Another Battery Question

[clatla]

I know there was quite an exstensive couple of posts recently about lightweight batteries. My question is more about brand than weight savings. I have a 09' MTX that I think the battery is getting weak on. I want to replace it with something that is going to crank the sled over on those -20 F mornings and maybe give me a little weight savings. I cannot justify spending close to $300 on a battery to save 10 lbs. I have been looking at the Odessey batts and they seem to be pretty reputable. From what I have found in older posts was that the PC545 seems to be the replacement of choice. The site recomends the PC680. Wondering what you guys are running.

 

[clatla]

Another question is they list a PC545 & PC545MJ. The MJ is for Metal Jacket. The other is plastic. It says the Metal Jacket is needed if around heat so the case doesnt expand. Your thoughts?

 

[summitboy]

I wouldn't get caught up in all the $300.00 lightweight battery BS. In my opinion Odyssey makes the best batteries going for anything ! You will be better off with one of those than spending a pile of money on these hyped up batteries. If you will be cranking in those -25 to -30 C temps i would not worry about weight and get the biggest Odyssey battery that will fit in the stock tray. Then you will always have cranking power when you need it.

I just run a Yuasa YTZ-7S in my Apex. They last well and crank for my needs. My sled lives in a heated trailer all season and the mountains never get that cold. I see 3 seasons out of them and they cost me 60 bucks. Thats 15-18 years of batteries for the price of a hyped up $300.00 battery.

Odyssey rocks !

 

[sledheadd]

I run the same as summitboy ytz 7s only once did I have to boost it in the morning -30c

 

[TBird]

I wouldn't get caught up in all the $300.00 lightweight battery BS. In my opinion Odyssey makes the best batteries going for anything ! You will be better off with one of those than spending a pile of money on these hyped up batteries. If you will be cranking in those -25 to -30 C temps i would not worry about weight and get the biggest Odyssey battery that will fit in the stock tray. Then you will always have cranking power when you need it.

I just run a Yuasa YTZ-7S in my Apex. They last well and crank for my needs. My sled lives in a heated trailer all season and the mountains never get that cold. I see 3 seasons out of them and they cost me 60 bucks. Thats 15-18 years of batteries for the price of a hyped up $300.00 battery.

Odyssey rocks !

Where do you find such an expensive battery, with same capacity as an Yuasa YTZ-7S?
If you want to compare Yuasa YTZ-7S with an Li-ION do your self an favor and do an honest comparision!
You will not find an Li-ION as cheap as an Yuasa YTZ-7S, but if price is your only demand i bet you find a cheaper make then Yuasa!
And call Li-ION technology BS???
You'll find Li-ION batteries in more and more stuff, and i believe it's for an reason!

Luckily there's people willing to try new stuff out, and new technology is always expensive, in the beginning it's a few that pays alot of development cost's a.s.o, if the stuff works more will buy it and price will drop, look for ex. @ flat screen TV's, computers, and what ever "new" technology.
I bet you wasn't one of them who bought an PC when it was a new technology, i was, i payed a truck load of money for one in the 80's!

My opinion is that it's up to each what they buy, we are all diffrent, the ones not buying new technology can always jump on it later when price dropped, but they should know that they have the one's buying them from the start to thank, else the product would have been killed and never hit the market.

I have no opinion of quality of Odyssey batteries, i bet they are one of the best lead batteries out there!

 

[M5-]

I run the PC310 Oddessy. It has never failed me. EVER. Including days when we've blasted through the mountains with the sleds on the deck and temps below -20C. I had a Yuasa YTz7S in my Rx1 and it was fine. We put a Power Sonic Ytz7S in an Apex and it needed to be boosted everyday even in the warm trailer. It would crank the sled over but it just didn't have enough juice for the ignition or fuel injection. It was a total POS. I took it back and they load tested it and it tested to spec but it was still a total POS. I gave it to a buddy of mine and he put it in his dirtbike, it seems OK for that. You get what you pay for.

M5

 

[Murph]

I have been watching these battery threads for awhile and formulating a response. I apologize in advance for this being long-winded....

In the interest of full disclosure, I am the Director of Motorsports for Speedcell Technologies we make Lithium batteries for powersport applications.

I want to give you some information so that you can make an informed decision without simply saying we are great and everybody else sucks.

When it comes to Lithium batteries, there is more misinformation out there than legitimate information. Some of it is intentionally misleading, some of it is simply because some of these "battery companies" really don't know what they are doing-- they aren't actually battery companies, they are merely resellers of Chinese made products. Even things that should be straight forward are not always what they appear to be. What is even more disturbing is that some of these "battery companies" actually seem to believe some of their own marketing materials. Speedcell Technologies is the Motorsports division of Navitus. Navitus was started by a veteran (15 year)-- USMC Force Recon. Navitus is a U.S. Department of Energy and US Department of Defense contractor-- cage code 1VC84. Many of you are former or current military and understand the significance of a cage code, this will be pertinent further in the discussion.

Here goes.....

Lithium DOES have limitations in cold weather applications--as does lead acid (what the OEMs use now in their snowmobiles). The strategy that the OEMs use to overcome cold weather performance degradation is capacity. Most OEMs have a "performance envelope" of -30 to +30 degrees. This is why most OEMs batteries are 16 to 20 amp hour even though many people (SnoWesters) will tell you that a 7 amp hour battery will work just fine-- it will as long as it isn't too cold out or the sled was in a trailer or heated garage. Try and start a Nytro that has been outside for a week in -30 temperatures with a 7 amp hour battery and it will prove my point. As a technology platform, lithium can use the same strategy of excess capacity to overcome cold weather performance degradation. Even with excess capacity, the Lithium platform is still smaller and lighter than its lead acid equivalent due to the fact that lithium is more energy dense.

Not all lithium batteries are created equally. A battery's performance is dependent on the quality of cells inside. The cell manufacturers even have different levels of "quality" in the cells they offer. Why does this matter to you, the consumer/ end user? The cell quality typically determines two important factors when it comes to battery "performance"-- 1. starting power ( ability to overcome motor inertia and spin the motor fast enough to fire), 2. Longevity- lithium batteries are susceptible to overdischarge -- even more suseptible then lead acid-- if the individual cells are not balanced properly and one discharges more than the others in a start cycle, the battery can be rendered inoperable. At Speedcell, we use A-grade A123 cells because they are the most energy dense and have the highest quality. Many of our competitors claim to use A123 cells, and some of them do, but they are not the A-grade cells. The reason that I can make this claim is that A123 will not sell A-grade cells to a company that does not have a US government issued cage code. As I stated previously, Speedcell through its parent company Navitus, has a cage code-- 1VC84. Our products are built in our facility in Las Cruces, New Mexico. We supply battery systems to the DoE and the DoD. If you have a custom application or need, we can build a unique solution for you. Call our competitors and tell them that you need a custom battery built for size, layout, capacity, etc-- see what they say. It's real easy to determine who actually is a battery company versus a "battery company" (i.e. reseller of foreign products)

Who uses Speedcell?
Department of Energy
Department of Defense
Monster Energy Graves Yamaha (AMA Superbike factory team)
Yoshimura Suzuki Racing (AMA Superbike factory team)
M4 Broaster Chicken Suzuki (AMA Superbike)
Geico Suzuki (AMA Daytona Sportbike)
M4 Broaster Chicken Suzuki (AMA Daytona Sportbike)
Y.E.S. Graves Yamaha (AMA Daytona Sportbike factory team)
Roadrace Factory RedBull Yamaha (AMA Daytona Sportbike team)

At the last AMA round April 20-22 at Road Atlanta, Speedcell took ALL twelve podium positions in the four Superbike/ Daytona Sportbike races. ALL twelve. Why does this matter?....because every battery that has been discussed in this thread is available to the teams, and they all choose Speedcell.



Why else should you choose Speedcell?

We are snowmobilers

We actively support keeping riding areas open. We are currently drafting a corporate policy to divert a percentage of snowmobile battery sales profits to groups that fight land closures

We truly are an American company, building American products--cage code 1VC84

Ask your dealer to carry Speedcell. If they don't, feel free to PM me.

Thanks,
Murph