2016 arctic cat launch @ Saturday, March 1, 2015

[arctic2009]

And I also get a kick out of everyone who thinks riders like rasmussen just get paid millions of dollars by the company they ride for. Get real. These guys have real jobs and real incomes, they dont make bank just cuz they ride cat poo or doo.

Cats gonna need to step it up in 2016. Period.

Of course they don't make millions from the company, but when an OEM gives them a bunch of sleds, parts account, and a cut from the marketing, you bet they are making money while running their guide business. Get real, those guys switched because the perks from the OEM were better than what they were receiving. Has nothing to do with how the sled handled. Burandt would endorse a snow hawk if they gave him enough incentives. These guys strive off their winter business and I don't blame them for taking the best deal, it is after all their lively hood in the winter.

 

[goridedoo]

Im pretty sure they dont just get free sleds, parts, and a cut from the marketing. Im sure there's some benefits, but I dont think its crazy amounts like everyone thinks, I think these guys work with whatever company will put them in the spotlight and let them be "part of the team" rather than just another sponsored rider. I just dont see that the amounts of $$$ given would be that huge and vary that much from manufacturer to manufacturer. I think burandt and rasmussen left cat not because of money, but because polaris and ski doo allow them to help with r&d and when its time to market them they use them as their main marketing tool.

 

[RACINSTATION]

Free sleds.
A check from the manufacturer.
A big spotlight.
Input on marketing.
Signature gear and accessories.

They get all these things. The amount of money varies from mfg to mfg, but if you get 3 free sleds, you are looking at almost $40,000 to the average guy. It's no NFL contract, but it is pretty good.

 

[goridedoo]

I honestly dont know, so I wont argue it, but do you know that they actually get free sleds or is that an assumption? And by free sleds I mean given, here its YOURS, you can mod it, ride for a year, sell it and keep the money for yourself, it is YOURS. I know they get prototypes and sleds to test but that is totally different.

 

[arctic2009]

Free sleds.
A check from the manufacturer.
A big spotlight.
Input on marketing.
Signature gear and accessories.

They get all these things. The amount of money varies from mfg to mfg, but if you get 3 free sleds, you are looking at almost $40,000 to the average guy. It's no NFL contract, but it is pretty good.

Yep 3 free sleds is 3 sleds they didnt have to pay for to operate their business. Theres $40,000 that doesnt have to come out of their profit from guiding that year.

 

[M8onEdge]

Ok you guys are going to hate me, but I'm actually being serious here....


If Polaris comes out with a new RMK, AND another model closer to a snowbike, AND both are good....

...will Cat's sled division (at least the mountain portion) continue to exist? Or will they close the doors? That will take very substantial monetary investment in to the mountain segment for them to keep up, and they seem apprehensive to do so the past few years. And they don't have pockets as deep as Doo, Pol, or Yamaha. What do you think?

Man, I wouldn't pull the plug on Cat yet! It would seem a scenario exists for Cat to stay in the game. I don't think they are seeking to be the dominant company, more like aiming to compete with the Doo boys and offer a reliable alternative to Poo with respectable market share. It would seem things could go like this over the next two years ...introduce a new, reliable Ctec 800 that weighs 10 pounds less than the zuke, install belt drive to lose another 10 lbs, skinny up the chassis for another 10 or so and redesign the suitcase to easily lose 8 or 10 by virtue of the new motor. So, now we're down 40 lbs which would take the current sled to about 430 v.s. 410 for the new Poo. What's 20 pounds?...maybe a lightweight hood as an option and we're talking a couple gallons of gas difference. Plus, they have that whole population of bitter Poo guys with bruised knuckles from changing out pistons that they can sell sleds to. I don't think they want to play the weight game but the current "fat cat" mentality keeps a lot of people from looking at cat in spite of the fact they already have a 160+ hp, more reliable motor on a chassis that works very well in '14 and '15.

 

[FocusJR]

Why are so many people thinking that Arctic Cat is on its way out or that they've given up on the mountain category?!!

Could it be that Arctic is maybe putting a lot of their engineering effort into the next new platform instead of dividing their efforts to make minor repairs to the old chassis? I would rather they focus on the next chassis/engine and get everything right then to focus on the past just to get a few updates that are easily done with aftermarket (i.e. steering post forward).

M sled - 2005-2011 = 7 yrs
Proclimb - 2012-2016 = 6 years

Pro Ride RMK - 2011-2015 = 5 years

XP Summit - 2008-2012 = 5 years

I guess from past model changes I would be surprised to see a new mtn chassis from Arctic this year. With Polaris stealing some of the lime light it probably further reduces the chances. My guess is that some of the guys that jump ship in '16 will be looking at the grass on the other side of the fence in '17.

 

[FocusJR]

Cut 'em some slack

Also - I can tell very few people realize how much work goes into developing a new product. Constructive criticism is great for these manufacturers, but I feel like everyone expects them to pull a miracle every year.

The people at these companies are working hard to make these sleds and have a ton of variables (price, schedule, govnt mandates) to deal with.

Have you ever been kept from accomplishing something you wanted to at work due to a bean counter or boss? How about by the government?

 

[High Country]

I honestly dont know, so I wont argue it, but do you know that they actually get free sleds or is that an assumption? And by free sleds I mean given, here its YOURS, you can mod it, ride for a year, sell it and keep the money for yourself, it is YOURS. I know they get prototypes and sleds to test but that is totally different.

yes and yes and no ...lol...

Different riders, different terms, different contracts....
for example.... from the manufactures from sponsorship to co-sponsorship...depends on how big they are....some get discounted sleds, some get only parts/belts or reduced prices on parts/belts, some get full factory rides...free sleds, some get a sled and a practice sled, most get incentives on placement or winnings.... and pending on the contract its theirs to do what they want at the end of term, to sell to offset their income, pay their mechanic etc, and /or keep as a practice sled. Most if not all have other jobs
I know some that guide they get their sleds at a very reduced rate. those sleds get auctioned at the end of the term or year.
I can't speak for guys like Burandt,Lavallee,Adams ...they have propelled Poo huge, their dealings will be huge.
Not to mention their sidelines....Fox,Monster etc etc
I know of a mechanic that wrenches for a factory race team....his cut is $50,000.00-$60,000.00 U.S.D. annually with incentive on winning

 

[Jaynelson]

Man, I wouldn't pull the plug on Cat yet! It would seem a scenario exists for Cat to stay in the game. I don't think they are seeking to be the dominant company, more like aiming to compete with the Doo boys and offer a reliable alternative to Poo with respectable market share. It would seem things could go like this over the next two years ...introduce a new, reliable Ctec 800 that weighs 10 pounds less than the zuke, install belt drive to lose another 10 lbs, skinny up the chassis for another 10 or so and redesign the suitcase to easily lose 8 or 10 by virtue of the new motor. So, now we're down 40 lbs which would take the current sled to about 430 v.s. 410 for the new Poo. What's 20 pounds?...maybe a lightweight hood as an option and we're talking a couple gallons of gas difference. Plus, they have that whole population of bitter Poo guys with bruised knuckles from changing out pistons that they can sell sleds to. I don't think they want to play the weight game but the current "fat cat" mentality keeps a lot of people from looking at cat in spite of the fact they already have a 160+ hp, more reliable motor on a chassis that works very well in '14 and '15.

Everyone always plays the reliability card....and Polaris definitely deserves some heat for it.....but in our group of mixed Cats and Pols (with 1 or 2 Doos), the Cats have had many more break downs and tow outs since 2011. The motor is good, but the steering posts, clutches and drive system fail quite frequently. M's, 2012 and 2013 cats. No one has a 14 or 15 cause they all switched to Pol. Doo seems to have a leg-up on both in the overall reliability the last few years.

Any of that aside....the Proclimb was just never a slam-dunk for Cat. I think it actually rides way better than it gets internet cred for. I would pick it over a Doo, and would happily ride one as a Pol alternative. I just don't think it's going to do anything notable sales-wise....until they revise it. Which would be great, cause more competition = better stuff for everyone.

 

[catothom]

Even if Cat drops the bomb on something new and exciting, I would wait until the second year, so they can eliminate the child deceases and often the colors are way cooler!

And in 2017 my sled is all payed down

 

[nytro41]

Why are so many people thinking that Arctic Cat is on its way out or that they've given up on the mountain category?!!

Could it be that Arctic is maybe putting a lot of their engineering effort into the next new platform instead of dividing their efforts to make minor repairs to the old chassis? I would rather they focus on the next chassis/engine and get everything right then to focus on the past just to get a few updates that are easily done with aftermarket (i.e. steering post forward).

M sled - 2005-2011 = 7 yrs
Proclimb - 2012-2016 = 6 years

Pro Ride RMK - 2011-2015 = 5 years

XP Summit - 2008-2012 = 5 years

I guess from past model changes I would be surprised to see a new mtn chassis from Arctic this year. With Polaris stealing some of the lime light it probably further reduces the chances. My guess is that some of the guys that jump ship in '16 will be looking at the grass on the other side of the fence in '17.

somebody get this man a beer. he understands. i feel the same way.

 

[av8er]

This is what CAT needs to do

1.Shave a good 30 lbs off their sleds
2. come out with a new 850cc, and 950cc DI motor about 185HP, and 215HP.
3. come out with a 3"PC on either a 162" or 174" option from the factory- like DOO
4. add a 4 year warranty and better coil over shocks like the Raptors.
then they would OWN the MTN. Segment market for the next 3 years.

 

[M8onEdge]

Everyone always plays the reliability card....and Polaris definitely deserves some heat for it.....but in our group of mixed Cats and Pols (with 1 or 2 Doos), the Cats have had many more break downs and tow outs since 2011. The motor is good, but the steering posts, clutches and drive system fail quite frequently. M's, 2012 and 2013 cats. No one has a 14 or 15 cause they all switched to Pol. Doo seems to have a leg-up on both in the overall reliability the last few years.

Yeah, I actually agree with you but I just had to throw that in there because that's all a Cat guy really has to throw out there! I've actually ridden with like a dozen Pros since 2011 and have only seen a couple injector failures ('11s), one locked up secondary clutch and.....yep, that's about it! I see failures on the forums but haven't dragged any out of the hills but my '14 PC broke the jackshaft and cost me the best day this year. I thought the same about Doo, bought a '13 XM and spent most of the winter in limp mode...so, yeah, bad Karma I guess.

Now that we see what Polaris has on the snow for '16 with the Axys, I still don't think Cat is out of the game for '17 but in my opinion weight matters on the snow and in marketing the thing and I'm not sure Cat feels the same way. I can live with 30 lbs...not sure I can live with 50 or 60.

 

[Reg2view]

ACAT is here to stay, they aren't going anywhere unless yammy gets drunk and buys them. With that said you have to keep remembering - their #1, first priority, biggest focus is always, always, always - their stock price. It's never about being #1 is sales or market share. Been this way for a long time, and ain't changing tomorrow. If it don't make money, it's gonna get dropped or changed. I think they still make money on their mtn sleds right now, and decide what to offer precisely for that reason.

 

[RCR3]

Lets take this thread back to 2000-2002 Cat had nothing their 800 was a pig! Then came the 2003 ER 900 MC 151. Boom cats dominance started there! I walked through a little Cat dealership in 02-03 in PRESTON, IDAHO and discovered a MOD sled. Looked like a fire cat but a wider chassis. And then came the M in 05.

Cat always has something in the bag hopefully they let it out sooner than later!

 

[Jaynelson]

^ Cat is historically the most likely to come out with the larger more powerful engine. That might make more sense/be more likely for them at this point, rather than trying to compete with pol on the lightweight/throw around type sled. Come out with a sled with a bunch of HP and appeal to a slightly different crowd. But more like how the King Cat was just a better Mountain Cat....and less like how the 1100T was a different animal altogether.

 

[mmsports]

New cat.

I am amazed at the snowmobile market.I have been amazed at it for sometime. Cat makes an amazing sled but so does polaris and skidoo.

Polaris are great at marketing. It don't matter that you cannot find a used sled without a fresh top end and only 1200 miles on it. Skidoo the same way. Have you ever heard of a reliability kit for a cat ?

Look at the riders they have. Cat has 3 factory rider's. Believe it or not people buy Becouse of the riders.

In my opinion cat need to step out of the box again like they did with the dimond drive. It would also help to maybe add some more factory riders.

I am optimistic about the new 2016 year. In my opinion the must haves.

Belt drive
loose 75 lb
3 in power claw
36 in stance


Then you would be close to the prolites the funnest sled I have ever had. I hope next year we can get them below 400 lb.

 

[summ8rmk]

I have talked to the engineering team at arctic cat.
I asked why they haven't tried a belt drive.
They have! They had durability issues. They couldn't get the belt to last. This was back in 2013.
I have not asked about the belt drive again but i think i will

 

[rmscustom]

I am amazed at the snowmobile market.I have been amazed at it for sometime. Cat makes an amazing sled but so does polaris and skidoo.

Polaris are great at marketing. It don't matter that you cannot find a used sled without a fresh top end and only 1200 miles on it. Skidoo the same way. Have you ever heard of a reliability kit for a cat ?

QUOTE]

Motor wise Cat doesn't need a reliability kit. Its everywhere else I've seen guys lose riding days or I had to help limp/tow them out or leave em trailside with a saw and firestarting supplies for the day.
Whats more reliable, A Cat that made 23 trips to a dealer in 1 1/2yrs, a Pro-lite that left early or didn't make it out at all 3 out of 7 days that I was with this year, or a Poo that according to your data needs a top end every 1200 miles?
I won't even bring up the 2 cat motors I know that went down this year cause I know the Zuk is better than that. lol
Honestly if I didn't know snowest existed and I judged reliability based on what I only see or know of Doo and Poo would be tied for most reliable and Cat 2012 and beyond would be in last by a LONG shot.