17s weak??

[trackvs2wheels]

Year after year polaris has motor and electrical problems and they don't fix them. Why? Because we keep buying them because they have a lite and cool chassis. But after so many motor problems I finally realized it does not matter how lite and nimble the sled is if you only get a 1000 miles out of it before the motor needs rebuilt or it spends much of its life at the dealer getting repaired. Our riding season is to short to deal with this crap. On top of this the sled prices keeps going up. Do the math 14,000.00 for a sled to get a 1000 miles out of it if your lucky.

I have taken a stand that I will not buy another polaris new or used. But if people are going rush down and buy the new 2018 believing that they have fixed all the problems when we know the 18 will most likely have the same motor as 17, this is NOT going to wake polaris up. We NEED TO STOP SUPPORTING THEM!!! They will listen if there numbers are down but only we can make that happen. What is the definition of insanity? (Doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results)
I have decided to buy the 18 cat, they have a great reputation for being reliable, they are made in the usa and the 18 is very narrow, handles great and you can drop 18 lbs with just a can.

Polaris will most likely be under 400 pounds this year but ask your self if 8 to 10 pounds less will really matter if the motor and electrical plague continues ( and it will)

While what you state is technically correct ("they have a great reputation for being reliable"), you do realize it's a whole new engine design this year and basically that "reputation that they've built" doesn't really parley into the new 18? While it may prove to be as reliable as the Suzuki was, it's yet to be seen...

 

[Mnt.Tamer]

Yes I realize that it's a new motor but they do have a reputation. I would rather take a chance on a company that has built a reputation and have spent the last 3 years to makin it a sound
(Hopefully) motor. I don't want to be a polaris basher but we have to make them WAKE up. You spend 14,000.00 of your hard earned money (your family's money) to go out and have fun in the deep snow and the thing is a ticking time BOMB. After feeling the pain of spending money to rebuild motors, take 3 weeks off of powder riding because the thing is in the shop again and watching my friends go thru the same thing, enough is enough.

Let's do the sled industry a favor and Don't by a polaris this year, let's send a statement that we demand a better quality motor.

 

[Reg2view]

Crank trueness and phasing between cylinders/port timing can make the difference between a soft motor and a hot stocker. It used to be the primary reason some stockers would just run hard against their twins.

 

[Polaris Pilot]

Year after year polaris has motor and electrical problems and they don't fix them. Why? Because we keep buying them because they have a lite and cool chassis. But after so many motor problems I finally realized it does not matter how lite and nimble the sled is if you only get a 1000 miles out of it before the motor needs rebuilt or it spends much of its life at the dealer getting repaired. Our riding season is to short to deal with this crap. On top of this the sled prices keeps going up. Do the math 14,000.00 for a sled to get a 1000 miles out of it if your lucky.

I have taken a stand that I will not buy another polaris new or used. But if people are going rush down and buy the new 2018 believing that they have fixed all the problems when we know the 18 will most likely have the same motor as 17, this is NOT going to wake polaris up. We NEED TO STOP SUPPORTING THEM!!! They will listen if there numbers are down but only we can make that happen. What is the definition of insanity? (Doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results)
I have decided to buy the 18 cat, they have a great reputation for being reliable, they are made in the usa and the 18 is very narrow, handles great and you can drop 18 lbs with just a can.

Polaris will most likely be under 400 pounds this year but ask your self if 8 to 10 pounds less will really matter if the motor and electrical plague continues ( and it will)

I couldn't agree more. I sold the Axys at about 350 miles and don't plan to buy another Polaris unless something drastically changes. I could see how owning it was going to go, so I bought an Arctic Cat and have been happy so far.

 

[kiliki]

Crank trueness and phasing between cylinders/port timing can make the difference between a soft motor and a hot stocker. It used to be the primary reason some stockers would just run hard against their twins.

this is true and can cover all manufactures, did not help with the low RPM of the thread.

 

[wellfed777]

phatty
i wonder how your power valves look i know some turbo sleds have been having vales issues at 4-600 miles
maybe check that

 

[Indy_500]

After last year at 850 miles I cleaned my valves on my 16, they were so bad I could hardly get them out. I started noticing inconsistent rpm at 600 miles but majority of time it ran decent enough to keep me happy, was definitely more sluggish but that was with the original belt too. Only have 300 miles on this year unfortunately, but first 250 miles the sled absolutely ripped again like new all the time, last 50 I noticed some inconsistencies again though. Over the off season I put a new polaris belt on, and both new clutch springs, so I can't for certain pinpoint which item brought the power back but my gut says it's the powervalves being dirty...

 

[Beavis]

Same issue here.

I have a 2016 LE 163x3 with full SLP pipe. Bought it as a holdover this year and dealer updated it with the 2017 map from the start. Bone stock at 8k-10k it would pull 8150 but fell off to 7750 on tougher pulls. So, I added pipe and changed clutch springs and lighter weights (62's). But no matter what I do I still can't get over 8200 and still falls off to 7900 on tougher pulls.

Buddy has a 2017 LE 163x2.6 that's bone stock except 60g weights. He pulls 8350-8450 all day long. It's noticeably stronger than mine.

Maybe I have a TPS issue but it runs great otherwise. Or maybe it's the exhaust valves but it's only got 600 miles on it. Maybe the difference in tracks means I need to go even lighter weights. Just seems odd that my 2015 stock Pro would easily pull 8250 on pulls with same clutching.

I still love the sled. Pulls hard on bottom and mid and love how quick it revs compared to my other Pro's. Very fun in steep and deep and technical. Just need to pull more rpm's on top.

 

[Overthehood]

Same issue here.

I have a 2016 LE 163x3 with full SLP pipe. Bought it as a holdover this year and dealer updated it with the 2017 map from the start. Bone stock at 8k-10k it would pull 8150 but fell off to 7750 on tougher pulls. So, I added pipe and changed clutch springs and lighter weights (62's). But no matter what I do I still can't get over 8200 and still falls off to 7900 on tougher pulls.

Buddy has a 2017 LE 163x2.6 that's bone stock except 60g weights. He pulls 8350-8450 all day long. It's noticeably stronger than mine.

Maybe I have a TPS issue but it runs great otherwise. Or maybe it's the exhaust valves but it's only got 600 miles on it. Maybe the difference in tracks means I need to go even lighter weights. Just seems odd that my 2015 stock Pro would easily pull 8250 on pulls with same clutching.

I still love the sled. Pulls hard on bottom and mid and love how quick it revs compared to my other Pro's. Very fun in steep and deep and technical. Just need to pull more rpm's on top.

Your 16 sounds a lot like mine. I had the exhaust valve issues last year which was a much more dramatic loss of power with low 7000 rpm max. Once they were cleaned and recalibrated it was back to normal. Gradually got weaker with miles and tps adjust, ecu refresh, SLP torque arm, SLP stage 2, all new clutch components wouldn't bring it back to 8400 like it was for the first 500 miles or so.

This 17 is way weaker than my 16 right out of the box. If it gets weaker over time I might as well go trade for a 600 at least I'd know what I was getting. I mentioned the cost of a turbo to my wife and she put her divorce lawyer in her speed dial.

 

[SRXSRULE]

Same issue here.

I have a 2016 LE 163x3 with full SLP pipe. Bought it as a holdover this year and dealer updated it with the 2017 map from the start. Bone stock at 8k-10k it would pull 8150 but fell off to 7750 on tougher pulls. So, I added pipe and changed clutch springs and lighter weights (62's). But no matter what I do I still can't get over 8200 and still falls off to 7900 on tougher pulls.

.

your sled is exactly what I was riding last year, pipe and all. I also was riding at 8-10k and I was able to run 66's and turn 8300-8400..... BUT, I never took my sled in for the software update. Thats a huge difference, 4gram heavier weights and still turning 300-400 more rpm.

I truly think the updated 16 software and the 17 software de-tuned the sleds.
Wouldnt be the first time they did that. Eric

 

[Dazzler]

I have had pretty good luck with my Poo sleds, aside from the two 09 dragons, they both had a new engine under warranty. The 08 Dragon, 2011 Assault, 2013 Pro, and 2015 Pro have been virtually trouble free. I have not had any electrical or power loss issues that could not be resolved with a little maintenance.
If I have any rpm change or power issue, I check belt + deflection, power valves, plugs, plug gap, plug boots, then fuel filter in that order. 98% of the time I'm back in business. If there's nothing obvious and no improvement, then clutch's, followed by TPS and fuel pressure. I do consider most of this as maintenance and check it regular, therefore I have had only one RPM issue in the field since the carburetor days and that was a hole in the power valve diaphragm on the 2011 Assault.

 

[Wheel House Motorsports]

All riding is 7 to 9k.

I had a 16 with just a can and ripped with 10-64s until around 900 miles. Did clutch speings and bam back to ripping and holding good rpm. Just got a a 17 and have not been blown away with its performance. Same elevation and rising zones as thr 16. Did an slp stage 2. Hit 82 to 8300 oit of the hole but consist rpm dropping to 7800 on climbs. Same clutching my 16 pulled 81-8200 all day and would only fade a tiny bit on super long pulls due to heat soak. This sled is out of break in. Just hit 300 miles and it's just not that exciting. Also they aren't very fast at 7800 rpm


Just yanked thr ecu out of the 16 and threw it on thr 17. Time to see if it works Any better.

 

[Overthehood]

All riding is 7 to 9k.

I had a 16 with just a can and ripped with 10-64s until around 900 miles. Did clutch speings and bam back to ripping and holding good rpm. Just got a a 17 and have not been blown away with its performance. Same elevation and rising zones as thr 16. Did an slp stage 2. Hit 82 to 8300 oit of the hole but consist rpm dropping to 7800 on climbs. Same clutching my 16 pulled 81-8200 all day and would only fade a tiny bit on super long pulls due to heat soak. This sled is out of break in. Just hit 300 miles and it's just not that exciting. Also they aren't very fast at 7800 rpm


Just yanked thr ecu out of the 16 and threw it on thr 17. Time to see if it works Any better.

Let me know how that goes.

 

[goridedoo]

All riding is 7 to 9k.

I had a 16 with just a can and ripped with 10-64s until around 900 miles. Did clutch speings and bam back to ripping and holding good rpm. Just got a a 17 and have not been blown away with its performance. Same elevation and rising zones as thr 16. Did an slp stage 2. Hit 82 to 8300 oit of the hole but consist rpm dropping to 7800 on climbs. Same clutching my 16 pulled 81-8200 all day and would only fade a tiny bit on super long pulls due to heat soak. This sled is out of break in. Just hit 300 miles and it's just not that exciting. Also they aren't very fast at 7800 rpm


Just yanked thr ecu out of the 16 and threw it on thr 17. Time to see if it works Any better.

Whatd you find?

Broke 600 miles on Saturday. Was pulling around 8200 in the morning and by then end of the day I was only seeing 7700-8000. Running 60g at 9000-10000'. Your very right, not too fast at 7700-7800.

Thinking the ecu wouldnt be the issue if they run good for the first few hundred miles?

 

[JJ_0909]

Whatd you find?

Broke 600 miles on Saturday. Was pulling around 8200 in the morning and by then end of the day I was only seeing 7700-8000. Running 60g at 9000-10000'. Your very right, not too fast at 7700-7800.

Thinking the ecu wouldnt be the issue if they run good for the first few hundred miles?

I found a few things...

1) Is your belt in good condition? The belts Polaris is spec'ing with the Axys are a harder compound than I'd like to see. Yes, they last awhile (usually) but I have a feeling they slip ever so slightly after a number of miles. This can easily be responsible for the drop in RPM. If you have some cash to play with, try a Cat belt. Yes, you'll blow them far more quickly (250-300+ miles), but they are a far softer compound and have worked a lot better for me.

2) Clutch springs, "bearing cover" etc - you touched on this, but make sure your clutches are working right

3) Exhaust valves. Make sure they are functioning properly.


If these three things are in check, do a compression check.

There is always a reason you lose RPM - there is no wizardry here!

 

[greasemonkey3406]

Check your engine mounts too. I am down on rpm as well. Started at right around 860 miles after my ring gear let go and took out the torque arm mount. There is a lot of movement in the mounts and there are gaps in some places between the mounts and the outer ring. They should be here this week so hopefully that fixes it...

 

[phatty]

Update:
my dealer adjusted the TPS and did a little belt deflection. PV looked good and no water or corrosion around the relays.

Rode this weekend in a new place starting at 5k and up to 9k. Sled pulled 8300 all day long in heavy wet spring snow. Probably done riding for about a month so wont have time to do any more testing.

And I went through a set of brake pads. First time ever, have heard of others going through pads in 500 miles as well...

 

[Wheel House Motorsports]

ECU didn't seem to affect things at all.

I am going to set my TPS on my own using a proper setup, not with digital wrench. Well see if that helps out. I did pull my full SLP setup off and put my stock pipe and can I ran on my 16. I lost like 50 RPM, thats it which is weird considering the SLP setup should pull significantly more clutching. Honestly sled just feels flat up top like about 75% throttle it seems completely the same, if anything seems to get a flatter then if I leave it at partial throttle.

Also I have ran OEM and gates belts, clutches all cleaned up between each ride and deflection set proper so keeping that variable out of the equation, this sled serious just does not pull the same, it doesn't run bad by any means it just does not feel nearly as impressive. and 8300 is not a number I see ever

 

[GoBigParts]

Thanks for the replies. I compared the compression to my brothers 16 that rips still at 850 miles and his was maybe 2 pounds higher. Don't know what leak down is?

Just sold my 16 and it had 1245 miles. Seemed to get stronger. I had rpms hits around 8500-8600 logged in the computer. Usually see 8350 on it with 10-70's at sea level. All of our 17's feel stronger than our 16's.

 

[goridedoo]

I found a few things...

1) Is your belt in good condition? The belts Polaris is spec'ing with the Axys are a harder compound than I'd like to see. Yes, they last awhile (usually) but I have a feeling they slip ever so slightly after a number of miles. This can easily be responsible for the drop in RPM. If you have some cash to play with, try a Cat belt. Yes, you'll blow them far more quickly (250-300+ miles), but they are a far softer compound and have worked a lot better for me.

2) Clutch springs, "bearing cover" etc - you touched on this, but make sure your clutches are working right

3) Exhaust valves. Make sure they are functioning properly.


If these three things are in check, do a compression check.

There is always a reason you lose RPM - there is no wizardry here!

No wizardry but SUCKS when your $13k sled wont even run right for a year! And it does start become more of an issue when you live 12 hours from the mountains, and the sled runs great at home but not at elevation. I dont want to blow a weekend tinkering.

Anyway, belt looks very green and just seems extremely smooth. Blew the first one at around 350-400 miles so this one has 200-250. Will be easy enough to swap it on the next trip with a new one and see if there is a difference. May also give a gates a try.