Why is it????

[tudizzle]

Looks like the cats out of the bag Mark. The remodel has been done since last year.

Never seen an owner of a property turn down business..but I guess he really didn't want PJ at the place. Something about the stink of depression infecting the other guests enjoyment?































just a joke.....

 

[CANNONMAN]

Bull ****, You are the only one that asked me about hosting the Forum Run. The first year we were no where near ready as the FS had not given us permission to doing anything. Last year you wanted it on President Day weekend. Not to keen on giving discounts on one of the busiest weekends of the winter.
Find it funny that someone who I have never seen here in going on 3 years (must be to far to drive) knows what is happening on the Mesa. It is amazing to me how much we (TML & Roscoes) hear "YOU KNOW WHAT YOU NEED UP HERE" from people who only see one part (in this case have never seen) of the operation and have no clue of the overall business plan.
The remodeling is proceeding as per plan and is approx. half done. The remodeling is not the highest priority as the cabins are the nicest on the mountain, just need to be updated.
There may be other reasons YOU were not able to put together a Forum Run for last year.
As a business owner I am careful what I say here, some times I wish that was not the case. In the past TML has donated to your Forum Run, probably won't happen again.
Oh, just a thought, if you think you can do a better job up here, the place is for sale, so put your money where your mouth is!

Maybe, maybe not. But I and other peeps have asked him 2 years in a row and was told no. That the remodel wasn't finished. The remodel that started in 2009-2010 I believe.

 

[CANNONMAN]

Kaleb, Thanks for the offer, but I am only doing one cabin at a time so I don't think it would be very cost effective for you. Not much drywall in the remodels, mostly wood and stone. Did I hear you are having a little 'biler? If so, congrats.

Mark... when you're ready to stop fiddlin around & bust that job out... you just give me a call! We knocked out a clinic just down the road from you a couple months ago, I've got guys on standby just WAITING for you to give the green light...

 

[PJ-Hunter]

Looks like the cats out of the bag Mark. The remodel has been done since last year.
Never seen an owner of a property turn down business..but I guess he really didn't want PJ at the place. Something about the stink of depression infecting the other guests enjoyment?

QUOTE]

He says it's half done below.

Bull ****, You are the only one that asked me about hosting the Forum Run. The first year we were no where near ready as the FS had not given us permission to doing anything. Last year you wanted it on President Day weekend. Not to keen on giving discounts on one of the busiest weekends of the winter.
It is amazing to me how much we (TML & Roscoes) hear "YOU KNOW WHAT YOU NEED UP HERE" from people who only see one part of the operation and have no clue of the overall business plan.
The remodeling is proceeding as per plan and is approx. half done. The remodeling is not the highest priority as the cabins are the nicest on the mountain, just need to be updated.
There may be other reasons YOU were not able to put together a Forum Run for last year.
As a business owner I am careful what I say here, some times I wish that was not the case. In the past TML has donated to your Forum Run, probably won't happen again.
Oh, just a thought, if you think you can do a better job up here, the place is for sale, so put your money where your mouth is!

The Forum Ride is dead. Prolly not gonna happen again. Alot of people wanted it on GM. When it came about that it wasn't going to be held there. Peeps lost interest. Also, never asked for a discounted rate. That was up to you. Just asked for 30-40 peeps to fill your cabins. And the first time Gail and I both contacted you, last year it was me. I do know that TML is a nice place. I have seen the pics.

As for the USFS deal. Not required as guiding services weren't going to be needed. We were just a group that wanted to ride (just like the tourists that visit you often) and have a place to dine, have a few beers and an informal raffle. As far back as I remember nobody needed a permit or permission to book cabins.

And to clarify, I NEVER told you or anybody else how to run your establishment. The two years I asked you I had the best intentions of trying to help local businesses. Exposing people to your facility who normally don't see it. I was trying to spread the business around and be fair to Colorado riders from every corner of the state. This ride never benefitted me personally other than riding with new folks. And I never said I could do a better job than you. You get some pretty rave reviews. I doubt I could do a better job. I'd rather ride than have to mark, maintain and cater to riders.

Just so peeps know, I wasn't personally blasting Mark. I'm sure he's a great guy, just stating the fact that we were turned down. TWICE. One of these days I'll get to GM and ride. The poor snow kept me from traveling and just stayed local.

 

[CANNONMAN]

PJ, Your explanation below is very inaccurate and an outright LIE. To say the Forum Ride died because of us in ludicrous! I have NEVER HAD ANYTHING TO DO with your ride other than to donate to it and to say it died because we did not want to host it is about the stupidest thing I have heard in a long time.
The cabins are perfect for 99% of the people we host and we have no problem renting them to CO or Midwest peeps, but I can already hear the bitching if some peeps got a new cabin and some got an old one. It's just the way people are.
If you are going to post something, make it accurate. I know that it is hard for you but give it a try, you may get some more credibility!
Now, I am going to go ride my dirt bike and let the rest of the remodel wait for another day much to your dismay.

Maybe, maybe not. But I and other peeps have asked him 2 years in a row and was told no. That the remodel wasn't finished. The remodel that started in 2009-2010 I believe.

But here's the history rundown. In 2009-20010 the Forum Ride was held in Crested Butte. A discussion one night in Bushy's cabin ended in everyone wanting to have the next one on Grand Mesa. Powder Patrol, Bushy, XC, Mule, myself and quite a few others agreed. So in 2010-2011 Gail Dolen and I approached TML. We were told no, that he wanted wanted to finish the remodel. OK, but we didn't understand why he was worried about Colorado riders and the remodel not being good enough, but yet it was good enough for out of state riders traveling to GM. But hey, it's ok. So the Forum Ride was held at SLO again and they double booked us and that was a nightmare. By no means is that place super fancy. So in 2011-2012 I asked him again and was again told no, that the remodel wasn't complete (a year later) not good enough for Forum Riders but good enough for tourists. Don't get that philosophy myself but who knows. Because he said no, the Forum Ride died. Peeps didn't wanna stay in Grand Lake, peeps didn't wanna travel to Silverton because of the long drive, peeps didn't wanna hold it on Presidents Day (been held that weekend since I can rememeber) so the interest waned and it died. Donation items that I had already collected were returned and many explanations were sent to other doners and peeps planning on attending. So unless someone else picks up the ball, a fun and great fundraiser for the BRC, SAWS, White Rivers Forest Alliance and other local clubs fighting everyday to keep areas open ended.

 

[trinitypowder]

Lack of snow makes people cranky...............................it's gonna be a LONG, hot, summer

 

[CANNONMAN]

PJ, do you have any rights or licensing on the Forum Run or can anyone take it over for next year? MAY and it is a big MAY be interested in taking it over.

 

[PJ-Hunter]

PJ, Your explanation below is very inaccurate and an outright LIE. To say the Forum Ride died because of us in ludicrous! I have NEVER HAD ANYTHING TO DO with your ride other than to donate to it and to say it died because we did not want to host it is about the stupidest thing I have heard in a long time.
The cabins are perfect for 99% of the people we host and we have no problem renting them to CO or Midwest peeps, but I can already hear the bitching if some peeps got a new cabin and some got an old one. It's just the way people are.
If you are going to post something, make it accurate. I know that it is hard for you but give it a try, you may get some more credibility!
Now, I am going to go ride my dirt bike and let the rest of the remodel wait for another day much to your dismay.

AGAIN. I NEVER SAID IT WAS YOUR FAULT. FAWK ME. It died because people really wanted to ride the GM and we couldn't get the ride up there. I don't know about the whining thing with the cabins. At SLO some cabins were bigger, nicer. Some of the "motel" style type rooms were bigger or a touch nicer. It certainly didn't matter to me what the room looked like. It was warm, the bed was decent and I could step out on the porch, jump on the sled and go.

Some things that most didn't like about certain aspects of the Forum Ride:

1) Trailering before and after: After driving 2-6 hours one way, people weren't too excited about having to load up in the mornings and at night. They prefer ride in/ride out.

2) Most peeps like the "bar" style hang out and enjoy mingling with other riders inside or in the cabins. They weren't excited about having to travel on a trail system to go to separate lodges. They want to be in the same place.

3) They also want the privacy of their own room/cabin. Not a group cabin with "camp" style beds next to each other. That is why the place (Vgabond Ranch)poll last Fall got bagged.


Now history: The 4m ride has ALWAYS been on President's Day weekend and everybody was happy until 2 or 3 people started complaining. We have always had a "raffle" to raise money for groups to continue the fight to keep areas open. Traditionally, there was always a "pre" ride on Friday and then Sat/Sun were actual rides and Monday was the travel day.

PJ, do you have any rights or licensing on the Forum Run or can anyone take it over for next year? MAY and it is a big MAY be interested in taking it over.

No. And honestly, it's a very thankless task. It's eats a ton of time, not everyone is happy about the choice, the dinner, the raffle items, etc. I busted my hump getting some pretty expensive items. I had close to $6000 worth of stuff locked up in my garage. For the most part it was pretty good, but I got screwed for $200 worth of tickets because of a bounced check. But it's also hard to tell people if they want to buy tickets to bring a pocket full of cash. There aren't any ATMs in the backcountry either. The last four years I have seen the "planners" decide to never be part of it again. And now, after 3 years of doing it I can see it. You try to do something good and the masses chastise you for the choices. While the Ride itself was a blast I think it's just too hard to juggle that, a job, family and personal time. It would be a great thing to do if a person didn't have to work all of the time.

 

[tudizzle]

AGAIN. I NEVER SAID IT WAS YOUR FAULT. FAWK ME.

Because he said no, the Forum Ride died.

SHOOTIN' FISH IN A BARREL!

it's gonna be a LONG, hot, summer

a long summer indeed

 

[Scott]

Sooooooo in other words, this thread should now be in the "Colorado" forum.

LOL

 

[PJ-Hunter]

OK. My words fail me yet again. I never meant that Mark personally was responsible. I apologize. What was meant was that because it wasn't to be held on GM, the majority of people lost interest and it died.

Now, back to topic.

 

[CANNONMAN]

PJ, Do you have a list of donors you have gotten things from in the past, and could you post or better yet email them to me at thundermountainlodge@yahoo.com? I am seriously thinking about running and hosting a Forum Ride next January. I will start a new post in the CO section before to long. Thanks, Mark

 

[PJ-Hunter]

PJ, Do you have a list of donors you have gotten things from in the past, and could you post or better yet email them to me at thundermountainlodge@yahoo.com? I am seriously thinking about running and hosting a Forum Ride next January. I will start a new post in the CO section before to long. Thanks, Mark

There should be a list on the link in my sig. That's the FB page I setup. Also, most everyone that liked the page attended.

 

[CANNONMAN]

I can only see the front page and it has 88 "likes" . Was there really that many attendees? My understanding there was quite a few less than that, but I don't have any first hand knowledge of that. Would you care if TML took over trying to put a Forum Ride together?

 

[PJ-Hunter]

I can only see the front page and it has 88 "likes" . Was there really that many attendees? My understanding there was quite a few less than that, but I don't have any first hand knowledge of that. Would you care if TML took over trying to put a Forum Ride together?

Over the course of 4 years, yes. Generally there was 30-40 people who attended. The first SLO one was huge. Lots of people. Same with the Crested Butte/Irwin ride. The last SLO ride had 25-30. Lotta people bailed that year, I don't know why. But that was also the biggest year as far as donations. Always had 10 or so people that attended who were friends of
forum members but not members themselves.

And I don't care one bit. It's not going to ever be on my list of things to plan anymore.

I have a notebook full of contacts with names and numbers for donors, if you decide to do this.