Timbersled vs UFO

[Gros Chien]

Went out yesterday doing comparison ST Timbersled/UFO with new upgrades. The feeling on the UFO is so different. More like riding a dirt bike compare to the MH where it's more or less a blend of dirt bike and sled. The UFO is so smooth and predictable when hitting big drops and jumping if you have some motocross background. On the MH when landing big drops or hitting jumps it tends to throw you over the bars where the UFO lands as smooth as it could get. We were riding in waist deep snow and the UFO cuts through easier, feels like it has less drag without a tunnel. On the otherhand, tractionwise, the MH pulls better but UFO is coming with a lighter prototype and some more upgrades soon so we'll see about that.

Now on the trail well there's no match, the UFO is a rocket ship, responsive, turns like a bike and so easy to lean down in full control. Justin is coming back next month with his new prototype and I just can't wait to jump on this missile and hit big drops, jump boulders, do steep descent, carve turns. The UFO is really a fun kit to ride hard

Take note, I'm unbias. I own 4 SX-F 450s, 2 on MH ST, 1 on MH LT and 1 on UFO. This is simply my guts feeling after doing a day out and compare. We'll be doing more tests later next month.

 

[xprs rider]

Good review I think this kit is for the folks that want a product that works like a dirt bike that you can control in all conditions,there has been no competition with Timbersled and its nice to see a product that is a serious competitor which will help the industry I know Justin has been working hard on this,good job

 

[thejean]

Went out yesterday doing comparison ST Timbersled/UFO with new upgrades. The feeling on the UFO is so different. More like riding a dirt bike compare to the MH where it's more or less a blend of dirt bike and sled. The UFO is so smooth and predictable when hitting big drops and jumping if you have some motocross background. On the MH when landing big drops or hitting jumps it tends to throw you over the bars where the UFO lands as smooth as it could get. We were riding in waist deep snow and the UFO cuts through easier, feels like it has less drag without a tunnel. On the otherhand, tractionwise, the MH pulls better but UFO is coming with a lighter prototype and some more upgrades soon so we'll see about that.

Now on the trail well there's no match, the UFO is a rocket ship, responsive, turns like a bike and so easy to lean down in full control. Justin is coming back next month with his new prototype and I just can't wait to jump on this missile and hit big drops, jump boulders, do steep descent, carve turns. The UFO is really a fun kit to ride hard

Take note, I'm unbias. I own 4 SX-F 450s, 2 on MH ST, 1 on MH LT and 1 on UFO. This is simply my guts feeling after doing a day out and compare. We'll be doing more tests later next month.

Thanks for the side by side comparison! Can you elaborate a little more though on what you mean by the "MH pulls better"?

 

[Gros Chien]

I meant that identically geared the MH was pulling better going up on a tracked steep hill. Both were geared 12/17 I think. I'll have to double check that. 12 tooth I'm sure of, out of the jackshaft though but not sure about the high gear. Anyway Justin is sending me a new ratio (15/17 I think) on my UFO because his were hauling *** compared to my MH and UFO the way mine were geared during our tests. Hope this clarifies your question THEJEAN.

I'll wait and see what the new SX has to offer as new changes (track angle of attack and size, weight....) but at this moment I'm going all UFO next year on my fleet. It is an easier machine to ride for the beginners IMO and in my rental business that's what I'm looking for, I more friendly user snowmachine.

One last issue Justin needs to address seriously though, is the efficiency of his brake system. I hope this wickness is solve on the next prototype.

 

[Freeride1]

That SX kit looks sweet! Should have room for a turbo like that.

I got to ride my UFO on our little bowl in northern New Hampshire and was very happy. My typical Pro RMK run involves a lot of max heart rate but I could ride that spot all day and barely break a sweat on my bike. It sidehills through chop like a dream. I could ride one handed safely and it is about 45 degrees. I agree, brakes would be nice but I was able to downhill turn without them. I rode it like a snowboard and used my radius to slow down. My biggest dilemma is getting a turbo on the bike or finding a motor that makes the power I want. In a perfect world I would have 125hp. Then I could climb and wheelie at will.might even be able to drift the bike on a trail.

 

[thejean]

So is the UFO completely devoid of a brake? If not, how does their brake work?

 

[mx4life]

The updated UFO kits are kicking ***! On the trail and in the trees. I have no complaints. I have 2 updated kits for sale at a killer price. I am headed south for the rest of the winter and would like someone to take these off my hands and enjoy them rather then chilling in my garage for the rest of the winter. I will deliver or pay shipping.

 

[Freeride1]

So is the UFO completely devoid of a brake? If not, how does their brake work?

The rotor is on the drive shaft like an old Cat snocross sled. They added a checkvalve to keep it tighter to the rotor and changed pad materiel which was finenon the trail but in that deep bowl sawing a hard sidehill it went away. It came back when I came out to the trail and dragged the brake a little. He is working on a fully enclosed brake that is like a clutch.

A friend of mine with limited sled and bike experience came out with me for the weekend and fell in love with my bike. The both of us preferred it over my Pro Rmk we took turns riding.

 

[moto365]

UFO adjustment

IF your hill climbing and want more ski pressure, how do you adjust for that? Or if its a powder day how do you take pressure off the ski? Can you adjust on the mountain?

 

[Gros Chien]

UFO has adjustable rake on the spindle. Can adjust on the mountain

 

[skidoo28]

IF your hill climbing and want more ski pressure, how do you adjust for that? Or if its a powder day how do you take pressure off the ski? Can you adjust on the mountain?

Its not a snowmobile.....it has a pivot point in the center of the chassis so it works totally different in the snow; and in saying that, needs to be setup differently than previously thought. You transfer your weight back and forth to change ski pressure, as you would riding on dirt, on top of being able to pull your limiter strap tighter and change the rake of your spindle. It also really likes a stiffer bike valving so it will transfer pressure/power to the track better when under momentum. Gearing has also been a touchy thing, but i've found if you gear it as tall as your bike can handle in about second or third is what the kit likes on the hill. You have to RIDE it, and think about keeping momentum. Once you do, you'll immediately notice the advantages of the UFO design. Its not for everyone...the guys who switch to a snowbike because its easier to ride than a snowmobile, and who want to apply the least amount of physical effort to get from point A to B aren't going to like the kit. But the guys who want to push their riding boundries/bikes boundries and have a hard time riding a TS to dirtbike potential, will LOVE this kit. I have proven that our UFO ktm's when ridden properly will keep up and in some cases outclimb a TS ST on the same bike. (Tested in canada with a properly setup UFO, 185lb rider, and I was outclimbing the same model ktm 90% of the time with a TS ST kit, similar rider weight.) I'm still finding things every ride that make my bike go better, whether its bike setup or adjusting my riding style.

 

[moto365]

stiffer bike spring/valving

(It also really likes a stiffer bike spring/valving) How much is that?$$$$
I race the enduro pro class and hare scramble pro class. my race suspension cost $675. so i would have to pay $$$$ twice a year?

 

[thejean]

(It also really likes a stiffer bike spring/valving) How much is that?$$$$
I race the enduro pro class and hare scramble pro class. my race suspension cost $675. so i would have to pay $$$$ twice a year?

I would just buy a second shock setup rather than do that.

 

[Freeride1]

(It also really likes a stiffer bike spring/valving) How much is that?$$$$
I race the enduro pro class and hare scramble pro class. my race suspension cost $675. so i would have to pay $$$$ twice a year?

I had my suspension done at Factory Connection for A Vet GNCC and J Day races. I got a supercross revalve for $365. They actually only charge for parts, and a suspension service if that have done your bike once. The revalve is usually $200ish, plus the charge for a typical service.

I really like how it goes with stiffer valving to control the chassis movement.

 

[word]

How much?

 

[Wundah]

Any further impressions of the UFO in the deep stuff with all of the updates?

So all the updates are done and there were a lot of them. The UFO shop has been over the top nice and helpful on all fronts since buying the kit. Shock is now forward and actually has a new mounting position. Roller kit added and new dog bones as well. All that said and the bike runs so much better. I will post some more pictures of all the updates that were done but all I know is that it rocks now. I may end up upgrading bikes for next season to a KTM but I need to find enough work this summer to pull that off. UFO just has the bike feel down, it's suspension alongside your bikes is just a more natural feel compared to the stiff 2x4 ride of a Timbersled. Don't get me wrong I enjoy the TS but just not as much as the UFO. If any of you guys are in Washington let's meet up at Stevens Pass when they open up the backside of the ski area in a few weeks to sleds... Riding other kits helps us get perspective on what we think is reality and that's helpful for everyone.

 

[thejean]

So all the updates are done and there were a lot of them. The UFO shop has been over the top nice and helpful on all fronts since buying the kit. Shock is now forward and actually has a new mounting position. Roller kit added and new dog bones as well. All that said and the bike runs so much better. I will post some more pictures of all the updates that were done but all I know is that it rocks now. I may end up upgrading bikes for next season to a KTM but I need to find enough work this summer to pull that off. UFO just has the bike feel down, it's suspension alongside your bikes is just a more natural feel compared to the stiff 2x4 ride of a Timbersled. Don't get me wrong I enjoy the TS but just not as much as the UFO. If any of you guys are in Washington let's meet up at Stevens Pass when they open up the backside of the ski area in a few weeks to sleds... Riding other kits helps us get perspective on what we think is reality and that's helpful for everyone.

How about deep powder / wet snow performance?

 

[Freeride1]

Mine has satisfied me in deep snow. It amazes me what it can climb but I have only ridden with two other bikes. One was a KX450 Frozen Moto and one was a turbo YZ 450, Timbersled137. So I haven't had another 450 with a Timbersled to ride with. All I know is I love riding it. I wish I could ride my bike this good in the summer! I feel like a hero riding wet sand on a 125. The handling is so balanced when I throw it in a turn and try to drag the bar.

 

[Jsteb]

first day out on the UFO , it has the latest updates done to it, and was working really well.

the bike is 2014 ktm 450 xc-f

it handles the trail and the pow well felt much more plush then the T/S kits i have been on, ( st / Lt ) I'm told the new sx has a similar feel ??

i did upgrade to a larger rear spring which i think was a good choice, next will be to stiffen up the front end... although it wasn't bad.

rekluse was a nice addition , i run them on the woods bike too so i felt right at home with it, would definitely recommend

gpr steering damp was ok on the trail cranked it right up and felt like someone else was hanging on to the bars .... turned it right off and found it looser to steer but more darting... not sure if i like the stab or not... in the pow i turned it down to about 3 and forgot about it.


gearing seemed great , ran a 13 up front and a 16 in the rear, was using all gears but mostly 3rd in the pow ( 30 cm's ish of new) i would like to try a 14 up front if the chain has stretched enough to fit it..

carrying gas and other stuff was an issue, i burnt through 30ish L ( 3 full tanks )
did ride all day and was wide open often, but i think a larger acerbis tank would be good, i had the ski doo can on the back but ditched it asap to lose some weight. I would like to find a better gas and tool/food carry that is easily removed from the tunnel and not on my back.

sometimes the bike didn't like to start right away so the bigger battery was great , and i would think the thermostat helped with the temps as it sure cools off quick, it didn't seem like it was over fuelling , as the oil level did not rise, not sure if i would see that or not?

would like to try the new skags on the outside of the ski also but it did handle the trail pretty easily as i have been told it's to be a nightmare on the older T/S


one complaint was the brakes, it worked great on the trail but once in the pow they did nothing .... pretty much all day and on the steep decents i would have to do snowboard style turn/speed checks to maintain the line i wanted , once hit the trail again they worked great.. i guess they just ice up???

here is a couple pics from the day

 

[Blaser]

The results from the Jackson Hole hill climbs today might shed a bit more light on this topic.
1st- Allen Mangum 2015 Timbersled ST, KTM 450 turbo. 10 psi boost.
2nd- Reagan Sieg, 2014 Timbersled SX, stock KTM 450,
3rd- Brett Blaser 2015 Timbersled ST, stock KTM 450,
4th- pro hill climber Keith Curtis, ufo KTM 450 turbo, 12 psi boost,
5th- Cameron ? (Local rider) 2011 Timbersled ST, 2 stroke 250.
6th- Justin York ufo KTM 450

We have lots of video we're gathering up, and should be able to cut an edit fairly soon. They lined us all up at once at the bottom and we all got to hit the hill together. Man was it fun