ho head on m8
- Thread starter w2bridin
- Start date
M
mynewuseddoo
Well-known member
Dogmeat, call michelle (freeagent) or any other dealers or just put a shout out for an HO head. I got one for a hundred bucks.
Ok, well .... got the 2010 HO head on and the BD timing key installed .... turns out we had 3' of pow today north of Vernal 
My goal for this was to put the HO head on then the BD timing key on and basically leave everything else the same, with the idea being that the HO head would crispen up the throttle response on the low-midrange end and the top end would be roughly the same, all on 91 pump gas.
Observations:
1.) This head cleaned up the low-mid range for sure. Much crisper with this head. I ran straight 91 ethanol pump gas on it today @ 8 psi. Getting this sled dialed in with this head and th BD turbo pipe, its gonna be a pretty good running machine. It did not clean the sputter up just off idle, but thats pretty much inherent to any turbo from what I can tell. Either way, as far as crisping up the throttle, very good.
2.) I started out with the BD 3 deg key, and in wide open meadows and pow over my hood, I was definatley down on top end power. Using the same fuel settings as before, my EGT's were like 100 less and I was probably 500 rpm lower than where it should have been. Adjusted the fuel to bring my EGT's back to ~1200 F, but still down on R's. Perhaps on a pump gas kit, the 3 deg key is too much without a significant increase in boost?
3.) Trying to pop up a little hill coming out of a ditch WOT with about 4' of pow, I high centered the sled on a stump then wrapped the front right ski around a small tree .... needless to say, I came to a screeching hault. Pulled the sled back, wouldn't start. We had to let it sit there for about 20 minutes before it finally started and I could drive off. As a result of this, I thought the BD timing key might have been causing an issue, so I took it out. Still didn't start, but I didn't put it back in for the rest of the ride. I was sort of babying it the rest of the afternoon, but by removing it my top end performance picked up and didn't appear to be hitting my det sensor at WOT ...... Has anyone else run this head without the timing key? I'm sort of thinking you might not need it, or at least not the 3 deg key .....
4.) I need more venting ..... blower pow like that and WOT makes this sled build a lot of heat. I thought my current vent scheme of side vents and cowl vents would cut it, but I guess not.....I think thats why it wouldn't start back up, it was just so hot it wouldn't fire.
5.) I noticed my coolent temps were ~25 F hotter with this head than with the stock 09' head, even jut putzing down the trail. In fresh snow putzing own the trail this sled is typically ~120 F, it wanted to hover arond ~145 F today ..... not a crisis, but it does seem to me like its running hotter with the HO head than before..... perhaps mix a gallon or two of race gas and see if it cools it down?
Anyways, I was riding like 8300-9500 feet today, 8-8.5 psi ....
Post up your setups with these, lets get them dialed in
My goal for this was to put the HO head on then the BD timing key on and basically leave everything else the same, with the idea being that the HO head would crispen up the throttle response on the low-midrange end and the top end would be roughly the same, all on 91 pump gas.
Observations:
1.) This head cleaned up the low-mid range for sure. Much crisper with this head. I ran straight 91 ethanol pump gas on it today @ 8 psi. Getting this sled dialed in with this head and th BD turbo pipe, its gonna be a pretty good running machine. It did not clean the sputter up just off idle, but thats pretty much inherent to any turbo from what I can tell. Either way, as far as crisping up the throttle, very good.
2.) I started out with the BD 3 deg key, and in wide open meadows and pow over my hood, I was definatley down on top end power. Using the same fuel settings as before, my EGT's were like 100 less and I was probably 500 rpm lower than where it should have been. Adjusted the fuel to bring my EGT's back to ~1200 F, but still down on R's. Perhaps on a pump gas kit, the 3 deg key is too much without a significant increase in boost?
3.) Trying to pop up a little hill coming out of a ditch WOT with about 4' of pow, I high centered the sled on a stump then wrapped the front right ski around a small tree .... needless to say, I came to a screeching hault. Pulled the sled back, wouldn't start. We had to let it sit there for about 20 minutes before it finally started and I could drive off. As a result of this, I thought the BD timing key might have been causing an issue, so I took it out. Still didn't start, but I didn't put it back in for the rest of the ride. I was sort of babying it the rest of the afternoon, but by removing it my top end performance picked up and didn't appear to be hitting my det sensor at WOT ...... Has anyone else run this head without the timing key? I'm sort of thinking you might not need it, or at least not the 3 deg key .....
4.) I need more venting ..... blower pow like that and WOT makes this sled build a lot of heat. I thought my current vent scheme of side vents and cowl vents would cut it, but I guess not.....I think thats why it wouldn't start back up, it was just so hot it wouldn't fire.
5.) I noticed my coolent temps were ~25 F hotter with this head than with the stock 09' head, even jut putzing down the trail. In fresh snow putzing own the trail this sled is typically ~120 F, it wanted to hover arond ~145 F today ..... not a crisis, but it does seem to me like its running hotter with the HO head than before..... perhaps mix a gallon or two of race gas and see if it cools it down?
Anyways, I was riding like 8300-9500 feet today, 8-8.5 psi ....
Post up your setups with these, lets get them dialed in
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S
Snopro_69
Well-known member
proclimb 800.....stock head with the CPC stage 2... running no timing and just breaking it in so ran 8-8.5 pounds on straight AV with no problems...could prob push 12 im thinkin at 6k or higher....Hit the det sensor once but was at 5000 elev and didnt have enough weight in at start so RPMS were screaming....hoping to get alot more testing in next couple weekends... Thinking im not even goin to get turbo cut head unless we get a bunch of snow here (2100FT)... Didnt seem to have any bog and I was running it on the rich side in all ranges
M
mynewuseddoo
Well-known member
Fantastic post dogmeat! Thanks!
100% AV 100LL, 10-12 psi boost, 6000+ feet, 8050 rpm, try to keep my egt at around 1170*F @ WOT, afr @ 11.9
Has anyone been checking their plugs and/or piston tops for signs of detonation?
100% AV 100LL, 10-12 psi boost, 6000+ feet, 8050 rpm, try to keep my egt at around 1170*F @ WOT, afr @ 11.9
Has anyone been checking their plugs and/or piston tops for signs of detonation?
im runnig a 07 M8T boondocker rg..round 9# with 110 .. i have only rode it 3 times .. its done some wierd stuff at wot climbs but i have never seen anything as far a det sensor.. what comes up on gauge or what does it do when it detonates...i had a M1000 before this sled so non on it ... need to know what to look for
My whole goal for this was to run whatever level of boost I need to hit 8100-8200 RPM WOT, crisp up the low-mid range and still be able to run pump 91 octane in it. I don't wanna mess with race gas .... want throttle response more than anything, not so much top end gains, but I don't want to lose anything I had on the top end either.
I generally don't ride below 8,000 feet, so I figured this would probably work ....
IDK though, I figured with the 2010 HO head I'd have to have the timing key though as you run whatever level of boost it takes to basically spin up to your clutch specs ....
Anyone have any ideas on why the sled was running hotter than usual?
I generally don't ride below 8,000 feet, so I figured this would probably work ....
IDK though, I figured with the 2010 HO head I'd have to have the timing key though as you run whatever level of boost it takes to basically spin up to your clutch specs ....
Anyone have any ideas on why the sled was running hotter than usual?
M
mynewuseddoo
Well-known member
More compression = more heat.
M
mynewuseddoo
Well-known member
I run my cutler 80-90 gram adjustables @ 86 or 87 grams. It runs about 8050 rpm. Basically the heal loaded right up, tips empty.
S
snobyrd
Well-known member
ok, ive tighten the sensor and got the newest reflash and no more det code with 50/50 av/91. so with all the conversation here, do you guys think i can put on 11 head and get away with runnin max 100ll at 4500' on a pg kit. acutually the 100ll is 105 acording to my supplier. i boondok lots and im lookin for throttle responce, cause rite now my bottom end is bad with a bog.
i alos dont want to use a t key, with the new programing aparently cat took away timming on top end.
any thoughts
tks
i alos dont want to use a t key, with the new programing aparently cat took away timming on top end.
any thoughts
tks
snobyrd I would say yes. Last year I was running straight 100LL with a 2010 ho head at 8 psi. I was running a 2* timmimg key but I was olso running a lot lower than you (800ft).
Now this year I am trying a different timming trick not BD but close and I have run up to 10 psi at 800ft with the 2010 ho head on 50/50 100LL and 87 octane not signs of det.
The answer to your question I would say yes no problem at 4500' up to 7 or maybe 8 psi from my observations.
Now this year I am trying a different timming trick not BD but close and I have run up to 10 psi at 800ft with the 2010 ho head on 50/50 100LL and 87 octane not signs of det.
The answer to your question I would say yes no problem at 4500' up to 7 or maybe 8 psi from my observations.
S
snobyrd
Well-known member
Ok that sounds good, I'm gonna swap it out and also hoppin that my low end boooog will go with that ovs/simmions head.
Tks
Ok, follow my thought pattern here ...
1.) Install 3 deg timing, 2010 HO head.
2.) Same fuel settings as before, straight 91 pump gas
3.) Low-Mid range big improvement, WOT lost a lot of power
4.) EGT's were ~100-125 F lower @ WOT than before
.... Could I have been detonating? Wouldn't detonation cause your EGT's to read lower due to incomplete combustion?
What happens when that 'det sensor' goes off, does it flash an idiot light on your dash?
I'm almost wondering if the reason my coolent temps were higher was because of detonation, but if detonation makes EGT's lower wouldn't that in turn lower coolent temp ...? ...edit: guess not.
1.) Install 3 deg timing, 2010 HO head.
2.) Same fuel settings as before, straight 91 pump gas
3.) Low-Mid range big improvement, WOT lost a lot of power
4.) EGT's were ~100-125 F lower @ WOT than before
.... Could I have been detonating? Wouldn't detonation cause your EGT's to read lower due to incomplete combustion?
What happens when that 'det sensor' goes off, does it flash an idiot light on your dash?
I'm almost wondering if the reason my coolent temps were higher was because of detonation, but if detonation makes EGT's lower wouldn't that in turn lower coolent temp ...? ...edit: guess not.
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http://www.contactmagazine.com/Issue54/EngineBasics.html
Hmmm..........
I'm thinking I might put my 09' head on just to be on the safe side.
I guess theoretically I could run 100 octane fuel on the same fuel settings and everything and see if the problem persists?
Hmmm..........
I'm thinking I might put my 09' head on just to be on the safe side.
I guess theoretically I could run 100 octane fuel on the same fuel settings and everything and see if the problem persists?
S
snobyrd
Well-known member
I believe the timing key was the factor of lossin your top end, I thinking you'll have to remove the key and increase your octane and even than may have to lower your boost a tad, but than it should be a monster bottom to top, also the latest re flash from cat takes away abit of timing on top end to help prevent det, that's what I did
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