for those who can't see the writing on the wall

[Work - Never]

There has been a lot of talk on this site about the government’s responsibility to tell us we were headed for disaster in our financial markets. For those of you who can’t see what is coming after the current financial sector crisis here’s a heads up on what’s coming next?

Medical Insurance: Doctors and hospitals are charging insurance companies thousands and thousand of dollars for surgeries that take an hour or two. Medical insurance companies can not charge the consumer (that’s you and me) or the companies we work for enough money for our medical insurance policies to cover the greed of doctors and hospitals. This can only go on so long and it will force a collapse in the market. The doctors and hospitals that have made all the money will not be the ones who bail us out, it will be the tax payers.

Auto Insurance: Almost the same thing as medical insurance on a smaller scale but none the less, the insurance companies and auto body shops that are making all the money will not be the ones who bail us out when this industry goes bankrupt which it eventually has to do if changes are not made to the current system. Again it will be the tax payer.

These are just two sectors of our economy that I have been watching for the past 5 years and can tell that disaster is coming. It’s inevitable at the pace were going.

 

[rkymtnman]

The doctors and hospitals that have made all the money

I don't disagree with your predictions but - those of you who think the Doctors themselves are making all the money in healthcare are misinformed. The FACILITIES (hospitals, surgery centers, etc) are the ones getting fat in this age. I'm not a Doctor but do have pretty good insight in to this. Doctors while they make a great living, no doubt, are getting less and less for the procedures they perform.

 

[maluchm]

I can't wait to drop 10+ grand a couple hearing aids but get my Hover round power chair for free!

 

[Work - Never]

I don't disagree with your predictions but - those of you who think the Doctors themselves are making all the money in healthcare are misinformed. The FACILITIES (hospitals, surgery centers, etc) are the ones getting fat in this age. I'm not a Doctor but do have pretty good insight in to this. Doctors while they make a great living, no doubt, are getting less and less for the procedures they perform.

Yes, the medical facilities are certainly lining their pockets in this scandal.

My daughter works for an orthopedic surgeon. He does surgery on Monday and Wednesday. He starts at 7:00 AM and schedules a surgery every hour until 4:00 PM. His bill for each hour is 8K to 12K. That’s 9 hours a day at an average of 10K an hour. That’s 90K per day X 2 days a week X 52 weeks a year = 9.3 million a year in surgery billing alone. That does not include the money made doing office visits. A good living is 250K a year not 9.3 + million. That’s rape, dishonesty and greed all rapped into one. Get those three working together and there is a financial disaster on the horizon even a blind man can see.

 

[Sturgis Sledder]

Yes, the medical facilities are certainly lining their pockets in this scandal.

My daughter works for an orthopedic surgeon. He does surgery on Monday and Wednesday. He starts at 7:00 AM and schedules a surgery every hour until 4:00 PM. His bill for each hour is 8K to 12K. That’s 9 hours a day at an average of 10K an hour. That’s 90K per day X 2 days a week X 52 weeks a year = 9.3 million a year in surgery billing alone. That does not include the money made doing office visits. A good living is 250K a year not 9.3 + million. That’s rape, dishonesty and greed all rapped into one. Get those three working together and there is a financial disaster on the horizon even a blind man can see.

I think you would be surprised to see that the Dr. is probably not even getting 10% of that $9.3 M. What do you think his education, and MALPRACTICE insurance are costing him? It comes down to the F'n lawyers, they convince people that they "can get rich quick" so they sue the Dr.s, they sue the insurance companies, they sue manufacturers, they sue McDonalds for hot coffee. There needs to be a limit on how much lawsuits can be for.

 

[Work - Never]

I think you would be surprised to see that the Dr. is probably not even getting 10% of that $9.3 M. What do you think his education, and MALPRACTICE insurance are costing him? It comes down to the F'n lawyers, they convince people that they "can get rich quick" so they sue the Dr.s, they sue the insurance companies, they sue manufacturers, they sue McDonalds for hot coffee. There needs to be a limit on how much lawsuits can be for.

I don't disagree with your comment about the lawyers. I actually thought about including that in my original post because that is a disaster on the horizon as well.

If that's true (it's not) 10% of 9.3 million is 930K a year. A doctor MAY be worth 120K to 150K. So lets take the additional 780K and lower the medical costs?????It's a start.

Regardless the system is bound to fail and the tax payers will have to bail it out. At least now when it happens nobody can come on hear and say why did'nt somebody tell us we were headed for a crisis.

 

[powderbound]

Talk about seing it coming, Here is something I have always wondered how it worked. I still don't understand. Go to a major city and drive around. All you see is stores, care dealers, malls and restaraunts for miles and miles. Nobody actuall produces anything. Where does the money come from in the first place to buy all the stuff an run the totally service oriented economy. I grew up in ohio then there were factories that you could see that funded the economey of town. Now they are gone, but town is bigger than ever and all there are stores malls and resteraunts I am puzzled where the $ comes from??

 

[CHABA]

Talk about seing it coming, Here is something I have always wondered how it worked. I still don't understand. Go to a major city and drive around. All you see is stores, care dealers, malls and restaraunts for miles and miles. Nobody actuall produces anything. Where does the money come from in the first place to buy all the stuff an run the totally service oriented economy. I grew up in ohio then there were factories that you could see that funded the economey of town. Now they are gone, but town is bigger than ever and all there are stores malls and resteraunts I am puzzled where the $ comes from??

north america is shifting out of manufacturing and it is going overseas.In 1950 there were 70000 different occupations now there is 500000.How many people are employed just making websites or hand building custom bikes.I worked in a factory and an asian or mexican can have it.WE dont have enough people to produce all the things we use.Its almost like this was planned.We ran up the real estate so we could buy more crap to get the economies in china and india rolling.

 

[Deadsled]

Talk about seing it coming, Here is something I have always wondered how it worked. I still don't understand. Go to a major city and drive around. All you see is stores, care dealers, malls and restaraunts for miles and miles. Nobody actuall produces anything. Where does the money come from in the first place to buy all the stuff an run the totally service oriented economy. I grew up in ohio then there were factories that you could see that funded the economey of town. Now they are gone, but town is bigger than ever and all there are stores malls and resteraunts I am puzzled where the $ comes from??

Funny, I've thought about this same thing in my old town of Klamath Falls, OR. I watched it explode with stores and restaruants and 4,000 sq ft homes while the manufacturing companies were laying off or closing their doors. These kind of towns are headed for issues.

 

[justadude]

It's way more complex than that!!
I couldn't even begin to touch on it. My Sister inlaw a CFO at a hospital and she's really good at exlaining it. I'm just really bad at retaining it!!!


Maybe socialized health care has a purpose?? Yes? No?

I don't disagree with your comment about the lawyers. I actually thought about including that in my original post because that is a disaster on the horizon as well.

If that's true (it's not) 10% of 9.3 million is 930K a year. A doctor MAY be worth 120K to 150K. So lets take the additional 780K and lower the medical costs?????It's a start.

Regardless the system is bound to fail and the tax payers will have to bail it out. At least now when it happens nobody can come on hear and say why did'nt somebody tell us we were headed for a crisis.

 

[KWB]

north america is shifting out of manufacturing and it is going overseas.In 1950 there were 70000 different occupations now there is 500000.How many people are employed just making websites or hand building custom bikes.I worked in a factory and an asian or mexican can have it.WE dont have enough people to produce all the things we use.Its almost like this was planned.We ran up the real estate so we could buy more crap to get the economies in china and india rolling.

The output of manufacturing in north america is up-- it is just it takes fewer people to do it, more stuff is made here now than it ever has been. Automation, getting smarter in design, being less vertically integrated are all factors.

And to the guy that thinks that a good doctor is only worth $120-150K/yr apparently lives in an area where $100K will still buy you a house and a nice new car is $12K and a sled cost $5k . ~$120K/yr isn't really living all that high on the hog in many parts of the country.

 

[onlyrotax]

Talk about seing it coming, Here is something I have always wondered how it worked. I still don't understand. Go to a major city and drive around. All you see is stores, care dealers, malls and restaraunts for miles and miles. Nobody actuall produces anything. Where does the money come from in the first place to buy all the stuff an run the totally service oriented economy. I grew up in ohio then there were factories that you could see that funded the economey of town. Now they are gone, but town is bigger than ever and all there are stores malls and resteraunts I am puzzled where the $ comes from??

Credit Cards.

 

[trackvs2wheels]

UMMMM.........


Let's see here...You went to school for let's say four years and obtained a Bachlor's degree in something. Let's say you worked through school and came out with approximately $10k in debt at a reasonably priced state school. Now, your first job was a good one(for right out of college) and you made $50k/ year. Well sir, that is 5 TIMES your college loans.

Now, here is a doctor that paid $250k to go to school for the eight or so years it took them to get through. Applying the situation above in which you made 5 times your schooling costs...that doctor is worth...come on now...you can do it...YUP, that's right, $1.2M/year!!

I KNOW THIS BECAUSE THE ABOVE IS ME...WELL, I GOT MY MASTERS BUT BASICALLY IT IS ME...AND THE OTHER IS MY GF WHO WILL BE IN DEBT A QUARTER MILLION DOLLARS WHEN SHE IS DONE WITH SCHOOL.

YOU'RE TELLING ME SHE SHOULD MAKE $100K/YEAR

I don't disagree with your comment about the lawyers. I actually thought about including that in my original post because that is a disaster on the horizon as well.

If that's true (it's not) 10% of 9.3 million is 930K a year. A doctor MAY be worth 120K to 150K. So lets take the additional 780K and lower the medical costs?????It's a start.

Regardless the system is bound to fail and the tax payers will have to bail it out. At least now when it happens nobody can come on hear and say why did'nt somebody tell us we were headed for a crisis.

 

[Dogmeat]

Yes, the medical facilities are certainly lining their pockets in this scandal.

My daughter works for an orthopedic surgeon. He does surgery on Monday and Wednesday. He starts at 7:00 AM and schedules a surgery every hour until 4:00 PM. His bill for each hour is 8K to 12K. That’s 9 hours a day at an average of 10K an hour. That’s 90K per day X 2 days a week X 52 weeks a year = 9.3 million a year in surgery billing alone. That does not include the money made doing office visits. A good living is 250K a year not 9.3 + million. That’s rape, dishonesty and greed all rapped into one. Get those three working together and there is a financial disaster on the horizon even a blind man can see.

Yeah but what are his costs?

His costs have got to be through the roof, not including what he has to pay for malpractice insurance.

I've read countless article after article that the ones who are are really driving up the cost of medicine and doctors and whatnot are the lawyers who will sue at the drop of a hat, and this has forced the insurance companies to charge outlandish premiums, which has forced doctors to charge outlandish prices.

So ultimatley, go figure, the lawyers are at fault. Who would have thought that?

 

[highmtn]

Yeah but what are his costs?

His costs have got to be through the roof, not including what he has to pay for malpractice insurance.

I've read countless article after article that the ones who are are really driving up the cost of medicine and doctors and whatnot are the lawyers who will sue at the drop of a hat, and this has forced the insurance companies to charge outlandish premiums, which has forced doctors to charge outlandish prices.

So ultimatley, go figure, the lawyers are at fault. Who would have thought that?

How about the costs incurred by those who will never pay their med costs? When my wife had our daughter, our Insurance covered 3 days stay. She was admitted at 11pm. That one hour from 11 to midnight was the first day,so we paid for an extra day. after the birth, she shared a room with a mexican girl. She was visiting her mother(who lived here after having a child here) when she went into labor. A social worker explained to her that she would have to stay at the hospital until they could arrange an apartment for her(she had been there over a week already) along with the other welfare benefits she would receive. I was so disgusted, I had to leave the room

 

[skibreeze]

UMMMM.........


Let's see here...You went to school for let's say four years and obtained a Bachlor's degree in something. Let's say you worked through school and came out with approximately $10k in debt at a reasonably priced state school. Now, your first job was a good one(for right out of college) and you made $50k/ year. Well sir, that is 5 TIMES your college loans.

Now, here is a doctor that paid $250k to go to school for the eight or so years it took them to get through. Applying the situation above in which you made 5 times your schooling costs...that doctor is worth...come on now...you can do it...YUP, that's right, $1.2M/year!!

I KNOW THIS BECAUSE THE ABOVE IS ME...WELL, I GOT MY MASTERS BUT BASICALLY IT IS ME...AND THE OTHER IS MY GF WHO WILL BE IN DEBT A QUARTER MILLION DOLLARS WHEN SHE IS DONE WITH SCHOOL.

YOU'RE TELLING ME SHE SHOULD MAKE $100K/YEAR

Good call, nobody would put up with all of the schooling and debt for $100-150k a year. I make a 6 figure income with no schooling or debt.

 

[justadude]

That will piss a guy off.

How about the costs incurred by those who will never pay their med costs? When my wife had our daughter, our Insurance covered 3 days stay. She was admitted at 11pm. That one hour from 11 to midnight was the first day,so we paid for an extra day. after the birth, she shared a room with a mexican girl. She was visiting her mother(who lived here after having a child here) when she went into labor. A social worker explained to her that she would have to stay at the hospital until they could arrange an apartment for her(she had been there over a week already) along with the other welfare benefits she would receive. I was so disgusted, I had to leave the room

 

[Why Not]

UMMMM.........


Let's see here...You went to school for let's say four years and obtained a Bachlor's degree in something. Let's say you worked through school and came out with approximately $10k in debt at a reasonably priced state school. Now, your first job was a good one(for right out of college) and you made $50k/ year. Well sir, that is 5 TIMES your college loans.

Now, here is a doctor that paid $250k to go to school for the eight or so years it took them to get through. Applying the situation above in which you made 5 times your schooling costs...that doctor is worth...come on now...you can do it...YUP, that's right, $1.2M/year!!

I KNOW THIS BECAUSE THE ABOVE IS ME...WELL, I GOT MY MASTERS BUT BASICALLY IT IS ME...AND THE OTHER IS MY GF WHO WILL BE IN DEBT A QUARTER MILLION DOLLARS WHEN SHE IS DONE WITH SCHOOL.

YOU'RE TELLING ME SHE SHOULD MAKE $100K/YEAR

If were suppose to make 5 times a year what are education cost us I’m getting screwed. I should be making at least 300K a year.

Lame rationalization. Regardless of how much education you have people can only afford to pay so much for medical cost. The whole point of this thread is the costs are already out of control. Your greedy formula is exactly what is going to take the medical industry down.

I agree, a meltdown in the medical industry is on the horizon.

Tax payers beware. When the medical insurance companies go belly up it's our responsiblity to pay doctors 5 times a year what their education cost.

 

[SAWYER]

doctors should be one of the highest paid professions in the world. The have a tough job.

This is a really dumb thread. The insurance companies rake in your premiums and don't pay crap. If you think body shops are raking in the big bucks from insurance hjobs think again. Working at an auto glass shop my whole life and dealing with body shops every day you actually see what the insurance companies do.

Auto insurance companies have fixed prices and tehy tell you what they will pay you froa certain job. We turn alot of insurance work down because it's not worth our time to sell at cost and make $20 an hour on labor

 

[Burndown1]

Good call, nobody would put up with all of the schooling and debt for $100-150k a year. I make a 6 figure income with no schooling or debt.

I also make a six figure income. Just not saying where the decimal point sets.