I installed an Antigravity battery on my XM and after working perfectly fine for 4 days I found it dead one morning! The only thing I can think of that may have killed it was leaving the DESS key installed for a day. Could this create a draw?
Dead battery!
- Thread starter yammyman_1
- Start date
I've left mine on for months at a time with no issues. It's unlikely the cause.
Is yours an etec? Trying to figure out what else could be creating a draw! Everything is brand new!
Yep, I've ridden an etec for 3 seasons and have randomly left the tether on without any issues.
This season one of my etec 600's had a battery fail, but i'm guessing it was age. We traded it in on a new XM and didn't have to diagnose it.
I also came out to a low battery? the other morning after 4 full day rides with no issue.
I have a lightweight Shorai Lithium ...
It had only sat over night in the garage, but was very cold (below freezing).
I was wondering if the kill switch would make a difference since I think it was in the "run" position?
(update) I have not used my sled since it was slow to crank over, so I went and put a voltage meter on it. 14.08, which is approaching 100%.
I am blaming it on a very cold battery. I just went and cranked it over now and no hesitation ...
If it is very cold, it might also effect the battery performance. (per the mfg)
The Q&A site http://www.shoraipower.com/s.nl/it.I/id.5/.f for my Shorai battery suggests "warming" the battery with usage:
Q. I hear that lithium crank poorly when it gets cold, is that right?<O
</O
A.Lithium do increase in resistance more as temperature drops, compared to lead-acid. However, they also react to cranking under cold conditions in a much better way. Lead-acid will increase resistance on each subsequent cranking attempt, until it won’t turn over. If your LFX fails to start the engine on first crank, that first crank has warmed the battery, and the second attempt will be much stronger, and so on until you get a good start.
Shorai LFX are much better in cold-weather conditions than other-brand lithium starter batteries, due to our eXtreme-rate formulation with low resistance. Down to about 20 degrees fahrenheit (-7C) most users find that they can start normally on first crank. If your headlight comes on at key-ON, it is good for the batteries to flow some current before cranking in cold weather. The suggested headlight-on time before cranking depends on the temperature. If starting at 40f (5C), 30 seconds will help wake the battery and increase cranking performance. If at 0f (-17C), leave the lights on for 4~5 minutes before cranking. The result will be a better first crank, and longer battery life. Any other accessories that can be turned on before cranking can also be used for this purpose, such as heated gear, radio, etc...<O></O>
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Q. Can I use Lead-Acid battery chargers or charger/tenders?<O></O>
A.Yes. HOWEVER, you may NOT use a charger/tender if it has an automatic "desulfation mode", which cannot be turned off. We have confirmed with Deltran, makers of the "Battery Tender" brand, that their products do NOT have a desulfation mode, and are therefore OK for use with Shorai LFX, for example. But the best possible charger/tender for Shorai LFX is the SHO-BMS01, which will be released on about March 15th 2011, we expect. It uses the 5-pin BMS port in the LFX batteries, in order to monitor, diagnose, and balance the individual cells during charge. And it also has an optimized storage mode that will give the longest possible service life to your LFX.
If you are storing your vehicle and want to check the remaining capacity, or you're a racer with a constant-loss system, you'll want to know how resting voltage (i.e. with no load or load under 200mA) maps to remaining capacity. LFX batteries should be maintained such that 20% capacity remains at minimum, as best practice. Use a good-quality voltmeter to check remaining capacity, and consider recharge whenever the battery capacity falls to about 50% remaining. Of course, if you get the Shorai dedicated BMS01 charger, you can just hit the "Store Mode" button and leave it to do the work for you.
The voltage chart can be found here: http://www.shoraipower.com/s.nl/it.I/id.5/.f
I have a lightweight Shorai Lithium ...
It had only sat over night in the garage, but was very cold (below freezing).
I was wondering if the kill switch would make a difference since I think it was in the "run" position?
(update) I have not used my sled since it was slow to crank over, so I went and put a voltage meter on it. 14.08, which is approaching 100%.
I am blaming it on a very cold battery. I just went and cranked it over now and no hesitation ...
If it is very cold, it might also effect the battery performance. (per the mfg)
The Q&A site http://www.shoraipower.com/s.nl/it.I/id.5/.f for my Shorai battery suggests "warming" the battery with usage:
Q. I hear that lithium crank poorly when it gets cold, is that right?<O
</OA.Lithium do increase in resistance more as temperature drops, compared to lead-acid. However, they also react to cranking under cold conditions in a much better way. Lead-acid will increase resistance on each subsequent cranking attempt, until it won’t turn over. If your LFX fails to start the engine on first crank, that first crank has warmed the battery, and the second attempt will be much stronger, and so on until you get a good start.
Shorai LFX are much better in cold-weather conditions than other-brand lithium starter batteries, due to our eXtreme-rate formulation with low resistance. Down to about 20 degrees fahrenheit (-7C) most users find that they can start normally on first crank. If your headlight comes on at key-ON, it is good for the batteries to flow some current before cranking in cold weather. The suggested headlight-on time before cranking depends on the temperature. If starting at 40f (5C), 30 seconds will help wake the battery and increase cranking performance. If at 0f (-17C), leave the lights on for 4~5 minutes before cranking. The result will be a better first crank, and longer battery life. Any other accessories that can be turned on before cranking can also be used for this purpose, such as heated gear, radio, etc...<O
></O><?xml:namespace prefix = "v" ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" /><v:shapetype id=_x0000_t75 title="Stick Out Tongue" class=inlineimg alt="" border="0" src="images/smilies/tongue.gif" smilieid="5" stroked="f" filled="f" path="m@4@5l@4@11@9@11@9@5xe" o</v:shapetype>
Q. Can I use Lead-Acid battery chargers or charger/tenders?<O
></O>A.Yes. HOWEVER, you may NOT use a charger/tender if it has an automatic "desulfation mode", which cannot be turned off. We have confirmed with Deltran, makers of the "Battery Tender" brand, that their products do NOT have a desulfation mode, and are therefore OK for use with Shorai LFX, for example. But the best possible charger/tender for Shorai LFX is the SHO-BMS01, which will be released on about March 15th 2011, we expect. It uses the 5-pin BMS port in the LFX batteries, in order to monitor, diagnose, and balance the individual cells during charge. And it also has an optimized storage mode that will give the longest possible service life to your LFX.
If you are storing your vehicle and want to check the remaining capacity, or you're a racer with a constant-loss system, you'll want to know how resting voltage (i.e. with no load or load under 200mA) maps to remaining capacity. LFX batteries should be maintained such that 20% capacity remains at minimum, as best practice. Use a good-quality voltmeter to check remaining capacity, and consider recharge whenever the battery capacity falls to about 50% remaining. Of course, if you get the Shorai dedicated BMS01 charger, you can just hit the "Store Mode" button and leave it to do the work for you.
The voltage chart can be found here: http://www.shoraipower.com/s.nl/it.I/id.5/.f
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That is a great trick !
I also have one of these cheap , but handy tools for tracking down what is going on ... http://www.harborfreight.com/30-amp-automotive-fuse-circuit-tester-67724.html
B
BackCountryBob
Well-known member
I just had my dealer install an e-start kit with a Shorai LFX-24le-bs12-360 cranking(their choice). The sled started fine at +25f at home but it took 4 bumps of the starter at -16f in the PL. Sled started and ran fine all day--put it away for a week but would not start--put it on a 2 amp charger, no start. No start at home either.
Called Shorai customer service and they told me to "warm the battery" but I could fill out a warantee card and exchange it for the LFX-36L3, 540 cranking. Price difference is $350 vs $250. GULP
.
i am also checking out the battery charging system of the sled
as it should have charged the battery since the sled ran 52 miles.
BCB
Called Shorai customer service and they told me to "warm the battery" but I could fill out a warantee card and exchange it for the LFX-36L3, 540 cranking. Price difference is $350 vs $250. GULP
.i am also checking out the battery charging system of the sled
as it should have charged the battery since the sled ran 52 miles.
BCB
Thanks everyone for all the info! This gives much insight as to what the problem could be. I'm guessing temperature has the most adverse effect but I'll do the proper tests when I get home from work next week. Thanks again!
Just found this info on the antigravity website under FAQ, it explains a lot but doesn't mention this in instructions that come with the battery:
1) If you are using the smallest battery possible for your bike to save weight (for example for race use a 4 cell in a 600cc bike, or an 8-cell in a 1000cc bike) you may find in 50 degree weather and below it may be sluggish initially. But with each attempt to start the battery actually warms itself from the amp discharge and gets back its full strength. If you often ride in weather below the 50s we recommend going up one or two sizes on the battery, this will give you more cranking amps to get power even if its very cold.
1) If you are using the smallest battery possible for your bike to save weight (for example for race use a 4 cell in a 600cc bike, or an 8-cell in a 1000cc bike) you may find in 50 degree weather and below it may be sluggish initially. But with each attempt to start the battery actually warms itself from the amp discharge and gets back its full strength. If you often ride in weather below the 50s we recommend going up one or two sizes on the battery, this will give you more cranking amps to get power even if its very cold.
Antigravity
I have found on mine that the 12-Cell is great for normal days and conditions, however for colder days 15 and under I would run a 16-Cell.
Contact for great price retailer!
I have found on mine that the 12-Cell is great for normal days and conditions, however for colder days 15 and under I would run a 16-Cell.
Contact for great price retailer!
My wife has a 2012 E-start Etech. Should I be pulling the tether when storing it for days/weeks? I haven't been and it has been starting fine with the original battery. I did pull the battery during the summer and put it on a battery tender. But for these days/weeks between rides, should I be pulling the tether or even the whole battery? The sled is stored in an unheated shop and not really wanting to have the battery drain and ruin itself.
If you're using a life4po battery (not LiPo) then it's recommended by the manufacturer (Antigravity in my case) to disconnect the battery if not riding for a week or so. The batteries don't like colder temps. But they work fine once warmed up (hence the fact that it only has an issue after sitting in subzero temps for prolonged periods. Not when shut off for 5 minutes) I tested my battery and it has 14.14 V, also fully charged.
It simply doesn't like the cold, but it works fine once warmed up.
I've yet to test the exciting of the battery by holding the starter button to heat the cells up theory. I will in a couple days and let you know. (It does make sense) The guys at antigravity said they would send me a bigger battery if I wanted to send the other back...
He did also make it clear that the sled needs to be tested for parasitic drains on a regular basis (check your battery voltage after a few days of sitting)
OR
simply disconnect the battery if sitting for a few days (kind of hokey but its easy enough.) Never let it drop below 10.5 V or it will be ruined. Never use a lead acid charger, trickle charger or car charger.
...I don't think you have to worry about parasitic drains (draws) by leaving the DESS installed it doesn't make sense. I don't think the DESS key is a tap for current flow (I don't know exactly how it works.) There could be other parasitic drains though!
It simply doesn't like the cold, but it works fine once warmed up.
I've yet to test the exciting of the battery by holding the starter button to heat the cells up theory. I will in a couple days and let you know. (It does make sense) The guys at antigravity said they would send me a bigger battery if I wanted to send the other back...
He did also make it clear that the sled needs to be tested for parasitic drains on a regular basis (check your battery voltage after a few days of sitting)
OR
simply disconnect the battery if sitting for a few days (kind of hokey but its easy enough.) Never let it drop below 10.5 V or it will be ruined. Never use a lead acid charger, trickle charger or car charger.
...I don't think you have to worry about parasitic drains (draws) by leaving the DESS installed it doesn't make sense. I don't think the DESS key is a tap for current flow (I don't know exactly how it works.) There could be other parasitic drains though!
