So how skrewed will the New Republic of Califorado be after Tuesday?

[PJ-Hunter]

True Kaleb. But as you stated your work is pretty much building stuff for govt. or public entities that are basically operated with the tax base. If you were in the private sector, like I was, you would have lost your job. And by private, I mean land development, houses, condos, etc. All being built with money from investors, not taxpayers.

My second job I lost (Utah) was based on Stimulus money, but unbeknownst to myself and a few others in that company, they had put ALL of their eggs on landing the I-17 project (UDOT funds from Obama money). They had no bids out for smaller projects around the SLC metro area, private, county or municipality. So when they were not awarded the bid, funded by stimlus money, they laid everyone off except for a couple Senior Engineers and obviously the owners.

I didn't ride much in 2008 or 2009 for obvious reasons, but I did go out. And that was basically the only thing that kept me from losing my sanity. I tried to pick up extra cash by taking non-locals out to some better places but that got squashed pretty damn hard. So, if it wasn't for riding areas being open enough to ride and enjoy, I most likely would have hit rock bottom and not been able to pick myself up. I'm doing better now, not because the US economy is better, it isn't. I'm doing better because the Chinese economy is cranking.

 

[PJ-Hunter]

There does need to be a middle. But people are too afraid to elect the middle, which is why Hickenlooper will be the new Gov.

One of the greatest Presidents of all time said "A divided House will not stand". He's right. The left works with the whack job special interest groups to try and take rights and privilages away. Which does nothing at all to help the citizens as a whole. The Right works only with the Whack job special interest groups and that does nothing to help the citizens as a whole. They don't work together for the common wellbeing of citizens. The only thing that stays the same as the uber-rich are protected from becoming poor or "broke" or just get richer. All the while, us normal working class people struggle to stay where we are at. If the left and the right would compromise and work togther, then these whack job special interest groups would fade away, IMO. Work for the people, not Big Oil or the Ultra Green movement, PETA, the Sierra Club and so on.

 

[paulharris]

You hear the land grab..save our mountain from wilderness....mantra on here all the time. For obvious reasons, and of course I am against more wilderness designations.

But when you sit down to select a Politican to receive your vote....is that really one of the top issues? With all the other crap going on in our state/country, for me personally, where I get to play with my overpriced toys is pretty low on the list.

Absolutely this issue is Right at the top of my list when i vote. Snowmobiling is very important to me.....but not just that....its the whole issue of public lands access for jeeps, atv, mountain bike or whatever. A lot of liberals feel that humans are the biggest threat public lands and are trying their hardest to close it all down. I can guarantee you that if GORE had been elected president in 2000 We would be in a world of hurt right now with very few places to ride. How will you feel if your kids have no access to public lands in the future because we didnt put up a fight?

 

[Boston Racing]

What I think Dizzle is getting at is............

If his kids dont have a Job, Affordable housing, access to healthcare, Access to higher education...............Basicly the abilityto provide for thier own family.....Where they go snomobiling / enjoy the outdoors is irrevelant.


Truthfully, if they were to ban snowmobiling we would all find something else to do.............I would.





PS...I vote based on the things important to me like access to the outdoors but I also see where other people are coming from. I certainly do not think it is the goverments job to support anybody. Think about it...If the govt takes my money to build a widget to put you to work..........will anything ever get better. Sooner or later I run out of money. The govt need to incentivise the private sector to create jobs..........not encourage laze asses to sit at home living high on the hog. I think they should do away with all forms of welfare...... If people need help they can go clean up a park or some other community service and EARN a check. At some point the free ride has to end.....

 

[dtown]

Absolutely this issue is Right at the top of my list when i vote. Snowmobiling is very important to me.....but not just that....its the whole issue of public lands access for jeeps, atv, mountain bike or whatever. A lot of liberals feel that humans are the biggest threat public lands and are trying their hardest to close it all down. I can guarantee you that if GORE had been elected president in 2000 We would be in a world of hurt right now with very few places to ride. How will you feel if your kids have no access to public lands in the future because we didnt put up a fight?

I'm with tdizz on this one... more important issues for me to get my vote.

My kids will have access to public land... civil disobedience is a priceless American value. Just because they say the land is closed, doesn't mean you can't ride there. Look at what a fiasco the Mexico boarder is... you really think USFS is going to be able to patrol the wilderness any better?

Edit - I am very consious of riding area boundaries and staying within those areas now. I'm just saying, if they take to much, I will ride where I want. I do "stretch" the boundaries the couple times a year that I'm stuck riding Vail Pass...

 

[backcountryislife]

True Kaleb. But as you stated your work is pretty much building stuff for govt. or public entities that are basically operated with the tax base. If you were in the private sector, like I was, you would have lost your job. And by private, I mean land development, houses, condos, etc. All being built with money from investors, not taxpayers.

I think I mis-stated what I do. I just do that type of work... because it's all that is there. I AM in the private sector, no question about it. I work for a drywall/ steel stud contractor with 2 estimators, an owner, and an office guy who answers the phone & does the books.
2 years ago we built office buildings, hotels (5 million in hotels in 07, Edgemont in Boat, Weston in Avon were just a couple), private hospitals (Craig hospital, for one), condo buildings, large houses... the difference is that right now NONE of that is out there. All we have is public work with some pitiful little remodels here & there. 2 years ago we would have laughed at some of the jobs that we go after now.


btw, which administration was in power when the economy crashed??? Oh yeah... that's right... NOT Nobama. He's no prize, but don't be confused into thinking for a second that HE is the reason for the economic issues. (at least not the initial cause)

Btw, it's interesting to actually be able to have a political discussion where people actually stop & think about other people's positions like they are here. rare experience.

 

[dtown]

If everyone's blinders come off, they'll realize that there are good things about meeting in the middle. If the far right got full control, it'd be just as disastrous as the far left (in my opinion, far more actually).

I'm arguing simply that there needs to be a middle, NOT that we should go to the whack job, useless left anymore than the whack job extremist right.

100% agreed. This is why approval ratings of ALL poiticians have fallen over the last few years. We need represenatives that represent the majority... middle class middle of the road reps and dems and independants.

I think a huge step in the right direction (and getting rid of special interest) is to implement across the board term limits for all elected and appointed possitions, and to INCREASE their pay. This way you have QUALITY people wanting the job, and the special intersest dollars aren't as inticing. WhoTF thought of the lobbiest thing anyway... they should be banned from congress. No more career politicians.

 

[playbaby]

100% agreed. This is why approval ratings of ALL poiticians have fallen over the last few years. We need represenatives that represent the majority... middle class middle of the road reps and dems and independants.

I think a huge step in the right direction (and getting rid of special interest) is to implement across the board term limits for all elected and appointed possitions, and to INCREASE their pay. This way you have QUALITY people wanting the job, and the special intersest dollars aren't as inticing. WhoTF thought of the lobbiest thing anyway... they should be banned from congress. No more career politicians.

120% agreeeeed well said!!!!

Another thing that hurt us is everybody in this country dont deserve a house or a car if they cant afford it thats what put us in the crunch is all the bad lending practices and the stimulas money is only a bandaid and will fix nothing sorry k its like throwing sticks a raging fire that wont put it out will it Hell lets put people worse in debt and see if they can pay for it cash for clunkers was a Joke cause people just bought stuff they couldent afford!!

 

[skibreeze]

Stimulus or not, people are buying windows. Does it help some, yes, but when somebody is spending 20 to 75k on them, the $1500 credit really doesn't mean diddly. Half the windows that I sell are either too big or too small to qualify anyway. Not to mention that I am still selling jobs where the financing is very difficult to get so these folks are paying CASH. For that matter, I could go buy a new diesel truck and pay cash, but I'm smart enough not to.

Unemployment is high, but there has always been unemployment. Even if it's 10% higher than normal, that still means that 85 of 100 are working. The key is to make sure that you aren't one of the 15.

 

[PJ-Hunter]

BCIL, I guess that I never noticed when the economy started tanking. I was working in Steamboat in it's own little world up to the point of Obama taking office. I worked 60 hours (average) a week since I got into the job market back in 1998 after school. Things were good. For me as soon as BO took office things slowed down. I started having less and less work, contracts got cancelled because investors pulled out and by October of 2008 rolled around I was lucky to get 30 hours. We contracted doing boundary work for Trans Canada from Rangley to Idaho. But by the time we got to Wamsutter, WY our contract got cancelled because of oil prices tanking. The Canadian company didn't want to invest in American oil and gas with prices so crappy, so I stayed home till I was able to find something that at least made it possible to buy gas and pay for daycare and have some left over to pay bills. That was the job in Frisco. So yeah, I kinda blame the BO administration for it. Maybe I'm wrong, maybe I'm not.



As for windows, I looked into getting some more efficient ones for my house. $12k was the quote. A $1500 tax credit wouldn't have done squat.

*Dave, I didn't know you sold windows. I thought you were some sort of Govt. contractor or something.

 

[colorado logger]

They are printing money and will do so until the nation comes out this. Like it or not it is a form of stimulus and a tax increase at the same time. the fed chair calls it que2. very complicated. Some say they should have done more stimulus, most of what has been done has been paid pack.

 

[skibreeze]

As for windows, I looked into getting some more efficient ones for my house. $12k was the quote. A $1500 tax credit wouldn't have done squat.

*Dave, I didn't know you sold windows. I thought you were some sort of Govt. contractor or something.

12,000 for windows
-1500 tax credit
-5,000 - the cost of doing nothing with your old windows over 10 years in utility bills.
-5,500 in added value to the home.

Now you can see why people are buying something that they need anyway. In the long run, they are essentially free. You just have to have the money upfront.

 

[milehighassassin]

because the Chinese economy is cranking.

Uhh, no it's not
http://www.businessweek.com/news/20...s-9-6-in-third-quarter-from-year-earlier.html

They are still growing but it is slowing down a lot, their inflation is growing and flags are starting to be thrown up.

What China must face is they need the U.S. economy. If we do bad, they will eventually do bad as well. We just consume too much from them. Add that to the fact that they adjust their Yen to our dollar in ways that are almost illegal and will eventually burn themselves.


The next two years in the U.S. should be good. S&P should rise, DOW should gain. Historically coming out of a mid-term election with a split in power, history has shown that we will grow and profit. Probably won't eliminate the losses but it will head in the right direction.

 

[PJ-Hunter]

12,000 for windows
-1500 tax credit
-5,000 - the cost of doing nothing with your old windows over 10 years in utility bills.
-5,500 in added value to the home.

Now you can see why people are buying something that they need anyway. In the long run, they are essentially free. You just have to have the money upfront.

Wish I had it, I sure could use good ones.

Uhh, no it's not
http://www.businessweek.com/news/20...s-9-6-in-third-quarter-from-year-earlier.html

They are still growing but it is slowing down a lot, their inflation is growing and flags are starting to be thrown up.

What China must face is they need the U.S. economy. If we do bad, they will eventually do bad as well. We just consume too much from them. Add that to the fact that they adjust their Yen to our dollar in ways that are almost illegal and will eventually burn themselves.


The next two years in the U.S. should be good. S&P should rise, DOW should gain. Historically coming out of a mid-term election with a split in power, history has shown that we will grow and profit. Probably won't eliminate the losses but it will head in the right direction.

Still growing, thats better than what the US is doing right now. But they are buying our product as fast as we can make it. When the USA pulls out of the slump, we will have to double our production. That is why Climax is slated to open in 2012.

 

[backcountryislife]

They are printing money and will do so until the nation comes out this. Like it or not it is a form of stimulus and a tax increase at the same time. the fed chair calls it que2. very complicated. Some say they should have done more stimulus, most of what has been done has been paid pack.

QE2, quantitative easing, Funny, a few different sites I looked at for explanations yesterday had this one word for word... thieves.


here's a slightly wordy descrip. from online


is a monetary policy used by some central banks to increase the supply of money by increasing the excess reserves of the banking system, generally through buying of the central government's own bonds to stabilize or raise their prices and thereby lower long-term interest rates. This policy is usually invoked when the normal methods to control the money supply have failed, i.e the bank interest rate, discount rate and/or interbank interest rate are either at, or close to, zero. It has been termed the electronic equivalent of simply printing legal tender.[1]

A central bank implements quantitative easing by first crediting its own account with money it creates ex nihilo ("out of nothing").[2] It then purchases financial assets, including government bonds, agency debt, mortgage-backed securities and corporate bonds, from banks and other financial institutions in a process referred to as open market operations. The purchases, by way of account deposits, give banks the excess reserves required for them to create new money, and thus hopefully induce a stimulation of the economy, by the process of deposit multiplication from increased lending in the fractional reserve banking system.

Risks include the policy being more effective than intended, spurring hyperinflation, or the risk of not being effective enough, if banks opt simply to sit on the additional cash in order to increase their capital reserves in a climate of increasing defaults in their present loan portfolio.[2]

"Quantitative" refers to the fact that a specific quantity of money is being created; "easing" refers to reducing the pressure on banks.[3] However, another explanation is that the name comes from the Japanese-language expression for "stimulatory monetary policy", which uses the term "easing".[4] Quantitative easing is sometimes colloquially described as "printing money" although in reality the money is simply shifted from member bank dollar deposits to financial instruments.[5] Examples of economies where this policy has been used include Japan during the early 2000s, and the United States, the United Kingdom and the Eurozone during the global financial crisis of 2008–the present, since the programme is suitable for economies where the bank interest rate, discount rate and/or interbank interest rate are either at, or close to, zero

People are concerned about "runaway" inflation with this policy, as a primary concern, but the reality right now is we're barely running above deflation, a couple points of inflation would be a good thing for us right now. Obviously dollar value for imports drops, but the drop in dollar value may help MFG with exports (IE: how China keeps their currency low to spur demand for exports).

It's no magic bullet, but the downsides themselves have some upside in reality.

Being SLIGHTLY less than an economic mensa member, I'm sure there's some more downsides that I'm missing here though.

 

[milehighassassin]

Wish I had it, I sure could use good ones.




Still growing, thats better than what the US is doing right now. But they are buying our product as fast as we can make it. When the USA pulls out of the slump, we will have to double our production. That is why Climax is slated to open in 2012.

What are you talking about? U.S. is actually growing right now. 2% growth I think.

Climax has been open for years.

 

[colorado logger]

This is terrific you guys, we can have an adult conversation. About issues that make a difference. I apologize, kinda busy ( going wheeling tomorrow ).

This is some good discussion in these pages.

logger

 

[backcountryislife]

What are you talking about? U.S. is actually growing right now. 2% growth I think.

Climax has been open for years.

I believe he's talking about the other climax mine. Technically it's "open", but it was slated for some construction right before the crash, then the project got tabled. The project, and the following return to production is slated to roll back online in 2012.

 

[PJ-Hunter]

What are you talking about? U.S. is actually growing right now. 2% growth I think.

Climax has been open for years.

Nope. Climax has been closed for years. The place has been wiped and is being reconstructed with state of the art production facilities.

Now, Henderson (Empire and Ute Pass) has been open since 1977 running everyday.

 

[milehighassassin]

Climax has been running a Skeleton crew for a long time now. I know several people that work there.