Alcohol Injection Guys step on in!

[GNDAN]

Well I am building a 600 CFI Turbo sled for flat landing and the occasional small hill (To you guys out West). Since I am trail riding at <3000', it looks like my boost on pump gas 91 will be 4PSI to avoid detonation. Race gas is not an option since most days we will ride further than I could carry fuel on board to even mix 50/50.

I am very experienced with alcohol injection on 4-stroke engines but I am not sure about the longevity of it going through the crank case and it's effect on the bearings of a 2-Stroke even though the oil is directly injected on to most bearings. I am hoping someone experienced can chime in and let me know what their experiences are with it.

I understand Silber Turbos sells a kit but I am not sure if this method has been proven? I would easily be able to build a kit, I just would like some input on the guys using it and what boost a 91/alcohol setup is capable of and possibly what flow rates they are using at X-Boost (I understand most will be 800's just for reference though it would be nice to know).

Thank In Advance, Dan

 

[gmustangt]

I have no personal experience with the meth but you are right in saying you would/could damage the bearings, i had the thought of meth but aont do it becasue of the bearings, ive had the thought though if a guy was to add a hole in his cylinder into one of the transfers, and spray through there?

Another option for you is to get a better designed head for the machine, possibly even a little lower compression, a better designed dome can get you roughly 2psi more on the same given fuel, a slight drop in compression will get you more, just a suggestion.

 

[GNDAN]

The head is definitely on my to do list possibly next year.

I have too pondered injecting into the port, though I am worried it would not mix well and would loose almost all of it's ability to cool the charge air.

I am hoping possibly Silber will inform us of their findings.

,Dan

 

[Boyko]

If you want a sled you can go out and ride I would stay away from alcohol. If you are familiar with the stuff you already know why. The cf4 already has a great fuel system with 4 injectors and a decent fuel pump, probably the best ever from the factor for boosting.

There are a few thing you can do to make it run on pump gas as well. If you can get av fuel that is the ticket, get a fuel controller and do your head like gmustangt said, turbo it and flog the thing. I don’t like running big boost numbers this is something that is associated with alcohol it just causes more work in the end, there are ways to make power or get it to the ground.

 

[gmustangt]

Dont know if your already doing it but a good intercooler will get you more power/reliable as well.

Seeing you will be trail riding and will have high ground speed you could do a nice air/air intercooler, mounted in a spot that will see good cold air.

 

[rusty rider]

I'm building a very low elevation turbo setup right now too, my method for more over all power is going to be a big azz turbo (hopefully a lot of air flow) with water to air and a 925bb, timing module. I'm shooting for 5-6 lbs @2k ft on 91 non oxy. But we will see, this is just all speculation right now, hope to be 230-240 hp.

 

[GNDAN]

Dont know if your already doing it but a good intercooler will get you more power/reliable as well.

Seeing you will be trail riding and will have high ground speed you could do a nice air/air intercooler, mounted in a spot that will see good cold air.

I have been debating on the air to air after cooler. I am trying to decide how I would be able to fit it up front since I am not convinced the "rear" mount aftercoolers are real affective. One idea I have been kicking around is a air/water aftercooler but I can come across the small cores they are using to build them?

I would love to run AV/Race fuel especially since there is a station right down the road but with trail riding up north it's not practical. I might be best off to just leave the boost low and enjoy it, though I am not sure how much extra seat of the pants kick 4PSI will get me... I am more used to nearly 30 PSI power gains in 4-strokes where 4 PSI barely feels like a change at all...

,Dan

 

[akMcat]

Water to air parts

http://frozenboost.com/
I've only ordered some silicone parts from these guys but seemed to be a reasonably priced source for all kinds of parts for building your own water to air intercooler setups.

 

[rusty rider]

frozen boost is an awesome site to get most of what you will need. I usually get parts three days after I place order. Their inner coolers are the real deal, a little heavy though.

 

[TurboMatt]

Getting the head(lower compression & better design) is your best option at this point. That costs the same as the meth inj. Next on the list should be intercooler.air to air may even be a better option with the proper ducting because of the high ground speeds you will see. water to air is nice, but you may not kick up enough snow on the trails to properly cool. KISS keep it simple stupid. There are also a couple octane boosters out there that do actually work a little bit. That could help a little too. More over, I've here that some of the new engine managements out there really make a different on keeping things cool on the trails. They are pricey, but if you are serious this would be a place to look.
I personally don't think that meth inj. is a great option for 2 strokes that are actually ridden(not just raced).

 

[jeepin270]

I am pretty sure that Silber has been playing around with the meth injection since 09. He would be the one to give you the best advice imo.

 

[Clarke673]

it was my understanding that the alcohol will cause the oil not to lubricate correctly causing premature bearing, piston, jug, and ring damage. also running the temp up potential causing a preignition (det). race gas is exactly what you need and will be cheaper than trying this.

 

[LoudHandle]

Two words; "Trail Tank" 15 gallons on the newer PRO chassis sleds.

 

[Cody Phillips Racing]

This works very well as an alternative to race gas. The tricky thing is getting the injection controlled correctly. Not sure on Silber's kit and how it all works, but I have used the AEM units in the past and they work very well. Works best with a standalone such as the viper so you can really tune and control the injection and the overall tuning. We will be testing this all winter long.........