What do you want from your fuel controler?

[Wheel House Motorsports]

Ahhhhhh.....looks like skidooinit finely found what he was looking for!

haha, i guess since nobody else seems to have any more constructive realistic discussion its what i am stuck with for now.


i see way to many people piping in about what it is they want but aren't sure how it will work or how it will benefit them. they just want something that "works" i guess keep your request simple eh?

 

[R_8_N]

If ya can't bolt of on....run pump gas....set it and forget it....there's not to many people on this site that you'll find that wants more. The old days of real mod sleds are far and few between. Bolting on a Turbo...bolting up a aftermarket suspension and wraping your sled is considered a built mod sled anymore. The old days of really good discussion's about how to cut 2a 800 blocks and welding them together to make a 1200 or bigger is what ya missed.

I could tell ya you are very misinformed when telling efi he's full of it and jump in but that's been beat to death too. Vipecs DO work. Personaly installed tested and tuned....You "seem" like a smart kid.....22 from your age there.....Vipec would probably be right up your alley!

 

[Wheel House Motorsports]

If ya can't bolt of on....run pump gas....set it and forget it....there's not to many people on this site that you'll find that wants more. The old days of real mod sleds are far and few between. Bolting on a Turbo...bolting up a aftermarket suspension and wraping your sled is considered a built mod sled anymore.

might as well be stock. all shelf parts if it bolts on its not much for a "mod"

Vipec would probably be right up your alley!

I know what you mean, i guess im not looking to talk with those folks. But how do we get to pump gas set and forget is what im asking? there has to be a way and the mod minded need to work and bounce ideas off one another.

as for Vipec, i have NEVER claimed it doesn't work, not even a little bit. Trust me, I imagine with the right people and time behind it, it will be the wave of the future. again, just needs time and the right people. i

I like carbs for the exact reason everyone else seems to want stand alone they can adjust. i map it myself, it runs great, i know how it works and unless something physically goes wrong with them, i keep running good. if it does i can adjust it myself, on the hill, no computer needed. my ecu doesnt tell them the air pressure(elevation/weather) they feel it and add fuel accordingly.

its 80* in the shop and the sun isnt even out. not much better to do then talk on here right now.

 

[gus bohne]

Its a true statement that most people are NOT cut out for a 2 stroke turbo.
Precision who ever he is, has dropped THAT bomb on us.
6 pistons is a dead give away he is not cut out for this.
Now, to say the vipec ( italian made ) product is the CURE ALL once again shows lack of yrs of knowledge gained in the field running turbos that don't go thru pistons or reeds.


Lots of time to prove its merit, hopefully the original designers are feeling lucky. You can try all you want but you will not reinvent the wheel.

skidooin it has proved he can do the job and survive.

To answer the origin of this post, What do you want from your fuel controller ?

Make 1 work as good as carbs .. just 1.

 

[philsummers21]

my ecu doesnt tell them the air pressure(elevation/weather) they feel it and add fuel accordingly.

They do?

 

[Wheel House Motorsports]

They do?

yessir. float bowl pressure.

 

[philsummers21]

Minor changes sure. Not the same as efi tho. For those who unload @ 4000 and ride up to 9000 no way

 

[snow4shover]

113*F outside in WI? and 90% humidity.... lol, tell me more.
yes that's what it was( we hit the heat wave across minnesota)

Where you dyno'd the sled was not in minnesota. Bikeman is located in Osceola, WI and the highest temp this month was 97. I highly doubt it was 113 degrees in the shop.
http://www.weather.com/weather/monthly/USWI0523

I just ask that people stop misleading and try to keep the facts straight. PrecisionEFI you contradict yourself left and right.

Vipec ECU is a great product. I know several people that have used them on their import cars. If I had 2500 to spend on a fuel system then I would probably buy one. The manufactures Arctic/Polaris/Skidoo/Yamaha/Harley....etc all use ECUs from companies that spend millions of dollars developing a computer that can compensate for any elevations or atmospheric conditions. They develop timing maps that will get the most power and provide the safest running engine they can.

The one thing that has always bothered me is how when people add turbos they do nothing to the internals of the engine. That engine has a certain compression ratio which is defined by a squish band, cc of the head etc. and no one ever alters this. The design of the cylinder has a direct correlation to detonation and how the fuel burns in the head. Maybe instead of pulling timing to fix detonation people should look into alter the engine for a turbo.

 

[Vi-PEC Powersports]

Its a true statement that most people are NOT cut out for a 2 stroke turbo.
this is obvious.
Precision who ever he is, has dropped THAT bomb on us.
not a bomb, just what is needed to take full control of the sled.
6 pistons is a dead give away he is not cut out for this.
!!!
Now, to say the vipec ( italian made ) product is the CURE ALL once again shows lack of yrs of knowledge gained in the field running turbos that don't go thru pistons or reeds.
not sure if i understand correctly this sentence!! VI-PEC is New Zealand made, by electronz ltd (manufacturer) and develop by us and 5 electronic engineers .we have sent sleds over there and they are working directly on the sleds overthere. I am far from saying our ECU is the cure to all problems, bad reeds for example, but it won't melt pistons if tuned right and that is guaranteed.


Lots of time to prove its merit, hopefully the original designers are feeling lucky.
Gus, don't go to far ok.We took 2 years to develop that system and thousand of hours....it is more than ready.
You can try all you want but you will not reinvent the wheel.
agree with you, but now the wheel as less friction because of a good sandblast and polish to make it smoother,way smoother.

skidooin it has proved he can do the job and survive.
i guess so, i don't know him

To answer the origin of this post, What do you want from your fuel controller ?

Make 1 work as good as carbs .. just 1.
it is at your hand, a bit more complicated than carb, but so much more you can do.

 

[Vi-PEC Powersports]

Where you dyno'd the sled was not in minnesota. Bikeman is located in Osceola, WI
wich is 30 minutes from st-paul minessota!!!
and the highest temp this month was 97. I highly doubt it was 113 degrees in the shop.
http://www.weather.com/weather/monthly/USWI0523
you may highly doubt but yes it was, call and talk to Joey at bikeman.

I just ask that people stop misleading and try to keep the facts straight. PrecisionEFI you contradict yourself left and right.
absolutely not, that is such an easy and general reply meaning nothing,but since you are opening a door on misleading people, i think i will take that opening and speak a bit about a few things your company is misleading people about......No i won't hijack the thread, i will PM you in a sec....
,
Vipec ECU is a great product. I know several people that have used them on their import cars. If I had 2500 to spend on a fuel system then I would probably buy one.
good.
The manufactures Arctic/Polaris/Skidoo/Yamaha/Harley....etc all use ECUs from companies that spend millions of dollars developing a computer that can compensate for any elevations or atmospheric conditions. They develop timing maps that will get the most power and provide the safest running engine they can.
So what's the point?

The one thing that has always bothered me is how when people add turbos they do nothing to the internals of the engine.
and that's ok like that!! all manufacturer are building the engine internals very solid so they can go on for a long time, toyota sells the tundra at 381 hp and you can buy at the part counter a trd supercharger boosting your hp at 506 and still be on factory warranty and even 200 000km extended warranty. You will never brake a rod or a crank at 8lbs of boost if you tune it right and with real tuning tools, not a you know what.
That engine has a certain compression ratio which is defined by a squish band, cc of the head etc. and no one ever alters this.
and that is not requiered also, when again you have the right tuning tools.
The design of the cylinder has a direct correlation to detonation and how the fuel burns in the head.
again what' the problem??
Maybe instead of pulling timing to fix detonation people should look into alter the engine for a turbo
absolutely no need to change anything on the head,internals for low boost numbers....when you cannot control detonation no more or when adding to much pressure on the internals, then you alter the internals and/or compression.it as been proven a 2s engine from poo or ac can run forever at 8 lbs boost on pump sea level.......you need the right tuning tool AND THE KNOWLEDGE.

 

[Wheel House Motorsports]

it as been proven a 2s engine from poo or ac can run forever at 8 lbs boost on pump sea level.......you need the right tuning tool AND THE KNOWLEDGE.[/B]

once i see more then just the one you have do this i will beleive it. just dont know many people pushing those pressure limits on pump at below 6k in elevation, let alone sea level. maybe for like a 1 second whack on the dyno but sure as **** not hanging there held to the bar in deep snow. that is when the problems arise.

just curious right now for my own info what you are running for fuel pressure and regulator setup on the push setups you were dynoing? or other kits which you took up in elevation for your 10# claim.

 

[Vi-PEC Powersports]

once i see more then just the one you have do this i will beleive it. just dont know many people pushing those pressure limits on pump at below 6k in elevation, let alone sea level. maybe for like a 1 second whack on the dyno but sure as **** not hanging there held to the bar in deep snow. that is when the problems arise.

just curious right now for my own info what you are running for fuel pressure and regulator setup on the push setups you were dynoing? or other kits which you took up in elevation for your 10# claim.

push 42 lbs no fpr(his decision!) but a third injector. 8lbs pump 91
hm turbo(my sled) 42 with aeromotive fpr.on stock injectors 8 lbs pump 91
i am not talking about dyno runs or numbers , i actualy run more than most people on here, not at elevation all the time but still puting down a lot of km per winter. 8lbs at sea level on 91 pump gas: any time you want with no problem.

 

[Wheel House Motorsports]

i guess something simple i must have overlooked that would make this much simpler. got any dyno sheets to throw up?

 

[Vi-PEC Powersports]

i guess something simple i must have overlooked that would make this much simpler. got any dyno sheets to throw up?

dyno sheet you requested......very linear power and torque. was like that run after run after run and we have done 7 hours of that. charging temperature around 55-60 celsius(with third injector on) and remember, it was a extremely hot day(i think the state broke a heat record that day!)

 

[philsummers21]

Ouch

 

[Wheel House Motorsports]

Ouch

???

 

[Wheel House Motorsports]

dyno sheet you requested......very linear power and torque. was like that run after run after run and we have done 7 hours of that. charging temperature around 55-60 celsius(with third injector on) and remember, it was a extremely hot day(i think the state broke a heat record that day!)

thanks. those are a very nice curve.. pulls well from a relatively low rpm for a 2 stroke.

now for the funny part.

45*C, sea level with no intercooler 191 hp and 90% humidity also!!

and your dyno sheet has AIR intake temperature at 88.1*F the whole time. as well as your humidity at 45%..... so you openly admit your fudging numbers for who knows what reason.

also, unless someone is messing with the dyno correction factors, the data you got is corrected, so the weather is pretty much a moot point anyways. corrected you can make 190ish horse on 8#. you were quoting some other hp values of the NA pro given various temps. then comparing to a corrected boosted HP for your hp/# ratios.

maybe your just doing a bad job of conveying all this info and its just some honest misinterpretation , but there is so much mixed and matched data that i see coming out its hard for me to believe any of it, and the reason in particular i am calling you out on it as it seems like a lot of incomplete claims of power and i hate to see people swayed by either honest bad communication or outright false claims when they go to buy a product.

 

[Boyko]

The data does look a little odd, I have done pulls before and correcting with a live weather station the ambient temp fluctuates a little on the report, so the correction was entered manually, Correcting with a lower temp will bring down the HP. The fuel pressure is low, at sea level 18 psig is around 32psi.

Is this season 4 for the vpec project?

 

[Vi-PEC Powersports]

thanks. those are a very nice curve.. pulls well from a relatively low rpm for a 2 stroke.

now for the funny part.
for you or me!!!



and your dyno sheet has AIR intake temperature at 88.1*F the whole time. as well as your humidity at 45%..... so you openly admit your fudging numbers for who knows what reason.
Wow!do you think i would post a data sheet if i was wrong!!inexperience mistake on your part. the dyno air intake sensor was not used, with our ECU we add an IAT in the new intake connected directly in the ECU so dyno IAT not used.(for charging temp reference) and the stock barometric sensor for polaris we are taking over and displayed in the ECU(understand now why we call the ECU a "standalone system"?)...funny.

also, unless someone is messing with the dyno correction factors, the data you got is corrected, so the weather is pretty much a moot point anyways. corrected you can make 190ish horse on 8#. you were quoting some other hp values of the NA pro given various temps. then comparing to a corrected boosted HP for your hp/# ratios.
stop diging your own tomb, it is obvious you have no idea what you are talking about. assuming the correction function was on to start with is wrong, should have take the time to ask more questions on the initial setup(what dyno sensor were we using....). the 191 hp has been done with the ambient temperature and no corrections where added or substracted, we do live tuning, dyno sensor werent used beside ambient temperature.(now what you can do is questionning the dyno hp calculation or calibration , what's next, lol!!)
maybe your just doing a bad job of conveying all this info and its just some honest misinterpretation , but there is so much mixed and matched data that i see coming out its hard for me to believe any of it, and the reason in particular i am calling you out on it as it seems like a lot of incomplete claims of power and i hate to see people swayed by either honest bad communication or outright false claims when they go to buy a product.
all is accurate to the .1 !! you have the dyno sheets in the face and it is not enough, you still argue....assuming this,this and that. the numbers that realy counts aren't on those sheet,the air intake temperature we saw that day( as high as 75 degrees celsius) are telling us this kit will make another 5-7% more on the snow (or on dyno at cooler temps:say 0 celsius ambient instead of 88 ambient simply because the charging temperature will drop to around 30 celsius......by the way, at 75 celsius charging temp, the pro is making 121...see what i mean?

 

[Vi-PEC Powersports]

The data does look a little odd, I have done pulls before and correcting with a live weather station the ambient temp fluctuates a little on the report, so the correction was entered manually, Correcting with a lower temp will bring down the HP. The fuel pressure is low, at sea level 18 psig is around 32psi.
Boyko, the fuel pressure sensor from the dyno wasn't used. the testing was done at 42lbs like requiered by push and with no FPR but a third injector setup. air intake temp reference not used to because we have connected a new IAT on the new air intake module push is fabricating(for charging temps reference only) factory baro is taken over by the ecu).
Is this season 4 for the vpec project?
2 years r&d, 3 months on the snow with 132 ECU working, it is going to be our first complete year this year(with 3 new ECU also. ac 800cc, 1100 turbo,polaris 800-900 rzr).

this year all dealers are taking a one week e.f.i. class at our facilities so they can support you guys correctly and we will travel across the country to major spot for test driving session from the turbo kit manufacturer that are commited with us. will be a good year i am sure.