the 3 others that are up their helping him get out. The friends in my party say lets get out of here before we have to go and dig those kooks out and put ourselves in danger.
I do not know the answer and it seems that with more and more bad years like this one to follow, because of just sheer numbers of people out their, that articles like these will continue and give the sport an even worse black eye.
Do we need to be licensed and have an avalanche course ( Level1) certificate before we can register a sled (In Alberta as I do not think you have to register a sled in BC?), thus at least controlling or trying to the number of non educated people out their????
Again I do not know the answer and the scary thing is that each year I tell a few people that they should watch it in certain areas when I am out their and they just give us dirty looks usually and go off high marking.
Sled 800, I do not know about the Arrogance thing at all. Obviously he is peeved about having to do the rescues or body recoveries and feels the need for way better regulations???? He runs a business that has been their for years, and I doubt most of his area or much at all is poached by Sledders.
As for people taking way more responsibility ,,,,,,, You are bang on. I sled on average 35 plus days a year, I have 20 years back Country skiing experience as well with a Level 3 Avalanche course. Now by no means am I an expert, but I sure am cautious and as aware as I possibly can be when i am out their. Point being is that this year was a very bad year for conditions, and I have seen more absolute idiots out this year than I can remember. I can name at least a dozen times where I have seen sledders in spots that were outright dangerous and they were high marking and making merry, when they were really lucky not to have been burried. ( I actually saw 2 sledders cause slides that they got out of, with one partial burry).
More and more people seem to be sledding each year, and yes their are a lot of responsible people out their who know their stuff. But it seems that their are way more that do not these days. So often this spring I have come to a Bowl area and seen people climbing the South facing slopes at 1PM with a bright sunny 14 degree plus day. I , with friends have watched from afar at guys getting stuck and 3-4 buddies high marking above the initial guy stuck and the 3 others that are up their helping him get out. The friends in my party say lets get out of here before we have to go and dig those kooks out and put ourselves in danger.
I do not know the answer and it seems that with more and more bad years like this one to follow, because of just sheer numbers of people out their, that articles like these will continue and give the sport an even worse black eye.
Do we need to be licensed and have an avalanche course ( Level1) certificate before we can register a sled (In Alberta as I do not think you have to register a sled in BC?), thus at least controlling or trying to the number of non educated people out their????
Again I do not know the answer and the scary thing is that each year I tell a few people that they should watch it in certain areas when I am out their and they just give us dirty looks usually and go off high marking.
No. Lots of sledders do not sled in areas where Level 1 AST would be checked so how do you enforce it? Sure the AB riders would have to produce it to register - but not in BC.
For many years, backcountry skiers have had some of the highest fatalities in the hills, sledders have topped the list this year and now we need to be regulated?
Here's an article from 2003 when several backcountry skiers died in the same area near Revy while backcountry skiing - keep in mind this was only within a 2 week window. This was a tragic event where 13 lives were lost (7 young students) and I'm only posting the link on principle, no disrespect to any of the fallen or their families. But why was there not a public call to regulate the backcountry to skiers at this point (regardless of age and experience)? Why is it that we need to be regulated?
http://www.cbc.ca/newsinreview/apr03/PDFs/avalanche.pdf
This is a Weigle agenda though IMO, without opposing user groups these companies will be allowed to expand exponentially, we are fighting this same fight in other areas. Heli and cat ski operation expansions go silently unnoticed for the most part. Unless they are opposed by other user groups, most often the gov't approves them as they import vastly needed tourism dollars. In Weigle's defense, he has been fighting the same battle for years. He has tenure in an area and sledders continue to ride his terrain, he does have a right to be pissed. If sledders would simply ride somewhere else, he probably wouldn't have as big an issue with sledders.
This falls under the education umbrella, more sledders need to educated on these issues and they also need to lose the attitudes and we will be viewed a lot closer to how we would like to be percieved.
Just my thoughts.
NSC
Read the article from the original post. Got pissed off and wrote this comment to the editor:
"The comment in the article of "epidemic" is poor...this is not a flu.
The reality of the situation this season is the condutions are due to a very unstable snow pack caused by unfavorable weather conditions at the start of the winter. Standard avalanche training, digging a pit, reading the snow, etc will not prevent avalanches and would not be indicative of the problems lurking at the base. Back country users need to be aware of the current weather conditions and what has developed during the whole season. This is part of the "education" and "experience" which may help to make better decisions regarding back country travel.
No amount of regulatory intervention is going to prevent avalanches. Safety, at work or at play, is still ultimately up to the individual. You can give an individual the training, equipment and procedures to follow. They decide whether to wear the gear properly, follow the procedure or apply the training. You can not give them or dictate commen sense.
I myself have spent 10 years skiing and 15 years sledding in the back country. The latter allows me to still (too many skiing injuries!) enjoy the endless beauty of mother nature in the winter, access areas that few will ever see and share a comradery with some of the greatest people you will ever meet.
We withnessed six avalvanches this winter, four caused by "back country users" (2 by skiers, 2 by sledders) and two naturally triggerd through radiant heating. This is unusual to see this many and reminded us of the 2004 season...it had similar snow pack issues. Every weekend we went we saw evidence of slide activity. We were fully aware of the risk and chose to stay well back from any potentialy bad spots...I can not speak for the people involved in the ones we saw.
Life is about decisions. Death is about poor decisions, either by you or someone else. As for the rest of the comments in the article it looks more like the typical "we are better than them" syndrome...we are all back county users...some for profit and some for pleasure."
Hell of a year for all of us.
"The comment in the article of "epidemic" is poor...this is not a flu.
The reality of the situation this season is the condutions are due to a very unstable snow pack caused by unfavorable weather conditions at the start of the winter. Standard avalanche training, digging a pit, reading the snow, etc will not prevent avalanches and would not be indicative of the problems lurking at the base. Back country users need to be aware of the current weather conditions and what has developed during the whole season. This is part of the "education" and "experience" which may help to make better decisions regarding back country travel.
No amount of regulatory intervention is going to prevent avalanches. Safety, at work or at play, is still ultimately up to the individual. You can give an individual the training, equipment and procedures to follow. They decide whether to wear the gear properly, follow the procedure or apply the training. You can not give them or dictate commen sense.
I myself have spent 10 years skiing and 15 years sledding in the back country. The latter allows me to still (too many skiing injuries!) enjoy the endless beauty of mother nature in the winter, access areas that few will ever see and share a comradery with some of the greatest people you will ever meet.
We withnessed six avalvanches this winter, four caused by "back country users" (2 by skiers, 2 by sledders) and two naturally triggerd through radiant heating. This is unusual to see this many and reminded us of the 2004 season...it had similar snow pack issues. Every weekend we went we saw evidence of slide activity. We were fully aware of the risk and chose to stay well back from any potentialy bad spots...I can not speak for the people involved in the ones we saw.
Life is about decisions. Death is about poor decisions, either by you or someone else. As for the rest of the comments in the article it looks more like the typical "we are better than them" syndrome...we are all back county users...some for profit and some for pleasure."
Hell of a year for all of us.
Last edited:
H
Hrt Offroad
Active member
10-4...this is Wiegele looking to have the back country to himself!! He is a money hungry foreigner reaping the benefits of our crown land!!
Did anyone hear that he lost a skier to suffocation in a tree well this season? This happened on one of his "guided" heli ski adventures! It didn't make local, national or international news??? Why is this???
When Albert Beck passed in an avalanche in Blue River this season...I believe S&R from McBride came do the extraction...because Wiegele refused to help!!
He has in the past flown injured sledders to safety, but won't fly a sled off the mountain even if he is paid well to do so.
I know that pretty much any sledder would help a skier in distress in any way possble!!
Wiegele is a Jack A$$
Did anyone hear that he lost a skier to suffocation in a tree well this season? This happened on one of his "guided" heli ski adventures! It didn't make local, national or international news??? Why is this???
When Albert Beck passed in an avalanche in Blue River this season...I believe S&R from McBride came do the extraction...because Wiegele refused to help!!
He has in the past flown injured sledders to safety, but won't fly a sled off the mountain even if he is paid well to do so.
I know that pretty much any sledder would help a skier in distress in any way possble!!
Wiegele is a Jack A$$
Do we need to be licensed and have an avalanche course ( Level1) certificate before we can register a sled
I see lots of avalanche victims have had training and gear.
In 43 years of sledding I have never seen an avalanche.
This year we stayed away from steep areas that we have never seen avalanche.
I think common sense can be taught, if the more experienced, aggressive, of the group were the first to leave an avalanche prone area probably everyone would follow their lead.
I think if avalanche training and gear were required then first aid training should be, also rescue gear, ropes, saws, shovels, tools and all the gear required to survive when stranded.
I have no avalanche training but I have first aid training and I carry enough gear to overnight comfortably and have camped out enough times to know how to make a camp.
We have to change our attitudes if we want to reduce avalanche accidents.
10-4...this is Wiegele looking to have the back country to himself!! He is a money hungry foreigner reaping the benefits of our crown land!!
Wiegele is a Jack A$$
I agree!
Mike Wiegele gets paid by various divisions of BC for call outs (ie bc ambulance, sars, pep or bc coroner). Mcbride helped rescue the sled for Albert Beck. The sledder's that were with him brought him to a safe location for the helicopter to transport him to the hwy for the ambulance. Mike has his own personal agenda for this ban as he would like the Blue River area to him self only. He can go to he#@$E4.
Similar threads
