does anyone know where to get the light weight batteries for snowmobiles?
Any info would be great.
Thanks
Any info would be great.
Thanks
Where to get light weight battery for Pro with ES.
- Thread starter PR Performance
- Start date
Light weight battery
I just went to a battery store. I have one that measures 2"X3"X4" It works well. I keep my sled inside. I don't know what it would be like if I kept it outside overnight at -20. But then I could use my rope. I'd also go to a motorcycle shop. The ones here have small light weight batteries.
I just went to a battery store. I have one that measures 2"X3"X4" It works well. I keep my sled inside. I don't know what it would be like if I kept it outside overnight at -20. But then I could use my rope. I'd also go to a motorcycle shop. The ones here have small light weight batteries.
Try looking up Ballistic Batterys.
Shorai ! By far the lightest.
http://http://www.ballisticparts.com/products/batteries/16cell.php
http://http://www.shoraipower.com/p-208-lfx27l3-bs12.aspx
Shorai is not the lightest at all. Do a comparison. Not that it really matters but on average Ballistic is cheaper, has more CCA's, higher amps/hour and is lighter than the comparable Shorai. I have been using them in my off road bikes for a couple years and have had no problems.
Just saying
http://http://www.shoraipower.com/p-208-lfx27l3-bs12.aspx
Shorai is not the lightest at all. Do a comparison. Not that it really matters but on average Ballistic is cheaper, has more CCA's, higher amps/hour and is lighter than the comparable Shorai. I have been using them in my off road bikes for a couple years and have had no problems.
Just saying
thanks for all the info. I will start there to find something.
S
Super Sled
Well-known member
Not to burst anyone's bubble here but I'd advise to do a tad of research on the Ballstic battery before relying on them for sled applications. They are not always what they are cracked up to be, especially in the cold. I've heard better reports about the Shorai. Just my $.02. 
I ran a Shorai in my FST this past season - very light and no issues with starting unless it gets below -10 F (first cold-start in the morning only). In that case, I put a bit of load on the battery for a couple minutes and it wakes up enough to start the sled. Picked up another one for my Pro because it was less work than pulling the electric start...
Speedcell
I have been watching this thread for awhile and formulating a response. I apologize in advance for this being long-winded....
In the interest of full disclosure, I am the Director of Motorsports for Speedcell Technologies we make Lithium batteries for powersport applications.
I want to give you some information so that you can make an informed decision without simply saying we are great and everybody else sucks.
When it comes to Lithium batteries, there is more misinformation out there than legitimate information. Some of it is intentionally misleading, some of it is simply because some of these "battery companies" really don't know what they are doing-- they aren't actually battery companies, they are merely resellers of Chinese made products. Even things that should be straight forward are not always what they appear to be. What is even more disturbing is that some of these "battery companies" actually seem to believe some of their own marketing materials. Speedcell Technologies is the Motorsports division of Navitus. Navitus was started by a veteran (15 year)-- USMC Force Recon. Navitus is a U.S. Department of Energy and US Department of Defense contractor-- cage code 1VC84. Many of you are former or current military and understand the significance of a cage code, this will be pertinent further in the discussion.
Here goes.....
Lithium DOES have limitations in cold weather applications--as does lead acid (what the OEMs use now in their snowmobiles). The strategy that the OEMs use to overcome cold weather performance degradation is capacity. Most OEMs have a "performance envelope" of -30 to +30 degrees. This is why most OEMs batteries are 16 to 20 amp hour even though many people (SnoWesters) will tell you that a 7 amp hour battery will work just fine-- it will as long as it isn't too cold out or the sled was in a trailer or heated garage. Try and start a Nytro that has been outside for a week in -30 temperatures with a 7 amp hour battery and it will prove my point. As a technology platform, lithium can use the same strategy of excess capacity to overcome cold weather performance degradation. Even with excess capacity, the Lithium platform is still smaller and lighter than its lead acid equivalent due to the fact that lithium is more energy dense.
Not all lithium batteries are created equally. A battery's performance is dependent on the quality of cells inside. The cell manufacturers even have different levels of "quality" in the cells they offer. Why does this matter to you, the consumer/ end user? The cell quality typically determines two important factors when it comes to battery "performance"-- 1. starting power ( ability to overcome motor inertia and spin the motor fast enough to fire), 2. Longevity- lithium batteries are susceptible to overdischarge -- even more suseptible to lead acid-- if the individual cells are not balanced properly and one discharges more than the others in a start cycle, the battery can be rendered inoperable. At Speedcell, we use A-grade A123 cells because they are the most energy dense and have the highest quality. Many of our competitors claim to use A123 cells, and some of them do, but they are not the A-grade cells. The reason that I can make this claim is that A123 will not sell A-grade cells to a company that does not have a US government issued cage code. As I stated previously, Speedcell through its parent company Navitus, has a cage code-- 1VC84. Our products are built in our facility in Las Cruces, New Mexico. We supply battery systems to the DoE and the DoD. If you have a custom application or need, we can build a unique solution for you. Call our competitors and tell them that you need a custom battery built for size, layout, capacity, etc-- see what they say. It's real easy to determine who actually is a battery company versus a "battery company" (i.e. reseller of foreign products)
Who uses Speedcell?
Department of Energy
Department of Defense
Monster Energy Graves Yamaha (AMA Superbike factory team)
Yoshimura Suzuki Racing (AMA Superbike factory team)
M4 Broaster Chicken Suzuki (AMA Superbike)
Geico Suzuki (AMA Daytona Sportbike)
M4 Broaster Chicken Suzuki (AMA Daytona Sportbike)
Y.E.S. Graves Yamaha (AMA Daytona Sportbike factory team)
Roadrace Factory RedBull Yamaha (AMA Daytona Sportbike team)
At the last AMA round April 20-22 at Road Atlanta, Speedcell took ALL twelve podium positions in the four Superbike/ Daytona Sportbike races. ALL twelve. Why does this matter?....because every battery that has been discussed in this thread is available to the teams, and they all choose Speedcell.
Why else should you choose Speedcell?
We are snowmobilers
We actively support keeping riding areas open. We are currently drafting a corporate policy to divert a percentage of snowmobile battery sales profits to groups that fight land closures
We truly are an American company, building American products--cage code 1VC84
Ask your dealer to carry Speedcell. If they don't, feel free to PM me.
Thanks,
Murph
I have been watching this thread for awhile and formulating a response. I apologize in advance for this being long-winded....
In the interest of full disclosure, I am the Director of Motorsports for Speedcell Technologies we make Lithium batteries for powersport applications.
I want to give you some information so that you can make an informed decision without simply saying we are great and everybody else sucks.
When it comes to Lithium batteries, there is more misinformation out there than legitimate information. Some of it is intentionally misleading, some of it is simply because some of these "battery companies" really don't know what they are doing-- they aren't actually battery companies, they are merely resellers of Chinese made products. Even things that should be straight forward are not always what they appear to be. What is even more disturbing is that some of these "battery companies" actually seem to believe some of their own marketing materials. Speedcell Technologies is the Motorsports division of Navitus. Navitus was started by a veteran (15 year)-- USMC Force Recon. Navitus is a U.S. Department of Energy and US Department of Defense contractor-- cage code 1VC84. Many of you are former or current military and understand the significance of a cage code, this will be pertinent further in the discussion.
Here goes.....
Lithium DOES have limitations in cold weather applications--as does lead acid (what the OEMs use now in their snowmobiles). The strategy that the OEMs use to overcome cold weather performance degradation is capacity. Most OEMs have a "performance envelope" of -30 to +30 degrees. This is why most OEMs batteries are 16 to 20 amp hour even though many people (SnoWesters) will tell you that a 7 amp hour battery will work just fine-- it will as long as it isn't too cold out or the sled was in a trailer or heated garage. Try and start a Nytro that has been outside for a week in -30 temperatures with a 7 amp hour battery and it will prove my point. As a technology platform, lithium can use the same strategy of excess capacity to overcome cold weather performance degradation. Even with excess capacity, the Lithium platform is still smaller and lighter than its lead acid equivalent due to the fact that lithium is more energy dense.
Not all lithium batteries are created equally. A battery's performance is dependent on the quality of cells inside. The cell manufacturers even have different levels of "quality" in the cells they offer. Why does this matter to you, the consumer/ end user? The cell quality typically determines two important factors when it comes to battery "performance"-- 1. starting power ( ability to overcome motor inertia and spin the motor fast enough to fire), 2. Longevity- lithium batteries are susceptible to overdischarge -- even more suseptible to lead acid-- if the individual cells are not balanced properly and one discharges more than the others in a start cycle, the battery can be rendered inoperable. At Speedcell, we use A-grade A123 cells because they are the most energy dense and have the highest quality. Many of our competitors claim to use A123 cells, and some of them do, but they are not the A-grade cells. The reason that I can make this claim is that A123 will not sell A-grade cells to a company that does not have a US government issued cage code. As I stated previously, Speedcell through its parent company Navitus, has a cage code-- 1VC84. Our products are built in our facility in Las Cruces, New Mexico. We supply battery systems to the DoE and the DoD. If you have a custom application or need, we can build a unique solution for you. Call our competitors and tell them that you need a custom battery built for size, layout, capacity, etc-- see what they say. It's real easy to determine who actually is a battery company versus a "battery company" (i.e. reseller of foreign products)
Who uses Speedcell?
Department of Energy
Department of Defense
Monster Energy Graves Yamaha (AMA Superbike factory team)
Yoshimura Suzuki Racing (AMA Superbike factory team)
M4 Broaster Chicken Suzuki (AMA Superbike)
Geico Suzuki (AMA Daytona Sportbike)
M4 Broaster Chicken Suzuki (AMA Daytona Sportbike)
Y.E.S. Graves Yamaha (AMA Daytona Sportbike factory team)
Roadrace Factory RedBull Yamaha (AMA Daytona Sportbike team)
At the last AMA round April 20-22 at Road Atlanta, Speedcell took ALL twelve podium positions in the four Superbike/ Daytona Sportbike races. ALL twelve. Why does this matter?....because every battery that has been discussed in this thread is available to the teams, and they all choose Speedcell.
Why else should you choose Speedcell?
We are snowmobilers
We actively support keeping riding areas open. We are currently drafting a corporate policy to divert a percentage of snowmobile battery sales profits to groups that fight land closures
We truly are an American company, building American products--cage code 1VC84
Ask your dealer to carry Speedcell. If they don't, feel free to PM me.
Thanks,
Murph
S
Super Sled
Well-known member
Thx Murph, that was a great post. How many cells do you recommend be in a lithium battery for sledding (using in extreme cold temps)?
The answer is not so straight forward.
It depends on what you are willing to do in "extreme cold temperatures"
All Speedcell batteries are sold with a dual pole Anderson style quick disconnect SSY connector-- the same connector that we use in our military applications. It is rated up to 100 g's.
If you want the closest thing to a fire and forget, never open your panel to remove battery, you would need a 16 cell.
A 12 cell would be more than sufficient for most people.
I've used the 8 cell Superbike battery in our Pros and even experimented with the four cell Supersport battery.
This is where the end user needs to be honest with themselves in regards to what they are:
1. Willing to do (protocols), i.e. removing battery at night
2. Willing to accept, if they forget what they said they were willing to do.
The most difficult time to start a sled is in the morning when the motor is cold soaked, especially if it has been left out for days. With the Pro's, we all have it easy because we have a pull start that we can use if we forget to follow the protocols for the 8 or 12 cell batteries in extreme cold. Once the sled has been fired, and ridden, the restart is pretty easy-- especially with stock heads at elevation.
We are currently building a Pro RMK specific sub harness that will replace the stock battery leads. Hope to have that ready by the end of July.
It depends on what you are willing to do in "extreme cold temperatures"
All Speedcell batteries are sold with a dual pole Anderson style quick disconnect SSY connector-- the same connector that we use in our military applications. It is rated up to 100 g's.
If you want the closest thing to a fire and forget, never open your panel to remove battery, you would need a 16 cell.
A 12 cell would be more than sufficient for most people.
I've used the 8 cell Superbike battery in our Pros and even experimented with the four cell Supersport battery.
This is where the end user needs to be honest with themselves in regards to what they are:
1. Willing to do (protocols), i.e. removing battery at night
2. Willing to accept, if they forget what they said they were willing to do.
The most difficult time to start a sled is in the morning when the motor is cold soaked, especially if it has been left out for days. With the Pro's, we all have it easy because we have a pull start that we can use if we forget to follow the protocols for the 8 or 12 cell batteries in extreme cold. Once the sled has been fired, and ridden, the restart is pretty easy-- especially with stock heads at elevation.
We are currently building a Pro RMK specific sub harness that will replace the stock battery leads. Hope to have that ready by the end of July.
when you do murph, let me know..gonna need two for the new 13's coming....
Not that its that big of a deal when your spending thousands on a sled but whats the price difference in these batteries?
good info. i am interested in your product because i sell both shorai and ballistic at a retail level. When you speak of different grades in cells, do you know what grades the shorai and ballistic use? It seems of the batteries i have sold, they seem to be kinda finiky compared to an agm and is that because of cell quality? awesome idea and i aplaude your company driving the market segment. i too would like some pricing information.
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I use Shorai. Have 3 of them in 3 different sleds. They are the same size as the stock battery so the fit is easy. They work at least as well as the stock lead acid batteries and weigh 2.5lbs. When you first handle the battery it appears to be an empty case. Starts EVERY time. These are all on ETECs and the ETEC takes a lot more force to turn over than a Pro. The high pressure injectors need a lot of electricity to fire and the stator on them is really high output and hard to spin. I did not have to start the sleds in any kind of extreme conditions this year. Cost was about $200 each.
That said I am interested in the Speedcell batteries. Murph could you post a link or pics and prices of your batteries?
That said I am interested in the Speedcell batteries. Murph could you post a link or pics and prices of your batteries?
Will do. We have been holding off entering the snowmobile market because we want to do it right.
We are working on a few new products that we will release during the summer to get in the hands of end users by fall... Before the snow starts falling.
I will post on SW when we are ready to unveil.
Murph
