They have also stated many times that there is one main person that does the posting on the forums. Now do I get one?I accept your apology
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They have also stated many times that there is one main person that does the posting on the forums. Now do I get one?I accept your apology
WMC has stated many times that they are 3 people.
I think you need to take a closer look at rights.. You can't make rights illegal can you? Your statement implies that you can..
As long as snowmobiling is legal on FS lands, then yes, I have the right to do it within the law. If they pass a law outlawing it, then it will no longer be my right.
Congress and the FS have already stated that open use on public lands is not a real concept. You can not do whatever you want to on FS lands. Why don't you understand this concept? This thought that you can do whatever you want on the FS lands is a misnomer and seems to be used as justification for a lot of snowmobilers attitudes on this issue. IT IS WRONG!! If you don't like it, tough man, but that is the way the land is currently managed.
Come on Ruffy...at least keep your conversation somewhat intelligent...when did I ever say I could do whatever I wanted on FS lands??? We're talking about snowmobiling, in case you forgot...and the last time I checked, it is legal to snowmobile on FS land. Why dont YOU understand THIS concept???
They have also stated many times that there is one main person that does the posting on the forums. Now do I get one?![]()
I was going for small steps... If WMC didn't come on here, people would not be getting proactive about the Wilderness intrusion issue. Cause and effect. It would have been better (From the WMC standpoint) to just come out guns a blazing and caught us with our pants down. Would you not agree with that?Dont assume that you know what I get and dont get...or ask quesitons like I'm a little kid...or try to get under my skin. I wont get emotional about this with you, WMC, or any others.
You are right, it might not, but is the other option just doing nothing? Who has stated that it will end everything anyways? The FS has stated many times that Wilderness incursions WILL lead to snowmobilers loosing riding areas. They have said this for a while now, yet they keep on happening...IF (yes, I said if again) the wilderness enforcement happens, then great...but get off your high horse for a second and realize that posting signs will not stop those who willfully encroach, it will just keep the honest people honest.
Agreed, but if we don't do it, who is going to? People keep stating that we need more enforcement, yet there is none to be found. Who then is responsible? Aren't WE responsible? Shouldn't it be? If we say, "It isn't my problem" will that matter when our riding areas are taken away?We need enforcement and consequences. Only then will we be able to say we are doing something meaningful.
I understand that the FS has the ability to make this not legal, the ability to do this very easily. They have the ability to limit the use of motorized vehicles from specific areas. To say that you have a right to use FS land in a manor that you see fit is an erroneous statement. You are ALLOWED to snowmobile on FS land. There is no guarantee that will always be so. A lot of people seem to think that is the case. I would think one look at the SAWS website would show otherwise.Come on Ruffy...at least keep your conversation somewhat intelligent...when did I ever say I could do whatever I wanted on FS lands??? We're talking about snowmobiling, in case you forgot...and the last time I checked, it is legal to snowmobile on FS land. Why dont YOU understand THIS concept???
I understand that the FS has the ability to make this not legal, the ability to do this very easily. They have the ability to limit the use of motorized vehicles from specific areas. To say that you have a right to use FS land in a manor that you see fit is an erroneous statement. You are ALLOWED to snowmobile on FS land. There is no guarantee that will always be so. A lot of people seem to think that is the case. I would think one look at the SAWS website would show otherwise.
We need enforcement and consequences. Only then will we be able to say we are doing something meaningful.
Agreed, but if we don't do it, who is going to? People keep stating that we need more enforcement, yet there is none to be found. Who then is responsible? Aren't WE responsible? Shouldn't it be? If we say, "It isn't my problem" will that matter when our riding areas are taken away?
Not to in any way shape or form do I would I ever defend the dirtbags that ride in the wilderness but is it really our responsibility to police the wilderness incursions? I mean is it okay for me to police my neighbors when I call the cops on the jokers for drag racing in my hood and the only thing the King County sheriff tells me is they must catch them in the act? So it just continues to happen and happen....Same exact thing here in legalities, with exception for the ramifications to my sport
I'm simply asking does the USFS bear any of the responsibility in policing these incursions? I'm not calling out the USFS just simply asking?
How can we get these areas policed better? How does making more land wilderness due to incursions help stop incursions? This reminds me of bad parenting 101.
Having more land go wilderness when the USFS is unable to police what they already have?? How could the FS recommend something like that? How could they be expected to police more land with the same amount of officers and expect better results?
That last part is the key.So it just continues to happen and happen....Same exact thing here in legalities, with exception for the ramifications to my sport
I would imagine the cost is pretty high to have some patrolers on snowmobiles in one location for the "chance" that they could bust someone for trespass.I'm simply asking does the USFS bear any of the responsibility in policing these incursions? I'm not calling out the USFS just simply asking?
The WMC idea was to limit the motorized areas to such a large degree (end of one of the roads) that it would make enforcement much much simplier and easier. (Smaller area to patrol, easily defined boundaries. Method to the madness as it were..IHow can we get these areas policed better? How does making more land wilderness due to incursions help stop incursions? This reminds me of bad parenting 101.
Having more land go wilderness when the USFS is unable to police what they already have?? How could the FS recommend something like that? How could they be expected to police more land with the same amount of officers and expect better results?
Who are you asking?This is exactly my point...give us a real solution to the problem so that we can assist in the enforcement.
So it is your right until it isn't. What was the point of this line of statements again? I thought you were trying to prove something with this..Again, stop puting words in my mouth..I never said I could use FS land as I see fit. Yes, they have the ability to limit use. All I said is that at the current time, snowmobiling is legal on FS land, and as long as I dont break the law, it is my CURRENT right to do so.
If the FS decides that certain areas need to be non-motorized, then so be it...in the meantime, I will continue to fight for open use of public lands.
So it is your right until it isn't. What was the point of this line of statements again? I thought you were trying to prove something with this..
He stated he was climbing Mt. Adams this week... Tin foil hat time?
it must be the hidden agenda..Hmmmm...WMC is now online again @ 9:30pm...whadda ya know??!!
Why bother.. You got your tinfoil hat on so tight, it doesn't matter anymore..LOL...why did you change the post??
And which was it??? You said they were out of touch...now not???
Why bother.. You got your tinfoil hat on so tight, it doesn't matter anymore..