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Habervision: Say it ain't so.

PJ-Hunter

Paid Premium Member
Lifetime Membership
http://www.wild.org/

So this group wants to create more and more wilderness. They are partnered with Habervision. Haber is also teamed with sledding groups and several other "Green Movement" type groups.

I would like to understand how a company can rely on the sledding market for income and then partner up with a group that can potentially destroy what we all love to do.

I understand the environment and I have nothing against mitigation and protection. My problem is this: Alot of these groups are so extreme that common sense eludes them 99% of the time. Ie, Aron Ralston. Have you ever hiked or hunted deep in the backcountry where sledders usually hang out in the winter? I have. I have found some signs but I swear that I have found more signs of man on the side where the tree hugging skiers and snowshoers play. I have found beer cans, cigarette and doob butts, granola and candy wrappers, tinfoil, bottles, clothing, etc. Occasionally on the sledder side I see a tree that fell victim to a sledder, still alive but missing a branch or two (weather does more damage than a sled) and sometimes a broken piece of hood or windshield. Do ATVs and dirtbikes tear up soil more? Yeah, but it'll grow back. A few years ago when they had a hippy convention up by Steamboat Lake, aerial photographs were taken before and after. The after shots were sickening, and the damage was done by 1000s of "peace loving" hippies tramping around in sandals. I laugh at peace loving, during that 2-3 week period more violent and drug/alcolhol related crimes were increased.

Not meant to bash Haber, but more wanting to know WTF?
 
This is a hot topic that you can discuss for days and still have a lot of cloudy outcome.

Haber supports a group that is active in preserving wildlife throughout the world. I've been told that they are not active in wilderness support in Colorado and even the US (as far as I know). I am a member and support the Elk Foundation and Deer Foundation. They have members who are very pro wilderness, but the majority are more conservative in nature. Sounds like this movement is more of a world wide preservation group than a wilderness advocate. I know what the website title implies.

I've done a little work with some of the HaberVision people and I can tell you that they want to be more involved with the snowmobiling community. Yeah, it is a business for them, but the snowmobiling demographics are a small number compared to skiers yet they still cateer to the snowmobilers. They are sponsors of the Boondocker group and have reached out to some big names in the sledding community.

Take it for what it is worth, but I certainly don't link HaberVision directly to the Wildernesss BS that we are facing in Colorado (I'm not as familiar with it in other states). I can honestly tell you that I would not even wear HaberVision googles if I found out they were backing the same rouge groups that are pushing for wilderness.
 
Not meant to bash Haber, but more wanting to know WTF?


Not meaning to bash Haber? Then why don't you pick up the phone and call me or shoot me a PM prior to posting this? You had no problem shooting me a PM when you wanted HaberVision to donate to your ride, which we did by the way. You clearly investigated HaberVision's website to find who we support, but you don't read on Wild.org's site to see what they are about.

Then on top of that you go and post some Arron Roulston quote, propaganda?

First, Arron Roulston has NOTHING and I mean NOTHING to do with HaberVision, so why you used him in this thread, I am not sure. I don't know if he has anything to do with Wild Foundation or not.


Now to your question. Yes, HaberVision does support Wild.org

Wild.org is a group that is working to protect species habitat. To my knowledge and their website they are not working to create wilderness in Colorado, or even North America for that matter. They are currently working in the following areas:

http://www.wild.org/main/field-projects/



They do work to save Elephant and gorilla habitat areas. Think Rocky Mountain Elk foundation. Mostly stopping illegal hunting for their tusks/ivory as well as natural habitat areas for them.

I would say Wild.org does not support snowmobiling but I cannot find anything that say they are against it either. I am sure you can say this about several companies, Cabellas, Bass Pro, almost any outdoor sportsman's shop. I hunt, fish, hike, camp, etc. It is a very fine line you walk when you also snowmobile on who to and who not to support.

I don't want my riding areas closed down, but I also hate to see fishing and hunting habitat's destroyed. I suppose I am against developing (housing) of forest areas or habitat areas but then I also want to access them on my sled. There truly needs to be a designation in the middle somewhere that would protect our land from development (say I dunno ski areas) but still allow the people to access the land. Everyone (the general public) loves the word wilderness. They think butterfly's and bambi hopping through the woods. They assume if it is wilderness our forest will be protected from mining and clear cut forestry.

Hopefully this helped clear things up a little bit. HaberVision has shown that they are a Pro-snowmobile company in several ways including donating to the following and many more:

-CSA
-Utah Snowmobile Association
-Pink Ribbon Riders
-Ralph's Colorado Forum ride
-The Holy Cross Powder hounds (our local club)

This is a small list that I can think of off the top of my head. HaberVision is also partnered up with Boondockers.


If you have any questions please feel free to PM, call or e-mail me.
lanetrujillo@gmail.com
970-310-0779
 
Now to your question. Yes, HaberVision does support Wild.org

Wild.org is a group that is working to protect species habitat. To my knowledge and their website they are not working to create wilderness in Colorado, or even North America for that matter. They are currently working in the following areas:

http://www.wild.org/main/field-projects/

And right on the front page of Wild.Org "SUPPORTING WILDERNESS AREAS WORLDWIDE".

That says it all.

I will ABSOLUTLEY not be buying any Habervision products and I would urge everyone else to do the same.
 
Everyone (the general public) loves the word wilderness. They think butterfly's and bambi hopping through the woods. They assume if it is wilderness our forest will be protected from mining and clear cut forestry.

The "General Public" has ***NO CLUE*** what wilderness areas really are, mean, or how they come about. They just know it "sounds good" and gives them that warm fuzzy feeling inside.

And, you basically just admitted right there they support blanket one-size-fits all proposals to ban everyone from everything because they can't get it through their f*cking skulls recreating on public land DOES NOT equal commercial development of that land.

As I stated above, I will absolutley not buy any products from a company who supports groups like this whether or not they've donated to recreational groups or not.

It's a moot point if they're donating to wilderness advocacy groups and I'll be damned if that isn't what wild.org is.
 
This is never a good thing when a company has a large sled base income. But I'm sorry to say that there is a lot of this that goes on. Some times company's are not even aware of things like this. Or chose to look a the dollars and not the big picture. After all it is about the money, or is it ?
 
This is never a good thing when a company has a large sled base income. But I'm sorry to say that there is a lot of this that goes on. Some times company's are not even aware of things like this. Or chose to look a the dollars and not the big picture. After all it is about the money, or is it ?

I'm sure that's probably the case, but regardless, they aren't getting a dime out of me for anything they're selling if that money is going to go to wilderness advocacy groups.
 
This creates a whole new point to debate.
For every dollar donated to our enemies, how many dollars do our allies need to offset it?
 
As someone who works for a large corporation, I can tell you that a donation or "support" from a branch or a division does not mean the corporation approves or supports all things that an entity stands for/endorses/ or says....

It is becoming harder and harder for corporations to give money to anything for fear of things like this...

The power of the internet and social media can have a material impact on a large corporation all because someone said/heard/posted/overheard etc. And shared with someone who shared something not even close to what the facts or reality is...

Sadly calm heads rarely prevail on the net...and this is causing companies to limit who they give money to and what they will do philanthropically...
 
Lance,

I didn't call them a name, didn't call you a name. I asked a question, you answered it. From what I read they want Wilderness for 50% OF THE WORLD!

They aren't concentrating on us yet, give em time.

And IMO, hunting areas and wildlife habitat is more damaged by construction (IE, Beaver Creek, Arrowhead, Cordillera, all those big fancy empty houses and crap) than sledders and bikers. Habitat is more damaged by range maggots (sheep) and cattle.

And I didn't know about Wild.org when I asked for the donation. And I also said "Say it ain't so"
 
As someone who works for a large corporation, I can tell you that a donation or "support" from a branch or a division does not mean the corporation approves or supports all things that an entity stands for/endorses/ or says....

It is becoming harder and harder for corporations to give money to anything for fear of things like this...

The power of the internet and social media can have a material impact on a large corporation all because someone said/heard/posted/overheard etc. And shared with someone who shared something not even close to what the facts or reality is...

Sadly calm heads rarely prevail on the net...and this is causing companies to limit who they give money to and what they will do philanthropically...

Well said.
 
I am an avid snowmobiler and make numerous trips west each year from my home state of Nebraska. I am not against wilderness areas and I think you have to take things in prespective. I also hunt and I support having wilderness areas. I would not want to see those "turned over" to "non" wilderness uses. At the same time I do not want to see large portions of "multiple use areas" being re-designated wilderness. My wife and daughter both shot cow elk this past fall on "wilderness" land. I think it is a mistake to believe that a company or an individual who lends support of any kind to wilderness or wildlife organizations is necessarily anti sledding or other kinds of multiple use. This is about public land and respecting that people will use/enjoy public land in differing and diverse manners. It is important to respect and appreciate the "other" users if you want "them" to respect your choice and manner of public land usage. rickster
 
I'm sure that's probably the case, but regardless, they aren't getting a dime out of me for anything they're selling if that money is going to go to wilderness advocacy groups.

I share your passion Dogmeat. My point is that there are a lot of clubs with some sort of "affiliation" with those that would do in snowmobiling directly or indirectly. But don't be a hypocrite...make sure you don't support the following. And don't wear Klim because they use Gore-Tex.

3M
Addidas
Adidas
Aerial Boundaries
All Seasons Adventures
Alpen Glow Sports
AMAZON
Antlers At Vail
Atlas snow shoe
Avery Brewing
Babes in the Backcountry
Backcountry.com
Backpackers Pantry
Backpacking Lite
Backdoor Sports
Backwoods Equipment
Bank of America
Bent Gate
Big Agnes
Biodiversity Conservation Alliance
Black Diamond
Blue Water Network
Boise Coop
Brazos Walking Sticks
Brooks Range Mountineering
Burts Bees
Cabelas
Ceavco Audio/Visual
Chaco
Chis Case Photography
Chums
Camelback
Campmor
Chevy
Clif Bar
Cloudveil
Coleman
Columbia
Confluence Watersports
Coors
Croakies
Cross Country Skier Magazine
Dakine
Darn Tough
Deckers Outdoor Corporation
Dicks Sporting goods
Dillards
Dodge
Dominos pizza
Ducks unlimited
Duofold
Dyna Fit
Eagle Creek Travel Gear
ECO-X, Inc.
Ember Photo
EMS
Exum Mountain Guides
Eye
Fedex
Fetzer Winery
Five Ten
Fly Low
Ford
Free Heel and Wheel
Gaiam
Glenn Randall Photography
Go Lite
Google
Gore Enterprise Communications
Gore Tex
Gravity Sports
GU Energy Labs
Hellroaring Ski Adventures
Home depot
Horny Toad
HP
IBM
Ibex Outdoor Clothing
Icebreaker
Idaho Mountain Touring
International Mountain Biking Association
Jansport
Jetboil
Jughandle Hut
Kahtoola
Karhu
Katadyn
Keen
Kelty
Klean Kanteen
Larabar
La Sportiva
Leatherman
Levis
Little Moon Essentials
LL Bean
Loki Outerwear
Lost Trail Lodge
Lowepro
Mammut
Marmot
Men Journal
Merrell
Microsoft
MillerCoors
Montrail
Mount Rose Ski Resort
Mountainsmith
Mountain Equipment Co-op
Mountain Hardwear
Mountain Kakhis
Mountain Outfitters
Mountain Rider Alliance
MSR
Nalgene
Nantahala Outdoors
Nature conservancy
Nature Valley
New Balance
New Belgium Brewing/ Fat Tire Beer
NikWax
Nike
Nissan
North Cove Outfitters
Northern Lites Trading Co.
Off-Piste
OIA
Ortovox
Osprey Packs
Outdoor DIVAS
Outdoor Research
Patagonia
Payette Powder Guides
Pearl Izumi
Pfizer
Pheasants Forever
Pine Needle Mountaineering
Planet Explore
Point 6
Prana
Princeton Tec
Promo Shop, Inc.
Quaker oats
Red Mountain Pass Cabins
Red Wing Shoe Company
Reebok
REI
Rendevous Tours
River Sports Outfitters
Rock Creek Lodge
Rosemont Ventures, Inc
Ruff Wear
Rutabaga Paddlesports
Sara Lee
Sawtooth Mountain Guides
Sea To Summit
Scarpa
Scheels
Shrine Mountain Inn
Sierra Club
SIGG
Silver Peak Restaurant and Brewery
Skinny Skis
Snowshoe Magazine
Smartwool
Smith optics
Sorensens Resort
Sporthill
Starbucks Coffee
Sterling Rope
Summit Flags
Sun Valley Trekking
Swiss Army
The Alpine Experience
The Ascending Path
The Ascentials
The Coleman Company
The North Face
The Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation
The Software Ranch
The Snaz
The Sportsman Skii Haus
Teko Socks
Teva
Thermarest
Thule, inc.
Timberland
Timex
Trango
Tubbs Snowshoes
Turtle fur
Two Knobby Tires
U.S. Govt
Vasque
Velcro
VF Outdoor Inc
Vibram
Wanderlust Tours
Waypoint Outdoor
Whole Foods
White Wave Foods
Wigwam
Woolrich
Xcel Energy
Yakima
 
Lance,

I didn't call them a name, didn't call you a name. I asked a question, you answered it. From what I read they want Wilderness for 50% OF THE WORLD!

They aren't concentrating on us yet, give em time.

And IMO, hunting areas and wildlife habitat is more damaged by construction (IE, Beaver Creek, Arrowhead, Cordillera, all those big fancy empty houses and crap) than sledders and bikers. Habitat is more damaged by range maggots (sheep) and cattle.

And I didn't know about Wild.org when I asked for the donation. And I also said "Say it ain't so"

I think you have me mixed up with Lane.
 
Of everything you posted on the list, I have bought one pair of Columbia shoes in my life. I won't buy any more. Unfortunatley, no more Adidas for me either. I was unaware of that. Also, Gor-Tex has now apparently switched sides.

I realize what you're saying here, but, out of all those companies you listed ..

How many of them CLAIM to be pro-motoroized access and cater to the snowmobiler/ORV crowd? None that I can think of.

I think that is what the major issue here with Habervision donating to Wild.Org is.

Kinda playing both sides of the fence, right?

I share your passion Dogmeat. My point is that there are a lot of clubs with some sort of "affiliation" with those that would do in snowmobiling directly or indirectly. But don't be a hypocrite...make sure you don't support the following. And don't wear Klim because they use Gore-Tex.

3M
Addidas
Adidas
Aerial Boundaries
All Seasons Adventures
Alpen Glow Sports
AMAZON
Antlers At Vail
Atlas snow shoe
Avery Brewing
Babes in the Backcountry
Backcountry.com
Backpackers Pantry
Backpacking Lite
Backdoor Sports
Backwoods Equipment
Bank of America
Bent Gate
Big Agnes
Biodiversity Conservation Alliance
Black Diamond
Blue Water Network
Boise Coop
Brazos Walking Sticks
Brooks Range Mountineering
Burts Bees
Cabelas
Ceavco Audio/Visual
Chaco
Chis Case Photography
Chums
Camelback
Campmor
Chevy
Clif Bar
Cloudveil
Coleman
Columbia
Confluence Watersports
Coors
Croakies
Cross Country Skier Magazine
Dakine
Darn Tough
Deckers Outdoor Corporation
Dicks Sporting goods
Dillards
Dodge
Dominos pizza
Ducks unlimited
Duofold
Dyna Fit
Eagle Creek Travel Gear
ECO-X, Inc.
Ember Photo
EMS
Exum Mountain Guides
Eye
Fedex
Fetzer Winery
Five Ten
Fly Low
Ford
Free Heel and Wheel
Gaiam
Glenn Randall Photography
Go Lite
Google
Gore Enterprise Communications
Gore Tex
Gravity Sports
GU Energy Labs
Hellroaring Ski Adventures
Home depot
Horny Toad
HP
IBM
Ibex Outdoor Clothing
Icebreaker
Idaho Mountain Touring
International Mountain Biking Association
Jansport
Jetboil
Jughandle Hut
Kahtoola
Karhu
Katadyn
Keen
Kelty
Klean Kanteen
Larabar
La Sportiva
Leatherman
Levis
Little Moon Essentials
LL Bean
Loki Outerwear
Lost Trail Lodge
Lowepro
Mammut
Marmot
Men Journal
Merrell
Microsoft
MillerCoors
Montrail
Mount Rose Ski Resort
Mountainsmith
Mountain Equipment Co-op
Mountain Hardwear
Mountain Kakhis
Mountain Outfitters
Mountain Rider Alliance
MSR
Nalgene
Nantahala Outdoors
Nature conservancy
Nature Valley
New Balance
New Belgium Brewing/ Fat Tire Beer
NikWax
Nike
Nissan
North Cove Outfitters
Northern Lites Trading Co.
Off-Piste
OIA
Ortovox
Osprey Packs
Outdoor DIVAS
Outdoor Research
Patagonia
Payette Powder Guides
Pearl Izumi
Pfizer
Pheasants Forever
Pine Needle Mountaineering
Planet Explore
Point 6
Prana
Princeton Tec
Promo Shop, Inc.
Quaker oats
Red Mountain Pass Cabins
Red Wing Shoe Company
Reebok
REI
Rendevous Tours
River Sports Outfitters
Rock Creek Lodge
Rosemont Ventures, Inc
Ruff Wear
Rutabaga Paddlesports
Sara Lee
Sawtooth Mountain Guides
Sea To Summit
Scarpa
Scheels
Shrine Mountain Inn
Sierra Club
SIGG
Silver Peak Restaurant and Brewery
Skinny Skis
Snowshoe Magazine
Smartwool
Smith optics
Sorensens Resort
Sporthill
Starbucks Coffee
Sterling Rope
Summit Flags
Sun Valley Trekking
Swiss Army
The Alpine Experience
The Ascending Path
The Ascentials
The Coleman Company
The North Face
The Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation
The Software Ranch
The Snaz
The Sportsman Skii Haus
Teko Socks
Teva
Thermarest
Thule, inc.
Timberland
Timex
Trango
Tubbs Snowshoes
Turtle fur
Two Knobby Tires
U.S. Govt
Vasque
Velcro
VF Outdoor Inc
Vibram
Wanderlust Tours
Waypoint Outdoor
Whole Foods
White Wave Foods
Wigwam
Woolrich
Xcel Energy
Yakima
 
of.

I think that is what the major issue here with Habervision donating to Wild.Org is.

Kinda playing both sides of the fence, right?


HaberVision donates to a lot of different organizations. They donate to schools, ski clubs, fishing clubs, hunting organizations, bicycling groups, golf organizations. Really they donate to almost every type of group that uses our product. There are hundreds of groups that get product or donation from HaberVision.

I would hope that snowmobillers see that we belong to state snowmobile associations, donate to clubs, help with a lot of snowmobile stuff. We clearly support motorsports. The Vice President of the company does a LOT of dirt bike riding himself. Being that the company is based in Colorado, everyone within it is very active in outdoor stuff as well.

Again, it is a fine line. When does supporting your Elk Foundation or Duck Unlimited go against supporting snowmobilling? I can tell you that neither of those organizations are are very motorized sport friendly.
 
How many of us are aware of where our money goes?
Every donation?
Every purchase?

I'm sure we all F__ up sometimes with our money choices.
 
As I stated above, I will absolutley not buy any products from a company who supports groups like this whether or not they've donated to recreational groups or not.
I was about to outfit the family with Habervision and now I will NOT. I'm sick to death of these wilderness advocacy groups. I could care less about what goes on in Africa but I can tell you we have enough wilderness here in Montana period!!! And that group will support any wilderness legislation here. Also be careful to blindly support the Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation, they're a very anti-motorized group. I'm an avid elk hunter, have been for 44 years, and I haven't benefited one bit from anything they've done.
 
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