Chain case life Gen 5

[Driver]

like i said previously, give tom a call or email him instead of assuming he is wrong or just trying to make a buck. he told me some interesting things regarding doo's r&d on the two piece driveshaft and maybe he'll share that with you.
in terms of useless or nearly useless stuff that sledders buy especially in terms of money spent vs any gains the list is long--cans, belt drives, big wheels, pipes, etc.

Did he say that Doo only made 2-piece shaft to save time (=money) on assembly line? And its not about quick track change? Yeah who would have guessed.

You guys need to understand that money is what runs everything. Polaris hypes their sleds as lightweight, but its a synonym for cheap. You can make both lightweight and strong but it costs and shareholders want their money.

Doo would never had a recall for chain&gears but they saw the failure rate and how much its gonna cost them on warranty repairs and even law suits.

 

[snow-doo]

This is where the internet works for us,lots of exposure to any issues that may arise.Join the Blue Ribbon Coalition and see what the federal government is trying to do with land and trails around Moab.Snow community could be next.Off topic but the exposure is the same

 

[caper11]

Well, I don't know about "a problem not existing" but when I opened my case with 250 miles on it, and making sure the chain was adjusted correctly during that time, and found substantial wear and scratches in the case and cover around the bottom sprocket; something is moving. Funny, no marks around the top sprocket... I can pull open my '19 with 4800 miles on it and there are no marks or scratches around the bottom sprocket area.
I think the new sprocket will help, not grenade the sprocket at least, but it will transfer the stress elsewhere. I think it will just move chain problems further into the future.... Good luck, run what you want.

Excellent point.
That’s the interesting part to the whole story, When I did my one piece shaft at 335 miles I had no rub marks on my chain case but seen pics of sleds with that rubbing you mentioned. Your 19 and 23 had the same chain and sprockets, someone will argue about Hp but I know of sleds that ran aftermarket turbos at higher HP.
Chain quality issue, and sprocket quality may be a part of the problem. Lynx sleds had a stronger chain and still blew chain cases.

Tom is a very accomplished Machinist and fabricator, I highly doubt he would not of done some research without some investigation, like put a driveshaft and insert in a Lathe.



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[jcjc1]

Did he say that Doo only made 2-piece shaft to save time (=money) on assembly line? And its not about quick track change? Yeah who would have guessed.

You guys need to understand that money is what runs everything. Polaris hypes their sleds as lightweight, but its a synonym for cheap. You can make both lightweight and strong but it costs and shareholders want their money.

Doo would never had a recall for chain&gears but they saw the failure rate and how much its gonna cost them on warranty repairs and even law suits.

no and i hadn't heard about it being done to speed up assembly until a long time after speaking with tom and as far as i know, that's just a rumor but it's plausible.

 

[Frankthetank79]

Well, I don't know about "a problem not existing" but when I opened my case with 250 miles on it, and making sure the chain was adjusted correctly during that time, and found substantial wear and scratches in the case and cover around the bottom sprocket; something is moving. Funny, no marks around the top sprocket... I can pull open my '19 with 4800 miles on it and there are no marks or scratches around the bottom sprocket area.
I think the new sprocket will help, not grenade the sprocket at least, but it will transfer the stress elsewhere. I think it will just move chain problems further into the future.... Good luck, run what you want.

When I opened my chaincase at the end of winter last year with 1300km not a mark in my chaincase on my 23 and the same with my buddies who had 2500km so what does this prove?


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[Driver]

When I opened my chaincase at the end of winter last year with 1300km not a mark in my chaincase on my 23 and the same with my buddies who had 2500km so what does this prove?


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Exactly. Since 1996 some of my sleds have had rub marks inside chain case and some don't. My G5 didn't have at 1300km when I sold it.

 

[Driver]

Your 19 and 23 had the same chain and sprockets, someone will argue about Hp but I know of sleds that ran aftermarket turbos at higher HP.
Chain quality issue, and sprocket quality may be a part of the problem. Lynx sleds had a stronger chain and still blew chain cases.

Tom is a very accomplished Machinist and fabricator, I highly doubt he would not of done some research without some investigation, like put a driveshaft and insert in a Lathe.

I have seen Rexnord std chain & sprockets break with stock 850. All you need is a rider with no common sense and hard on throttle.

My friend ran aftermarket turbos for years with no problems. But he was not that aggressive rider.

And what was failure rate last season? Something probably under few %.

 

[caper11]

The rate of failure was way higher than it ever was in the past, that is a fact. Doo responded with an updated design of the bottom sprocket that has not been used for years, why didn’t doo use the lighter bottom sprocket like the last three MY turbos? I know of lots of G4 turbos running 200+ hp…..
When that driveshaft was released in the specs around snow check, I didn’t like it. This was well before any TKI vid was released. I tried out the two piece shaft, went back to the proven one piece. The weird driveline noises I have never heard on any sled I have owned led me to remove the two piece shaft.

This year will be different, no snow, very few guys riding and willing to be aggressive. I doubt there will be a peep about an issue like last year.

Can’t fault anyone for buying a product they feel will make their sled more reliable. I think the TKI insert is a good idea and will minimize spline wear, and add strength to that area in the tunnel.


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[jcjc1]

it’s simple, the burden of proof lies with showing this to be a non issue because there were failures.

 

[Frankthetank79]

The rate of failure was way higher than it ever was in the past, that is a fact. Doo responded with an updated design of the bottom sprocket that has not been used for years, why didn’t doo use the lighter bottom sprocket like the last three MY turbos? I know of lots of G4 turbos running 200+ hp…..
When that driveshaft was released in the specs around snow check, I didn’t like it. This was well before any TKI vid was released. I tried out the two piece shaft, went back to the proven one piece. The weird driveline noises I have never heard on any sled I have owned led me to remove the two piece shaft.

This year will be different, no snow, very few guys riding and willing to be aggressive. I doubt there will be a peep about an issue like last year.

Can’t fault anyone for buying a product they feel will make their sled more reliable. I think the TKI insert is a good idea and will minimize spline wear, and add strength to that area in the tunnel.


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Last year was a slow start to the season in Canada also but yet there were failures still showing up. I would argue guys are more aggressive this year due to lack of snow and just wanting to get out and ride. Just got back from riding and there is nothing but traction out there whether it be the ice layer, fallen trees, stumps, pin and wiggle to the dirt and rocks. There was 325+ sleds on the mountain the day we rode frisby plus Boulder parking lot, Sicamous parking lots were full and turning guys away and then all the other riding zones everywhere in between. If the 24’s were failing we would be hearing about it already it’s not from a lack of snow.


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[caper11]

Well one good thing about the two piece shaft is guys can change their track out easier with this crappy low snow. Sled Sales will suffer, but track sales should go up.


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[caper11]

Last year was a slow start to the season in Canada also but yet there were failures still showing up. I would argue guys are more aggressive this year due to lack of snow and just wanting to get out and ride. Just got back from riding and there is nothing but traction out there whether it be the ice layer, fallen trees, stumps, pin and wiggle to the dirt and rocks. There was 325+ sleds on the mountain the day we rode frisby plus Boulder parking lot, Sicamous parking lots were full and turning guys away and then all the other riding zones everywhere in between. If the 24’s were failing we would be hearing about it already it’s not from a lack of snow.


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I was not referring to Canada, the US has more sleds.
This year in Canada, has less snow than last year.


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[Driver]

The rate of failure was way higher than it ever was in the past, that is a fact. Doo responded with an updated design of the bottom sprocket that has not been used for years, why didn’t doo use the lighter bottom sprocket like the last three MY turbos? I know of lots of G4 turbos running 200+ hp…..

But there was solid bottom gear already on G4 turbos, no openings/windows on the bottom sprocket.





The fact is that G4 chain & sprockets were a lot stronger than G5 turbos had on 2023.

 

[caper11]

But there was solid bottom gear already on G4 turbos, no openings/windows on the bottom sprocket.





The fact is that G4 chain & sprockets were a lot stronger than G5 turbos had on 2023.

But but but, that’s a yellow prototype.

I owned a 21 and I have a 22 sprocket in my 23.


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[Driver]

But but but, that’s a yellow prototype.

I owned a 21 and I have a 22 sprocket in my 23.


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But that 22 turbo sprocket/chain is BorgWarner Hyvo and doesnt fit on 2023 Rexnord std parts. So they sold you bottom sprocket from 2022 n.a. if it had openings.

2020-2022 turbos all have BW Hyvo parts. And they dont fit together with Rexnord std parts.

 

[caper11]

But that 22 turbo sprocket/chain is BorgWarner Hyvo and doesnt fit on 2023 Rexnord std parts. So they sold you bottom sprocket from 2022 n.a. if it had openings.

2020-2022 turbos all have BW Hyvo parts. And they dont fit together with Rexnord std parts.

do you realize the tooth cut process is the last part of making a sprocket? That same sprocket can have either tooth cut in them to match the chain.
I have Hyvo in my sled with the light weight bottom sprocket, my 2021 had the Hyvo with the lightweight sprocket.


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[jcjc1]

"But there was solid bottom gear already on G4 turbos, no openings/windows on the bottom sprocket."
are you basing that absolute statement on that one vid?
my '22 turbo had holes in the bottom sprocket as does the '22 bottom sprocket currently in my '23 turbo.
didja call tom yet? why not?

 

[firstkitty]

My 2021 154 also had hyvo with holes in bottom sprocket.

 

[Frankthetank79]

Broken Driveshaft! But it’s not a G5


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[Driver]

Broken Driveshaft! But it’s not a G5


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Yeah this can happen, with wobble or not not the first and wont be the last.