Carl's Cycle 860 Kit worth it?

[F-Bomb]

Lot's of good info in this thread and I eco aspects of all of the posts. Dragonslayer's first comments are probably still the most informative even as things get better and better performance wise (and reliability wise as well) with the development of the turbo systems there still seems to be plus' and minus' for all.

Keep this in mind..almost everyone's comments are based on some level of very limited experience with each application or a lot of experience with just one. If you have the money and the energy you can make any one of these applications do or feel a certain way. The question is will that setup be right for you or flexible enough that it's a positive experience overall.

 

[jthussey]

For the riding you do Aebsledder, I would reccomend the BB Kit. The turbo isn't going to help you with your 10' long sidehills and going down drainages . I had the same feeling you have, turbo or keep my BB. In the trees and your riding style, the BB is the way to go IMO. Yes its great to have that strait up the hill performance but playin in the trees is were its at. Also then we can compare the 777 to your 860.


Huss

 

[aebsledder]

What is your experience?

You have twins right? With porting and head mod? Clutching? I am not looking to poach your set-up just wondering how it compares to:

1. 860 Kit
2. Head Mod and Porting with SLP single

Is it worth (in your humble opinion of course) going the extra dollars for the 860 kit as opposed to twins and porting? Maybe you haven't been around the other set-ups. I only have mine to compare against a turbo (which is apples and oranges.) I do know this, I would like a no lag set-up with decent top end.

 

[aebsledder]

For the riding you do Aebsledder, I would reccomend the BB Kit. The turbo isn't going to help you with your 10' long sidehills and going down drainages . I had the same feeling you have, turbo or keep my BB. In the trees and your riding style, the BB is the way to go IMO. Yes its great to have that strait up the hill performance but playin in the trees is were its at. Also then we can compare the 777 to your 860.


Huss

I should probably get a new bumper then too.. The BB is so tempting, but it is also 5 grand all said and done. To tell you the truth, I would love to be able to sell mine and get a new Pro this year. That is probably a pipe dream though.

 

[mountainhorse]

After riding with the "jedi masters" of the trees... Allen Mangum, Dan Adams, Chris Burandt, Bret Rasmusen and some others on turbos... I'd have to say that the turbos do very well in the tight "holy crap" tree situations on SUPER steep hills.

OH... and don't get me wrong... I got absolutely buried Trying to hang with these guys.

The best performance mod is actually increasing your athletic abilities and fitness levels.

Turbos aren't point-and-shoot weapons only any more.

At around 10lbs boost the Turbos really make some impressive power... and if the system is set up for efficiency at this level (smaller turbo, smaller intake tract, mapping and clutching built around this on a mid track length) then they actually excell in boondocking... The price is about the same when said and done.

 

[sled_guy]

The best performance mod is actually increasing your athletic abilities and fitness levels on a machine.

Yea, whatever... it's a whole heck of a lot easier to just buy more HP.

sled_guy

 

[aebsledder]

Yea, whatever... it's a whole heck of a lot easier to just buy more HP.

sled_guy

Of all the sledding related things, I have the fitness one down. Now I just need an unlimited budget and more practice.

 

[Timbre]

After riding with the "jedi masters" of the trees... Allen Mangum, Dan Adams, Chris Burandt, Bret Rasmusen and some others on turbos... I'd have to say that the turbos do very well in the tight "holy crap" tree situations on SUPER steep hills.

OH... and don't get me wrong... I got absolutely buried Trying to hang with these guys.

The best performance mod is actually increasing your athletic abilities and fitness levels.

Turbos aren't point-and-shoot weapons only any more.

At around 10lbs boost the Turbos really make some impressive power... and if the system is set up for efficiency at this level (smaller turbo, smaller intake tract, mapping and clutching built around this on a mid track length) then they actually excell in boondocking... The price is about the same when said and done.

That has been my experience exactly (not meaning that i have ridden with the "jedi masters", of course). I go anywhere the stock or BB sleds go AND...as an extra bonus... have a ton of power for the steep and deep stuff too Turbos that are setup correctly really are incredibly fun to ride...never a lack of power!! I did find that mine ran much better as a pump gas setup than 100% race gas. Running 9-11 psi and 2-3 gal race gas in tank ran WAY better than 14 psi and all race gas. Don't know why...but it did.

Clutching (Carl's is awesome), correct TPS setting, Fresh reeds, clean fuel filter, proper fuel mapping, different skid (i use Holz), and a few other little "tricks" here and there...are absolutely key to a great running turbo setup! Big power makes BIG smiles...and that's what it's all about...yes?!

 

[jthussey]

After riding with the "jedi masters" of the trees... Allen Mangum, Dan Adams, Chris Burandt, Bret Rasmusen and some others on turbos... I'd have to say that the turbos do very well in the tight "holy crap" tree situations on SUPER steep hills.

OH... and don't get me wrong... I got absolutely buried Trying to hang with these guys.

The best performance mod is actually increasing your athletic abilities and fitness levels.

Turbos aren't point-and-shoot weapons only any more.

At around 10lbs boost the Turbos really make some impressive power... and if the system is set up for efficiency at this level (smaller turbo, smaller intake tract, mapping and clutching built around this on a mid track length) then they actually excell in boondocking... The price is about the same when said and done.

I do agree with ya, Yet the Jedi's also probably have the finest tuned turbos around. The two that i have ridden, one 600 and an 800 by polaris, both had the noticeable slouch at the bottom. It wasn't much, but when you get in the trees and trying to make a quick maneuver it was noticeable and then it would shoot you to the next tree right past the tree your where just trying to go around. This was also when you weren't able to keep the RPM's up above 6,000. Above that, I didn't notice anything except my smile ear to ear.

 

[suitcase]

On the boosted side of things, I would not shy away from one. IMO a guy just needs to ajust his rideing style. Unless you have arms the size of water barrels, you just can't grab a hand full of throutle and wait for the boost to come on. You have to ease into it, when in tight places, and come onto boost some what slowly.. So a set up with a little lag, does not come into play all that much. But you gain a big advantage when you need to move up hill on steep ground, You have the HP to gain elevation, with a boosted sled. You don't have the same advantage with a set up like mine. Of course this is with my limited use on a boosted sled.

Just my two penny's

 

[F-Bomb]

Things have really come a long long ways with the way turbos are working. The violent sometimes uncontrollable rush of power as you come to boost is a thing of the past. There still is a time of duration while you build power from minimal boost to full boost that feels like a lag. You absolutely would and do get used to a system or feel very quickly especially with the much more managable systems of today. No matter which direction you go it costs alot of money to get that kind of power. Not much difference in overall performance from a true 8lbs pump gas system and a complete package flat dialed Carl's 860 until you hop up to 8000ft up. Consistantly the 860 customers have gotten a more reliable day to day performing sled as well. It's a known and ready to go setup that works well. The turbos are still being developed and a good portion of the various turbos need regular attention to keep a high level of performance as conditions vary. The bad part is now we have another change in base fuel so most of the turbo developers are once again starting over.

If you want a twin system it would be in your best interest to duplicate my setup (which is Carl's twin package) exactly. That way you can benefit from my 2 years and 3,000 miles of experience. There aren't that many setups running around so info and experience is limited. I will say that when mine is running right it is very impressive for the small amount of money needed over a single pipe setup. It's in a performance stepping stone way above the single slp pipe systems and right behind the single pipe Carls 860 in like weighted sleds. The key to twin pipes is getting your system or setup correct and then being very precise on your fuel octane. I had some less then satisfactory performance part of last year when we changed to the 2010 updates and messed around with some voltage settings and ecu stuff....plus then finding the right octane for the entire sytem. I got fed up with the inconsistancy and having to run race gas but having stock performance so the solution was to go back to the original 09 setup and once again it was it's old awesome self again. The only downfall of the twins is messing with race gas mixing. Other then that it is really a nice performance package. For me and my riding needs versus my budget allowance it was the only way to go and totally worth it.

 

[suitcase]

That is something that I need to do for sure is get on a very up to date turbo. It seams like I am allways geting on 2 to 3 yr. old boosted sleds. I have yet to get on a 09 or 10 set up. But now that I am looking at putting a turbo on an sled I for sure need to be up to date.
For my day to day riding I will never get rid of my 860, but one sled does not seam to fit my needs anymore, the 860 is so usefull in most all places, not to mention tons and tons of fun. ( LOL, A toy for all places. )
As allways Rob you have great info.

 

[fungus]

bought a 2008 with the 860 kit, it has just under 1100 miles on it. I haven't ridden for about 15 years and want a smaller sled. The 2008 seems to have some aftermarket shocks on it and don't know what else. I would like to sell or trade this machine but have no idea what it is worth, your post seem like you may be able to give me a clue.

 

[sledhed]

bought a 2008 with the 860 kit, it has just under 1100 miles on it. I haven't ridden for about 15 years and want a smaller sled. The 2008 seems to have some aftermarket shocks on it and don't know what else. I would like to sell or trade this machine but have no idea what it is worth, your post seem like you may be able to give me a clue.

You don't want a smaller sled. You can get used to being light on the throttle with the 860, and when you want / need the torque to get you out of a tight situation you will be glad you have it...

Carls recommends putting in pistons every 1200 miles if I recall correctly as maintenance (I would have to check my notes to be sure), just did that to my 860 last spring. So maybe it is a good time to sell it.

I have put mine up for sale as I was thinking of getting a Pro, but at 4600 I have had no nibbles... so basically from my experience it is not worth much more than a stocker unless you find the right buyer... and some people shy away as they think it has been thrashed as a modified sled.

Granted my sled has more miles on the chassis but not a lot more on the motor overall, or suspension or shocks, all of which are newer.