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SNOWEST SEARCH AND RESCUE SECTION???

I think some of you are getting away from the intent of m8's thread.
I don't think this is about having an alert section for when someone gets lost.
It doesn't happen every day. If there's an emergency, 1 thread on General Snowmobiling will suffice. That will happen anyway.
I think its about having access to people who know the area.
Not good to put phone #'s out there online (I don't care, company phone, dont get too many calls from Nigeria on it anyway:face-icon-small-con), but my suggestion would be to just have a sticky thread on each state's forum.

Folks could post up some sort of contact info, phone, email, whatever and the areas they are most familiar with or near to.
Then if shtf for someone, their wife, buddy, who ever gets word can pop on here and find some peeps to round up and go search.

I understand the concern of sending more people into a bad situation, but lets remember like I posted in the WA thread. Not all the SAR scenarios involve extreme whiteout conditions and blizzards. Many are breakdowns, injuries, or just plain effin lost.
There isnt going to be any liability on SW's part. People that choose to go out do so of their own volition. They are not employees of any organization responsible for the safety of the people needing rescued.

Is it fool proof? No. But neither is an organized search lead by the SHerrifs dept. Case in point with the WA sledders. Guys that knew the area said there was a better way to get to the victims, but they were not contacted or fed the correct info.
Its merely a way to help someone get off the hill quicker.
i think youre on to something.a thread for each state that has names and numbers of those locals in the area and what country they are familiar with.i dont see any liability issues there.plus a phone call is faster than waiting for a guy to get off work pop a beer and warm up his computer.any prank calls on a thread like that would be means for castration.great idea az 800!!!!!
 
Right, but groups go out on their own all the time with the possibility of getting lost, hurt or some other misfortune. This is no different other than the group is going for a ride for a specific reason that day.

If I'm upside down in a tree well with a broken leg and a smoked sled I want a couple gruops of guys who can roll up to the snopark, unload and head out before the sop's and protocals of a sherrif's led search begins.

I'm selfish that way! But I'd do the same for others and have.
Sometimes time is of the essence, unlike the GW folks. They were uninjured, had food, water and a snowcave. Went out once on an avi rescue. Up on top of Grand Mesa at the tail end of a storm that dropped 5' in about 30hrs. Road was fricking closed. Noone gettin up there from the valley. Only people were those that were staying at the lodge.
3 sleds breakin trail on a road. Sled 1 trips a slide, sled 2 and rider get buried. Sled 3 drives through unsur of what jsut happened until he figures out it's a debris field. (Luckily sled 3 ran over guy 2's head and partially un-buried him). Sled 1 hauls but back to the lodge, leaves # 3 with #2 who may or may not be injured, but is definately in shock. Not sure how sled 1 even made it back by himself cuz I was playin leapfrog with guys that were better riders than I going back in.
All ended well, but guy #2 was in shock and hypothermic by the time we got back there, less than an hour. Got him warmed up and out of there. Just lucky that there was so d@mn much snow that the group I was with had just come back in and said eff it, it's too deep.
Yeah in this case, no texts would have gone out anyway, but for sure the guy who'd been buried would not have done well if not for teh "unofficial" SAR team.

I just think the right people should be directly informed. In this forum there are the pros and the joes. I'd obviously be a joe and while I would go out with the good intention of helping I would probably do more harm than good. Luckily for you all I am well aware of my capabilities/inabilities. The real question is can you say the same for everyone else?

Again, I am totally for it and I think it is an excellent idea. I just think the experienced people should be the ones doing the whole big group effort thing and have all the information out on the net and if others want to try to help they can do so at their own discretion.
 
I just think the right people should be directly informed. In this forum there are the pros and the joes. I'd obviously be a joe and while I would go out with the good intention of helping I would probably do more harm than good. Luckily for you all I am well aware of my capabilities/inabilities. The real question is can you say the same for everyone else?

Again, I am totally for it and I think it is an excellent idea. I just think the experienced people should be the ones doing the whole big group effort thing and have all the information out on the net and if others want to try to help they can do so at their own discretion.
im not saying at all that im a pro and dont ride with any pros.but im a local that rides with locals in the sw san juan mts. in colorado.i feel confident that the people i ride with know our riding areas better than s&r because we ride it all the time.now let me clarify that im talking about a snowmobile rescue.i truley feel that a chopper is definetly the faster and safer way to go.also i dont think that if this idea we are talking about happens, that it will be used all the time or ever.but like the situation in washington, guys posted that they could have been there in less than 2 hours and knew exactley where the couple was and how to get there but no way to be notified.my.02
 
also i think i posted this thread on the wrong section.not that i dont like fouled plug but would probly get more attention on deep powder or general.
 
im not saying at all that im a pro and dont ride with any pros.but im a local that rides with locals in the sw san juan mts. in colorado.i feel confident that the people i ride with know our riding areas better than s&r because we ride it all the time.now let me clarify that im talking about a snowmobile rescue.i truley feel that a chopper is definetly the faster and safer way to go.also i dont think that if this idea we are talking about happens, that it will be used all the time or ever.but like the situation in washington, guys posted that they could have been there in less than 2 hours and knew exactley where the couple was and how to get there but no way to be notified.my.02

PM Sent.
 
I can only speak for my local area. The sheriffs office is ultimately in charge of all searches. Locally they do not have a search team, but rely on a volunteer search group from the other side of the county. Of course individuals can go out and search, but communications is the single most important aspect of a search. Also some coordination is a must... Lots of people want to help, but dont want to be told where and how to search. So overlapping aspects of a coordinated effort can leave holes in a search, or put too much resources in a concentrated area, instead of searching a wider range of a grid. What you end up with is too many chiefs and not enough indians. There shouldnt be politics in search and rescue, but unfortunately that is the case. I encourage people to join their local search and rescue organization, and participate in trainings.
Its pretty easy to critique different groups, but until you walk in their shoes, or step up,.... well you get the point.
 
I am a part of my local snowmobile club. We have a S&R group of those who are willing to help when needed. We have been called by the Sheriffs S&R a couple of times for assitance. When this happens I get a phone call from my club leader putting me on call. Then I get a call later to ether back down or saying we need help if so I am on my way. When we get up there we are directed by the Sheriff's S&R on what info we need and where they want us to go. They are in charge and want to know who is out there and were they are going so they can make sure it does not turn into another S&R. At this point we have the chance to offer any useful information.

So I guess what I am saying is leave it to those that are organized to do this. If you do not feel your area has an capable S&R crew. Step up and join and make it better.
 
i'm in. we are all adults here, i think some people are thinking if a group of guys get together to do a search it will be like a saturday afternoon tearing up a hillside..guys that know an area looking for a group or a single person will be on a mission to find them and keep the search group together and safe. we all take risk everytime we ride. i for one would hope the guys ive met or that knew the area would come looking for me if i was in a bad spot.
 
i'm in. we are all adults here, i think some people are thinking if a group of guys get together to do a search it will be like a saturday afternoon tearing up a hillside..guys that know an area looking for a group or a single person will be on a mission to find them and keep the search group together and safe. we all take risk everytime we ride. i for one would hope the guys ive met or that knew the area would come looking for me if i was in a bad spot.

That's what I'm talking about. I don't see the unofficial search team getting in trouble in most cases. A group can help each other out. You rarely hear of a large group needing rescued. Usually 1 or 2 people only even though alot of people ride as groups.
I can see the other side of the coin though and respect that. I'm no pro (like to think I'm not a Joe either ). Only been on a couple searches or rescues too and the one I described above we actually thought we had to rescue a couple from our rescue group. Had about 8 guys going out. We were very organized, head counts each time we stopped etc, was snowing hard and close to 5' of fresh. The last part of the run no head counts as it was single track and we were leap frogging the lead sled when he'd get stuck.
Once we got there realized we were short 2 riders. Turned out they both were at the back of the pack and got stuck (7&8 thru the pow so had a good trail broke) and then turned around and went back to lodge! We didn't know where they were thought they had got sideways or lost. Didn't look for them at first cuz we were getting the victim and a smashed up sled out. Got back to the lodge and they were inside havin a beer! W t f?
That's why I can see both sides of the story.
 
My side is that IF you get your own group of guys to go search. How do you know when to stop searching?

Say you hear on the 5pm news riders are missing. You and a buddy go up on your own. No communication with S&R. S&R could find them at 5:30 pm. (Just after you leave your house) You get to the parking lot that you want to leave from at 6 pm. How do you know they are found. You could go ride around for 3 hours for no reason. But now you and your buddy are indanger because chances are the weather in not good. Thus the reason S&R is out in the first place. Weather is not always the reason but more often then not it plays a part.

But if you are part of S&R by the time you got to the parking lot you would be informed all is okay. And you could return back home. But if they have not found them when you get there. They will send you out. When you are part of the S&R you should have contact every so often to update if information changes.

And just in case you dicide I will just to the same parking lot that S&R is running out of. On all the S&R I have been on. If your are not part of the S&R group you are not allowed to ride out to that parking lot.

I admit it is not 100% perfect but you must understand there are alot of great that show up and want to help. But there also are idiots that make things alot worse as well.
 
My side is that IF you get your own group of guys to go search. How do you know when to stop searching?

Say you hear on the 5pm news riders are missing. You and a buddy go up on your own. No communication with S&R. S&R could find them at 5:30 pm. (Just after you leave your house) You get to the parking lot that you want to leave from at 6 pm. How do you know they are found. You could go ride around for 3 hours for no reason. But now you and your buddy are indanger because chances are the weather in not good. Thus the reason S&R is out in the first place. Weather is not always the reason but more often then not it plays a part.

But if you are part of S&R by the time you got to the parking lot you would be informed all is okay. And you could return back home. But if they have not found them when you get there. They will send you out. When you are part of the S&R you should have contact every so often to update if information changes.

And just in case you dicide I will just to the same parking lot that S&R is running out of. On all the S&R I have been on. If your are not part of the S&R group you are not allowed to ride out to that parking lot.

I admit it is not 100% perfect but you must understand there are alot of great that show up and want to help. But there also are idiots that make things alot worse as well.
the whole idea i had when starting this thread was for an instance like in washington where s&r was di*kin the dog and didnt really know where they were going.then someone in touch with the people needing rescue could throw out a cry for help to some local boondockers on snowest and not have to wait 2 nites to get rescued.just sayin
 
the whole idea i had when starting this thread was for an instance like in washington where s&r was di*kin the dog and didnt really know where they were going.then someone in touch with the people needing rescue could throw out a cry for help to some local boondockers on snowest and not have to wait 2 nites to get rescued.just sayin

I do understand what you are saying. I do like the idea I just want to make sure people do not just jump off the handle and head up the mountain with out a game plan. So their good intensions and effort are put to good use. So EVERYONE can home safe and as soon as possible.

Your example is exactly why me snowmobile club gets involved. We get called when S&R is confused on how to get around in the area they want to search. I will admit our S&R try but they are not as experianced sledders as most of the guys I ride with. They are mostly state employees that are trained in S&R for year round not just winter time. Most of the time if you were to show up and offer help S&R will probably put you to work in a group with at least one of their own members.

I will be honest. IF I was late getting home from riding. My dad would be the first person my wife would call. He would round up a group and they would come and find me. Before S&R was even called.
 
My side is that IF you get your own group of guys to go search. How do you know when

we have had this same thing happen to us. now we ride and check in when we get cell service, seems now days you can find service hit and miss in most areas. if no service a text message can be recieved while you ride if you have some one back home trying to keep you informed. this method is not fool proof by any means though. if someone is in need on the mountain the more peope looking for them the better their chances. when i go ride i am sure i am more prepared to spend the night in the mountains then most that we are looking for.
 
http://www.dailyinterlake.com/news/local_montana/article_4aeaa288-57ad-5e53-93ac-45b2e5a4a833.html

The story has a few points that are not correct but you will get the idea.
The S&R never did show up at the scene.
They threatened anyone not in there group who wanted to go.
Their plan was to wait until daylight as he was known to be buried for up to 3 hours, "written off".

and this isn't the first experience I've had with threats from s&r about crossing their lines in the snow.

But without a doubt there must be some very good people who are in these groups.

Our rule is if i don't come home from sledding my wife can call friends but wait 48 hours before calling s&r unless there are kids involved. If I can't figure my way out in 48 hours then i most likely never will, go ahead and call em.
 
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