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CURE... For problem laying over or sidehilling 163XP.

wow. I'll try and keep this short. Yes it would be, unless you have no understanding about fulcrum points and mechnical advantages. Go put a spring under a teeter totter. Put a 275 lb rated spring a foot out from the pivot point on the teeter totter. Now put a 223 lb rated spring underneath the seat of the teeter totter at the point farthest away from the fulcrum point. Tell me which one is easier to compress. The mechanical advantage of the lever (the teeter totter in this case) will allow you to compress the 275lb rated spring much easier than the 223 based on their locations in relation to the pivot point of the teeter totter.

Soooooo.....I don't have two XP's in front of me to measure and compare at the moment so i don't know the exact mounting locations. Based on the 154 having less mechanical advantage to compress the spring based on track length, shouldn't the spring rate in fact be less? Yes it will be. I'm not arguing that point with you. I'll address your other post separately.


The trouble with your theory is the center shock/coil spring are stationary (except for there ability to compress) and in same location for both 154 and 163 XP...As for the track the 163 put 4.5 more inches of contact to the snow vs the 154. depending on if you bought a challanger light or Powdermax track the differance in track weight can be approx. 5#.

Suspension are by design adjustable to suit each riders preferance, this info is nothing more than sharing solutions that may be causing 163 owners some grief....If BRP's suspension was "spot on" there wouldn't be a need for so many spring options.... Like the TRA clutch there designed to be tuned to the preferance of the rider.


OT
 
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OT. Normally I laugh and pass on your posts, but this one I will get in on. I could not agree with you more. The more reactive your suspension can be to the snow it is riding on the better it will work. The softer spring allows the front of the rails to better find the snow that we get traction from. Great thinking. I have been trying to figure out how to make the suspension work like it should on this sled and I think you have come up with a great first step. Please PM with any other things that you try and like with your sled and especially suspension related. Thanks a lot. Do you have the Part #'s on those two springs?
 
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The trouble with your theory is the center shock/coil spring are stationary (except for there ability to compress) and in same location for both 154 and 163 XP...As for the track the 163 put 4.5 more inches of contact to the snow vs the 154. depending on if you bought a challanger light or Powdermax track the differance in track weight can be approx. 5#.

Suspension are by design adjustable to suit each riders preferance, this info is nothing more than sharing solutions that may be causing 163 owners some grief....If BRP's suspension was "spot on" there wouldn't be a need for so many spring options.... Like the TRA clutch there designed to be tuned to the preferance of the rider.


OT

I realize they are stationary and wasn't sure if they were in the same place for the 154 vs the 163. I will measure when I am at the dealership next week. The reason Ski Doo makes different springs is not because of weight transfer, its becuz not all riders are created equal! (weightwise that is:)) Hence the IRP system from Arctic Cat. I strayed a bit off topic here, my main point was with your weight transfer and the idea that more is better. I refer to my earlier post:

"Ski Doo actually designed the SC-5M that is on your sled to have less weight transfer so that it remains flatter on the snow and planes off instead of trenching through it. Your recommendation of the more transfer the better will counteract the design of the suspension and you will be giving up more than a rough trail ride as the sled will begin to dig more in powder with less transfer so you will be giving up some deep snow performance as well."

As discussed in SnowTech, Oct/Nov 2007 page 114 right hand column:
"Another thing we noticed riding the Summit models was how they didn't wheelie like a traditional Summit. Ski-Doo has reduced the amount of transfer in their new SC-5M rear suspension. While they wanted to get the weight off the skis for climbing, their hill climb teams have found the sled climbs better if it is kept flatter when climbing and getting on plane in powder."

You are saying more, they are saying it climbs better and stays flatter with less......no offense intended OT, but I'm gonna go with Ski-Doo, their engineers, their hillclimb teams, proven custom built mountain sleds, my own custom built mountain sled and the media on this one.

I will concede that BRP is not spot on with the suspension, but IMO, adding more transfer is counteracting the design of the suspension. I do realise you are simply trying to help others though, so I will give you credit for that. :)
 
I really thought my primary spring was too stiff on the only two rides ive had, but the second ride I had was in some decent POW and she did a donut in a 15 footish radius…..man I was pumped.

The back end does set too low, gonna have to do somin about this

And the damn snow here sucks, so we have to ride a crappy trail for the better part of 10 miles, damn this XP shakes like a paint shacker at low RPM…..gonna have to do somin about this

And my belt showed no more cord on my second ride, even thou a noob friend jumped on her and hammered the flipper for 50 yards before he realized the freakin brake was on, damn belt was smokin and creating a awful funk…..but I rode another 20 miles and the belt looked great. The older secondary would make the belt jump on top the sec if the brake was set

OT – im off the last two weeks of this month, when are we gonna ride?
 
OT. Normally I laugh and pass on your posts, but this one I will get in on. I could not agree with you more. The more reactive your suspension can be to the snow it is riding on the better it will work. The softer spring allows the front of the rails to better find the snow that we get traction from. Great thinking. I have been trying to figure out how to make the suspension work like it should on this sled and I think you have come up with a great first step. Please PM with any other things that you try and like with your sled and especially suspension related. Thanks a lot. Do you have the Part #'s on those two springs?
4

Here's the part# for the 223# same as 154XP part#503-191 343 and the 240# is 503-190-478...It should be noted that this isn't anything new either, Historically Doo center spring has always been heavier than it should be for throwing around a sled. The opposite can be said about the torsion spring which control rear sag in the sled. The rear torsion have historically had a tendancy to be to soft even when the block is set on stiffest setting....I hear Felkers in colorado makes a custom block thats cheaper than buying beefier torsion springs.

Hatch anytime you want to make the trip let me know.

OT
 
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