Too much change is ruining our sport.
- Thread starter high time
- Start date
So many different ......
....engines, engine OEM's , engine designs. I dunno if it's EPA regs that is driving all the changes, from year-to-year or cost.
Who wants to lay out $10K + and in two years have an orphan motor in your sled?
Say nothing of unknown reliability issues .
BTW, mega ditto's on Hildebeast. Remember her hubby Billy-Bob BJ signed an executive order in his last few days in office closing millions of acres of forest, and Yellowstone Park.
Bush, love him or hate him, rolled that back. What we have now isn't the greatest in YNP and Nat. Forests, but better than none at all.
Wish I knew where these Pres. candidates stood on the issue. I'm not fond of any of them, on either side of the aisle.
....engines, engine OEM's , engine designs. I dunno if it's EPA regs that is driving all the changes, from year-to-year or cost.
Who wants to lay out $10K + and in two years have an orphan motor in your sled?
Say nothing of unknown reliability issues .
BTW, mega ditto's on Hildebeast. Remember her hubby Billy-Bob BJ signed an executive order in his last few days in office closing millions of acres of forest, and Yellowstone Park.
Bush, love him or hate him, rolled that back. What we have now isn't the greatest in YNP and Nat. Forests, but better than none at all.
Wish I knew where these Pres. candidates stood on the issue. I'm not fond of any of them, on either side of the aisle.
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Everybody should realize that all the liberal people in power drive everything against their agenda off the charts to make it impossible to do. Elitists deciding what/where/and how you should live. Sleds aren't destroying our environment, even by all the smoking 2 strokes...
Better vote good this year, might be actually paying 20 grand a popfor a sled... then nobody will like to ride them, so nobody will fight against the guys pushing all the epa restriction crap. The less riders, the less resistance...
Better vote good this year, might be actually paying 20 grand a popfor a sled... then nobody will like to ride them, so nobody will fight against the guys pushing all the epa restriction crap. The less riders, the less resistance...
I agree 100%. But as for this thread everything is getting more expensive, thats inflation, what do you do.
J
JSCC
Well-known member
The engine departments are only one faucet of sleds. EPA regs are not the ones making the huge advances in chassis configurations, we are. Look no further than in the mirror if you want to complain about cost because sleds change so much.
Even if there was no change in sled designs in the last 10 years, costs would have risen for inflation, as was mentioned. Add to that the sleds ARE that much better than an 03' King Kat, costs go up.
As for the thread originator, just because your sled can "run" with a new one, does not make it just as good. New chassis designs are FAR superior to the King Kat in every way. Just spend some time on one, you might be surprised.
Even if there was no change in sled designs in the last 10 years, costs would have risen for inflation, as was mentioned. Add to that the sleds ARE that much better than an 03' King Kat, costs go up.
As for the thread originator, just because your sled can "run" with a new one, does not make it just as good. New chassis designs are FAR superior to the King Kat in every way. Just spend some time on one, you might be surprised.
I understand that if a company doesn't grow/change/improve it will die. But I see a striking trend between snowmobiles and the auto market. The customers want a new chasis or new style car. The company deliver. The EPA regulates fuel consumption and fuel type. The automakers deliver. The customers want new hi-tech gadgets (altimiter & reverse in a sled compared to onstar and bluetooth in a car) and the company delivers. Right now we have the best sleds ever available. We also have the most effiecient, safest, and loaded vehicles in more styles then ever.
Look what this business practice has given ford. Their stock is in the $6 range. THis morning, GM announced that they had their biggest loss in history for Q4 last year. Although I appreciate what is being done with sleds and cars, I don't think the companies are reaping the benifits of their hard work. Hopefully what needs to be done with 99% percent of companies out there doesn't become the fall of America's auto and recreational vehicle makers.
Look what this business practice has given ford. Their stock is in the $6 range. THis morning, GM announced that they had their biggest loss in history for Q4 last year. Although I appreciate what is being done with sleds and cars, I don't think the companies are reaping the benifits of their hard work. Hopefully what needs to be done with 99% percent of companies out there doesn't become the fall of America's auto and recreational vehicle makers.
yep, if you don't vote for a retard like huckabee, nobody will ever be allowed to sled again. Simple as that, right? At least McCain is an intelligent guy that can think for himself instead of being force fed his opinions by the special interests that fuel most republicans.
The market is what it is, the sleds today blow the DOORS off older sleds! put any older sled against a newer sled with the same amount of time & money & there's no comparison, NONE. I can't even get on an older sled now, I used to love the 1m chassis, now I feel like I'm on a quad if I hop on one.
Each year they get better, each year they cost more. Coincidence? not really.
H
high time
Well-known member
Yeah, that's what I said; it can run with the new ones.
And considering it's also more depenable and costs less, what's your point?
A little improvement in handling is not worth it.
And I mean a little, otherwise you'd be getting into areas that I can't. That won't happen.
Owen
And considering it's also more depenable and costs less, what's your point?
A little improvement in handling is not worth it.
And I mean a little, otherwise you'd be getting into areas that I can't. That won't happen.
Owen
Take your ego out of the equation, YOU would ride better on a newer sled, they are different for a reason. Have you ever heard of a rider buying an M, dragon, or rev, then going back to the older chassis? HELL NO.
Anything 5 years old is going to be cheaper, if you don't understand that, I've got a great deal on a t-cat mtn, handles just like my M1k, lots of power too.
You're comparing apples to oranges.
Anything 5 years old is going to be cheaper, if you don't understand that, I've got a great deal on a t-cat mtn, handles just like my M1k, lots of power too.
You're comparing apples to oranges.
Get what you expect
WOW- bummer dude! Read your posts!
Issues, expensive, hard to work on - and that coming from a submarine tank commander!
Try it- you'll like it if you want to.
All the reasons you cite are the reasons I bought and LOVE my XP- and you would not believe the room under the hood. Course I never have to work on it 'cause it's brand new, and I don't F**k wid it! Pulled my plugs just to check the color and wanted to do something to it after 800+ incredible miles.
Wish you had one almost as much as you.
WOW- bummer dude! Read your posts!
Issues, expensive, hard to work on - and that coming from a submarine tank commander!
Try it- you'll like it if you want to.
All the reasons you cite are the reasons I bought and LOVE my XP- and you would not believe the room under the hood. Course I never have to work on it 'cause it's brand new, and I don't F**k wid it! Pulled my plugs just to check the color and wanted to do something to it after 800+ incredible miles.
Wish you had one almost as much as you.
H
high time
Well-known member
When Doo slips out from under their warrantee.
You might have a different take on this subject. I guess you'll have another new one by then. No wonder resale is poor. I think we should expect more.
I'd rather they were able to keep a motor long enough to get the bugs worked out, instead of building something new to meet to regs.
Owen
You might have a different take on this subject. I guess you'll have another new one by then. No wonder resale is poor. I think we should expect more.
I'd rather they were able to keep a motor long enough to get the bugs worked out, instead of building something new to meet to regs.
Owen
J
JSCC
Well-known member
You say this, then get on a fourstroke thread and bash. If you really wanted a realiable sled, you know where to look. If you want good resale, you know where to look. Yet you bash.......what is it that you really want?
A gay guy....maybe? You know why she can't wear skirts don't you???
Because if she bends over you might see her balls!
With all due respect.....I've bought one or two new sleds every year since 1999. There is absolutely no question that my Dragon and M sleds are much better sleds than my Edge and 1M sleds were. EFI makes the world a better place..... especially when it comes to BOOST!!!
BOOST is the most addicting drug I've ever had....problem is, it probably costs more than any other drug!
Look what this business practice has given ford. Their stock is in the $6 range. THis morning, GM announced that they had their biggest loss in history for Q4 last year. Although I appreciate what is being done with sleds and cars, I don't think the companies are reaping the benifits of their hard work. Hopefully what needs to be done with 99% percent of companies out there doesn't become the fall of America's auto and recreational vehicle makers.
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Ya, the problem is the 4thQ loss is after the top 10 guys get their 10 million dollar salaries and 30 million dollar bonuses.
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Ya, the problem is the 4thQ loss is after the top 10 guys get their 10 million dollar salaries and 30 million dollar bonuses.
We have no body to blame but ourselves for the high cost of sleds and for the constant change. Look at it when the new sleds come out we bench race the crap out of them and declare a winner based on what we read. The more new and improved designs the better the chance of winning the bench race. This equates into actual sales for the manufacturer. We get it from our vehicles. How many of you have power windows,air conditioning, leather seats, GPS, fuel injected vehicles? If the Jones's have it then we want it to only better. What really drives the cost up is the warranty. How many of you have abused a sled only to have it fail. Then right to the dealer and look for full warranty and demand that everything better be like new. I have done it and everybody I know has done it. Look at motocross bikes, way more technology but cheaper. Guess what very little warranty.
We must remember that we are dealing with corporate america and they are greedy and very smart. Why do you think Iraq started? We have some of the same problems only we are civilized and still put great value on human life. Glad I live in North America.
We have created the monster so we might as well live with it.
We must remember that we are dealing with corporate america and they are greedy and very smart. Why do you think Iraq started? We have some of the same problems only we are civilized and still put great value on human life. Glad I live in North America.
We have created the monster so we might as well live with it.
If I am to "blame" for the constant change then I am happy to have done my part. I love the new technology and look forward to, hopefully, better equipment each year. I have been dirt biking and sledding since the 60's and I can tell you that "the good ole days" are right now. You've got to pay to play so if the cost of a new ride is too steep, wait till next year and pick up a clean used sled at a fraction of the cost of new.
But please don't complain that the manufactures are making too many changes. Ride an 03 mountain max and then an 08 nytro or a powder special and an m-series cat.
BTW I paid more for my 08 KTM than I did for my 07 RMK.
But please don't complain that the manufactures are making too many changes. Ride an 03 mountain max and then an 08 nytro or a powder special and an m-series cat.
BTW I paid more for my 08 KTM than I did for my 07 RMK.
I
ItDoAble
Well-known member
This thread blows me away .. it's a joke, right? There is NO WAY I'd go back to the sleds I've owned in the past! These are the steak and lobster days, boys .. quit whinning!
Every one of them needed mods just to get the power halfway decent. Wasn't too long ago that 100hp was considered high performnce. Remember the time when you'd never stop pointing uphill .. stuck city. 03 800 RMK ok, but cranks ... Try wipping the old 2001 800 RMK around in the powder the way I do the M8 .. impossible. Climbing the 99 700 RMK 136 with head/twin pipes ... weak. Before that .. SkiDoos without front bumpers .. jetting .. flooding .. foulded plugs every other ride .. I could go on and on .. but don't have the time.
HighTime, I think you're smoking some bad sh*t ...
Every one of them needed mods just to get the power halfway decent. Wasn't too long ago that 100hp was considered high performnce. Remember the time when you'd never stop pointing uphill .. stuck city. 03 800 RMK ok, but cranks ... Try wipping the old 2001 800 RMK around in the powder the way I do the M8 .. impossible. Climbing the 99 700 RMK 136 with head/twin pipes ... weak. Before that .. SkiDoos without front bumpers .. jetting .. flooding .. foulded plugs every other ride .. I could go on and on .. but don't have the time.
HighTime, I think you're smoking some bad sh*t ...
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You are falling victim to their greater agenda.
B
BackCountryBob
Well-known member
Hillary and guys? Don't think so
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