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Lutherans to allow sexually active gays as clergy

m8magicandmystery said:
then simply none are the church of God or Jesus,only one word and one truth,and its the Bible..you change it...you burn...its that simple
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So.....if you marry a woman who isn't a virgin, you can stone her to death?? Sweet.....gotta love the literal acceptance of the Bible....


This is why I'm not a Christian...too much bureaucracy. How can anyone know the truth if throughout history, the bible has been compromised, translated, changed? This is why I don't subscribe to religion. No one can know, and we won't know until we die.

Let the red rep fly boys, I'm waiting.
 
luvtoride said:
So.....if you marry a woman who isn't a virgin, you can stone her to death?? Sweet.....gotta love the literal acceptance of the Bible....


This is why I'm not a Christian...too much bureaucracy. How can anyone know the truth if throughout history, the bible has been compromised, translated, changed? This is why I don't subscribe to religion. No one can know, and we won't know until we die.

Let the red rep fly boys, I'm waiting.
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I can't stand the religion thing either....but a personal relationship with Jesus is another matter....Bureaucracy has always been the problem when man interferes with the written word of God. That's why faith is believing without knowing....Would you consider becoming a disciple of Jesus instead of a Christian?
 
luvtoride said:
So.....if you marry a woman who isn't a virgin, you can stone her to death?? Sweet.....gotta love the literal acceptance of the Bible....


This is why I'm not a Christian...too much bureaucracy. How can anyone know the truth if throughout history, the bible has been compromised, translated, changed? This is why I don't subscribe to religion. No one can know, and we won't know until we die.

Let the red rep fly boys, I'm waiting.
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No red rep for speaking your opinion.

You can only really know by the means of revelation. Personal revelation to confirm any truths or beliefs. I believe that there continues to be revelation and truths revealed to a living prophet. I only know this because of personal revelation confirming this. Not trying to force my views on anyone, but just stating what I believe.
 
mtnpull said:
No red rep for speaking your opinion.

You can only really know by the means of revelation. Personal revelation to confirm any truths or beliefs. I believe that there continues to be revelation and truths revealed to a living prophet. I only know this because of personal revelation confirming this. Not trying to force my views on anyone, but just stating what I believe.
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I respect your opinion as you've obviously respected mine. I just don't believe in personal revelation. As far as revelations go, my most significant was realizing I needed to change my golf grip to ease my slice. I think the placebo effect has a lot to do with faith and revelation in general.

But once again, that's my opinion and MANY people disagree with it.
 
defysgravity said:
I can't stand the religion thing either....but a personal relationship with Jesus is another matter....Bureaucracy has always been the problem when man interferes with the written word of God. That's why faith is believing without knowing....Would you consider becoming a disciple of Jesus instead of a Christian?
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Not really, I believe whatever miracles Jesus may or may not have created have been so distorted by historians and pagan empires that they may or may not have even happened. I just can't put any faith in chance, (although I do gamble a bunch).
 
luvtoride said:
So.....if you marry a woman who isn't a virgin, you can stone her to death?? Sweet.....gotta love the literal acceptance of the Bible....


This is why I'm not a Christian...too much bureaucracy. How can anyone know the truth if throughout history, the bible has been compromised, translated, changed? This is why I don't subscribe to religion. No one can know, and we won't know until we die.

Let the red rep fly boys, I'm waiting.
Click to expand...

This is why Lutheran Ministers, at least Missouri Synod(not sure about the others) are required to learn Greek and Hebrew, and have masters degrees in divinity(not the candy!). They are highly educated to be able to read and understand scripture as it was originally written. There is a lot lost in translation, that is why they are required to read and understand these languages. Without this understanding you would have a hard time teaching others about it. And there are not many religions that require their clergy be so highly educated.
 
Why would anyone be surprised by this?Churches are nothing more than money machines.They change with the times in order to keep the cash flowing in.That is their main purpose.
In every religion the churches revolve around one thing "CASH".
They need money for buildings,outreach,salaries and such.God is secondary.God is for people,money is for churches.
I've never been to a church that didn't want money.Sure they try to pretty it up and call it tything or passing around the plate but the truth is they want cash!
The lutherans are just going with the flow.Look at the change in "moral" standards in the last 60 years.Morals have been swirling around the bowl more and more.Many people still have them but they are getting fewer all the time.
Less people =less cash.They must compromise to stay in business.
 
luvtoride said:
Not really, I believe whatever miracles Jesus may or may not have created have been so distorted by historians and pagan empires that they may or may not have even happened. I just can't put any faith in chance, (although I do gamble a bunch).
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Interesting...I'm just curious as to your answer....kinda helps me to understand why a non believer believes in what he believes.
Why and how do you come to the above conclusion of distortion....?
If you could read the original manuscripts, would you believe....?
And did you know Christ said his miracles alone would not create believers out of non believers....
Just curious, lovtoride....discussion, not an argument. Besides...I believe it's not my job to convince you of anything....
 
Look at it, not in terms of religion, but in all information of the time. People are convinced that texts explaining a 2000 year old carpenter/human/god are the truth. Yet, writings from the Egyptians, summerians, Mayan, babylonians, Greeks, Romans, native Americans, and every other culture whom was advanced in sciences and mathematics are shunned as blasphemy. Why? What makes the writings of the Q'ran and the beliefs of the Jews inferior to your beliefs? That's why I'm not into religions, I'd rather sit back and watch.
 
luvtoride said:
So.....if you marry a woman who isn't a virgin, you can stone her to death?? Sweet.....gotta love the literal acceptance of the Bible....


This is why I'm not a Christian...too much bureaucracy. How can anyone know the truth if throughout history, the bible has been compromised, translated, changed? This is why I don't subscribe to religion. No one can know, and we won't know until we die.

Let the red rep fly boys, I'm waiting.
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Well actually you strengthen the idea of the loving Grace of God…..He saves many of us DESPITE of our sins…..a true Christian is a state we try to reach…….we don,t though...we fail daily...when saved we are Saints...our life long walk with Christ if only followed without error...then we would be truly a Christian...but like you say...there is failings,and many …and we will be judged...thats why we stand before God with tears and a knashing of teeth...but thankful we were saved...but what we have here that I refer to is what a so called church (Lucifers dens) does sometimes is outright blasphemy...outright spitting in the face of God.,,,.God can and will be wrathful and unforgiving…..i need not say more as future events will be your teacher..Lucifer works with 95 percent truth..thats why he fools,… many think they are on the path with his words...his deception works…,that why the path is to quote "narrow is the way"..you won;t get red from me,..or disrespect…,you just strengthen the Bible and the thankfulness i have for the Grace of God….and rest easy...the girlfriends or daughters and wifes will not be stoned...there is forgiveness..but if no forgiveness prayed for or Jesus believed in….. stoning is the least of anyones worrys when hell awaits isn;t it..??
 
luvtoride said:
Look at it, not in terms of religion, but in all information of the time. People are convinced that texts explaining a 2000 year old carpenter/human/god are the truth. Yet, writings from the Egyptians, summerians, Mayan, babylonians, Greeks, Romans, native Americans, and every other culture whom was advanced in sciences and mathematics are shunned as blasphemy. Why? What makes the writings of the Q'ran and the beliefs of the Jews inferior to your beliefs? That's why I'm not into religions, I'd rather sit back and watch.
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well Christianity is the only one that has had live human witnesses as well as the written text...and Jesus was the only one to claim He was the Son Of The Father...and religion goes upwards with members reaching up and out to God with Christianity being the only faith that moves downward with God reaching down to his chosen with His Grace
 
and when water is one of the very few substances that when frozen the solid mass is lighter then the liquid...therefore protecting oxygen and aquatic life...well i just think someone thought of that little detail ...and it wasn;t two monkeys
 
Don't get me wrong, I have no problem with the idea of a god, or higher power. I'm a Deist, www.deism.com, I just don't think any mainstream religion is a path to god. I just think you should live life to it's fullest without worry of damnation or something like that.

Patton Oswalt said it best in his special. Religion was invented by the weak. The big tough guys were going around kicking *** and the weak guy was next. He said "if you don't kill me, and be nice the rest of your life, you'll die and go to a city in the clouds and eat cake" the big dumb guy says, I like cake. BAM, religion is born.
 
defysgravity said:
I can't stand the religion thing either....but a personal relationship with Jesus is another matter....Bureaucracy has always been the problem when man interferes with the written word of God. That's why faith is believing without knowing....Would you consider becoming a disciple of Jesus instead of a Christian?
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man this guy is good!!!

Relgion sucks big balls, always has always will.

My good friend and preacher once put it like this.

"Religion, I don't do religion. All that is is a bunch of rules and do this don't do that crap. Who want's to be told what to do? Not me. I choose to have a RELATIONSHIP with the Lord God. Nobody in a suit, etc telling me what to do, etc. Just reading Gods word and talking things over with him."

That's what I go for and I love it. I tried "Religion", then I strayed away and did my own thing. Now I'm back in the fold doing the Relationship deal and it's great.
 
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