Avy Courses...Are They Worth It?

[KFD070]

Been doing some research lately on when and where I can take an Avy course near my Kelowna location. I know I'm gonna get a bunch of the self righteous "what's your life worth?" responses by posting this but in all reality, if I don't ride on the steep and deep and don't intentionally put myself in harm's way, why should I take a course? I bought beacons, shovels and probes for myself and the wife this year, mainly to able to assist others in distress should I encounter a group in need. I'll check the Avy web site before heading out to verify conditions. If avy conditions are high I'll stay completely clear of the hills and stay in the meadows. But, enlighten me here, I'm asking for constructive useful info, not criticism, what am I going to learn in an Avy course? I don't mean that in a sarcastic way, I'm honestly asking the question, "what will I learn in an Avy course, other than how to dig a pit and check the snow conditions that will save my bacon?"

 

[skibreeze]

I'd be willing to bet that you DO put yourself in places that can slide on a pretty regular basis. Just because the hill isn't 500 feet of vertical doesn't mean it cant bury you. I have seen 50 foot tall hills slide with crowns over 6 foot. There are plenty of places that can look pretty innocent just because they are small, but have the right angle to slide. I have learned alot online about avys, and through personal experience, but I did learn some new things when I took a snowmobile specific avy class last month.

 

[tudizzle]

how to look for wind loading and to properly read snowpack

proper grid search techniques

past mistakes made and how to learn from them

overall increased avy awareness


Just a few things learned by taking an avy course. I have yet to meet someone that thought it was a waste of time and did not learn anything. If anything increased knowledge will help put you into the right frame of mind to be in the back country. It will make you more aware of your surroundings and increase you own decision making abilities in these situations.

 

[Stinkey Hammer]

Just my thoughts.
I take an AVY course every year.
All BS aside, I never dig a snowpit, know very few people that do, and if you do you would have to dig one for every aspect you ride. Not sying it's right or wrong
I don't intentionally ride in avy paths or terrain, but somtimes you have to cross those areas in order to get somwhere else.
Do to past expierences, you can take all the avy courses you want, when sh*t hits the fan common sense goes out the window generally, and all hell breaks loose. Alot of people have lost their lives because of this, mass panic and confusion are usually the problem. At least you take an avy course and you get an idea of what to look for, give yourself that extra edge, know why the places that look the best are most the time the ones you gotta watch out for, how to take some leadership, organize a search, use your beacon effectivly and so on. I am not sying it's gonna save your life, but it will definatly give you a better chance! You said you bought beacon for your wife as well. Did you teach her how to use it? Are the instructions in the package that informative? I would be really impressed if you or your wife could get that much out of that little pamphlet.
Do you really want to be burried only a foot under the surface with you wife trying to figure out how to use that beacon as the panic sets in of you been burried and death on it's way. Do you want to be in that situaton where she is burried and you don't have a clue?
Hey maybe it will all work out for you? or maybe after this year you will have the rest of your life to think about it. Alone?
Not trying to be a jerk, but theese are some things you really need to think about.
I know a few guys from last year that will unfortunatly be thinking about it forever

 

[AKSNOWRIDER]

when I took my first class years ago one of the avy reports we reveiwed was of 3 stateworkers who died in an avy repairing a guardrail...they were 5 miles from the nearest hill..but were working in a small cutbank on the road..it was windloaded and slid..burying all 3 ...a year later we had a big avy in one of our riding areas..buried a group of 7 riders who were over a 1/4 mile away from the hill, riding across a big flat valley...no one ever would have thought an avy would reach that far into the valley before that....I think not taking every oportunity to increase your knowledge and safety is just looking to have to live with something you dont want to (someones death that possible could have been avoided)

 

[snowww1]

One study showed that the buried person has a 70% better chance of survival if the people doing the search are trained and practiced. Mike Duffy

 

[RGM]

Well you hear a lot of whining on this forum about pretty much everything, yet I have never heard anyone say the avy course they took was a waste of time.

 

[Chief]

Here in Utah we lost a guy who was on the groomed trail changing a belt and the hill above him came right down over him.. he and his group were not Avy prepared.

The course I took last year I'll take again. Searching with and without beacons, snow conditions, pit digging and reading the snow layers, even how to dig faster.

I never want to be caught in a slide myself and I never want to look back and say I wasn't prepared to find my wife, kids, or friends.

Chief

 

[KSH]

Been doing some research lately on when and where I can take an Avy course near my Kelowna location. I know I'm gonna get a bunch of the self righteous "what's your life worth?" responses by posting this but in all reality, if I don't ride on the steep and deep and don't intentionally put myself in harm's way, why should I take a course? I bought beacons, shovels and probes for myself and the wife this year, mainly to able to assist others in distress should I encounter a group in need. I'll check the Avy web site before heading out to verify conditions. If avy conditions are high I'll stay completely clear of the hills and stay in the meadows. But, enlighten me here, I'm asking for constructive useful info, not criticism, what am I going to learn in an Avy course? I don't mean that in a sarcastic way, I'm honestly asking the question, "what will I learn in an Avy course, other than how to dig a pit and check the snow conditions that will save my bacon?"

You bought all the equipment, why not learn how to use them properly?

You say you got the equipment to help others if needed, well if it's needed you are going to be the leveled headed one that needs to direct the others.

Just my $.02

 

[DRD]

I learned how little I really know about avalanches and predicting them.

 

[KFD070]

Some excellent points guys and I appreciate the feedback. There is no doubt that we will need to learn how to properly use our beacons. Intend to begin practicing with them as soon as we start getting out. When a scene is chaotic it is a must that you be familiar with your gear. So I'm gathering that the courses are not just a course on how to recognize and avoid avy's but also the do's and don't's of avy rescue. If that's the case there's no doubt we would greatly benefit from a course.

 

[AvalancheSafetyDude]

It's impossible to say here on the forums everything that you will learn from an Avy class. It has been said by many that your brain is the best piece of equipment you have, and an Avy class is an excellent way to gain the knowledge that will help you. If you do take an avy class, try to make sure it's a snowmobile-specific class (Mike Duffy teaches an excellent snowmobile-specific class, and he travels to your location to teach it). I guarantee you will learn from an avy class and that you will not be disappointed if you take one.

 

[Ex-Member]

YES!! Without a question, absolutely worth it.

Knowing how to use the equipment is just as important as having it.

And regarding conditions, if you've been riding and haven't taken a course, i'm betting one of those pictures you'll see and analyze will hit you... that you've ridden something similar, and never even thought of how close you were to triggering a slide.

So yeah, take the class.

 

[KFD070]

Probably a very good point how many times I may have un-intentionally put myself in the line of danger and been totally unaware of it.

 

[modsledr]

KFD070...I appreciate the non agressive nature of your question, and also the informative responses (this usually turns into a pi$$ing match!!).

We assist ASAP (Alpine Safety Awareness Program) here in WA putting on classes.

The classes here are intended to introduce you to the factors that lead to avalanche incidents. They are NOT intended to make you an expert on reading snowpack (leave that to the snow-nerds who love to do it..then issue backcountry avy forecasts).

If you understand WHY avalanche incidents occur, you are then learning from the past to prevent a repeat in the future.

The education will help you recognize the factors that lead to an incident so you are prepared to alter your actions and avoid the danger. The best part of the message, is that a HIGH avy danger doesn't mean not riding, just altering your behaviour and having a plan A and plan B so you can still go out and play, and stay safe.

I hope you decide to take a class (both you AND your wife)...you can never have enough knowledge.

 

[deepdiver]

A good way to get your wife to get proficient with her beacon is some at home training that works. Every time your wife has a Bday or Mothers day or Christmas or just because day,hide some new jewelery and your beacon in a Plastic bag somewhere on your property. Hand her her beacon and tell her to go save a life and time it. She will have a new outlook in using her tool.
My wife can find jewels faster than I have ever seen someone use a beacon. Set a time limit and tell her it goes back to the store if she cant save its life. A small price to pay for practice. Get creative..take the Avy class and then practice at home untill you have snow. Practice in the snow also

Coyote Girl you should have Modsledder learn this way to practice beacon skills.(I hope I got the two names here correctly matched up)

 

[cappel]

StinkyHammer put it best...

"Do to past expierences, you can take all the avy courses you want, when sh*t hits the fan common sense goes out the window generally, and all hell breaks loose."

i took an avy course last year with my gf, who was the big "push" in taking one and i'm glad I did. You will learn so much you never even though of like digging for a person from the side, not the top and leaving your probe in the snow on the victim when you find them, not pulling it out and so on so forth. We try to practice each time we go out locating beacons and really avy training is like anything else. Repetion, repetion, repetion!! I will take the course again this year as somewhat of a refresher.

 

[modsledr]

A good way to get your wife to get proficient with her beacon is some at home training that works. Every time your wife has a Bday or Mothers day or Christmas or just because day,hide some new jewelery and your beacon in a Plastic bag somewhere on your property. Hand her her beacon and tell her to go save a life and time it. She will have a new outlook in using her tool.
My wife can find jewels faster than I have ever seen someone use a beacon. Set a time limit and tell her it goes back to the store if she cant save its life. A small price to pay for practice. Get creative..take the Avy class and then practice at home untill you have snow. Practice in the snow also

Coyote Girl you should have Modsledder learn this way to practice beacon skills.(I hope I got the two names here correctly matched up)

LOL...that is AWESOME motivation for beacon practice...but stop giving CG ideas!!

 

[KFD070]

A good way to get your wife to get proficient with her beacon is some at home training that works. Every time your wife has a Bday or Mothers day or Christmas or just because day,hide some new jewelery and your beacon in a Plastic bag somewhere on your property. Hand her her beacon and tell her to go save a life and time it. She will have a new outlook in using her tool.
My wife can find jewels faster than I have ever seen someone use a beacon. Set a time limit and tell her it goes back to the store if she cant save its life. A small price to pay for practice. Get creative..take the Avy class and then practice at home untill you have snow. Practice in the snow also

Coyote Girl you should have Modsledder learn this way to practice beacon skills.(I hope I got the two names here correctly matched up)

AAAHHH CRAP! I spent all my money on her new sled, beacons, probe and Spot2. No money left to motivate her to practice. I guess I could hide the tether to her sled and tell her if she doesn't find it by the time I head out she's stayin home!
I really appreciate all the constructive and informative feedback everyone. Sounds as though we're both takin a course.

 

[CoyoteGirl]

Coyote Girl you should have Modsledder learn this way to practice beacon skills.(I hope I got the two names here correctly matched up)

BWAHAAA, that is most excellent! But it would be sled parts, not jewelry!

Way to get creative! You get 2 thumbs up from me! And what does she use for your practice sessions?